Do you believe in evolution?
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fluxlizard
Avid Member
What makes you think it has?
Just look at people from different parts of the world- they look different!
Africans (the original "locale" of humans) have dark skin to protect them from too much uv from the sun. Europeans (hypomelanistic?) evolved pale skin to allow more uvb through the skin so they could make vitamin D. This was necessary because far less uv is present in sunlight farther from the equator and dark skin would not allow enough through for manufacture of sufficient vitamin D. Without this evolutionary adaptation, they could not get enough d from sunlight for survival and reproduction. Humans can get it from diet, but before mass production of foodstuffs, vitamin d rich foods were hard to come by in wild europe.
So there is an example of evolution in humans you can see easily with your own eyes.
That's like saying we have mice and rats and nothing in between and none are changing. Personally I think we are the "naked mole rats" of the ape world and we probably look bizzare and gross to the other apes, just like naked mole rats and hairless cats and rats look bizzare and gross to me! Bits of hair here and there- LOL.
But here you go LOL-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxDI3s21yf8&feature=related
And here you go-
http://www.livingcosmos.com/evolution.htm
The fun part of this second one- the earth may be in for some more rapid evolution/ mass extinction soon...
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Here is some interesting reading involving something we should all be familiar with:
http://www.genomeweb.com/blog/evolution-fruit-fly-evolution-human
http://www.exploratorium.edu/exhibits/mutant_flies/mutant_flies.html
Easy to see evolution at work when generations are only a few weeks long. Hard to see it when generations span centuries in species like us that don't have any predators or survival hardships or natural selection happening at all to guide our gene pool.
http://www.genomeweb.com/blog/evolution-fruit-fly-evolution-human
http://www.exploratorium.edu/exhibits/mutant_flies/mutant_flies.html
Easy to see evolution at work when generations are only a few weeks long. Hard to see it when generations span centuries in species like us that don't have any predators or survival hardships or natural selection happening at all to guide our gene pool.
Olimpia
Biologist & Ecologist
Obviously there need to be strong pressures to change drastically from one species to another, and we haven't had to experience that yet as humans. We've seen animals change spit off into two different subspecies or ring species and gain a noticable genetic difference, but we haven't had time to see a lizard become a bird or something like that. That would just be asking for a million different changes in a short time frame.
My favorite example of people continuing to change is the HIV immunity present in Northern European people. They naturally had a mutation present that makes it harder for them to get HIV, a trait that they pass on every time they have kids. This is evolution at work - an adaptation that is small but useful gets passed along, until nearly everyone in the future has the same adaptation. I wish I hadnt just packed up my text books or I would quote the exact gene name(s) that account for this. And we would not be the only species that looks similar to us if our bretheren subspecies of homonid had not died out over time. It's just our luck that we were the species to survive in the long run, but we weren't the only species that looks like us more than they look like apes.
Another huge point for me is that creatures don't lose the genetic information of who they were millions of years ago. Those genes just get turned off and replaced with other things, but they stay there in the records, so to speak. So we can literally take a chick embyo, play around with turning things on and off and turn on scales, teeth, and long tails. That is fascinating! Why would a chicken have all the necesary genes to become a reptile if it hadn't been one at some point? You can't turn on scales in our skin because out skin cells were not scales at one point nor are they scales changed over time to become feathers.
Also, I have an issue with the perfect world idea. It only looks perfect because everything has had such a long time to work out the kinks, and weed out most of the things that don't work or don't make sense. But the world is full of quirky examples of engineering gone awry, like in the digestive tract of rabbits for example. They can't trully digest their food until it passes through their gut, is pooped out, and then reingested to get all the nutrients in the poop that were fermented at the very end of the rabbit's GI tract. What?! LOL Anyone can agree that this is not efficient nor very practical, and no one in their right mind would call this a perfect system. I certainly don't want to ruin anyone's awe of the world, of course, but it's not nearly as flawless as it appears at first glance.
And now, for fun, I'm going to link to one of my favorite critters since I started studying things with a microscope. Say hello to the adorable
(and freaking amazing! Who says that we're the pinacle of evolution?) little water bear: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XOxXHJGKsYI
My favorite example of people continuing to change is the HIV immunity present in Northern European people. They naturally had a mutation present that makes it harder for them to get HIV, a trait that they pass on every time they have kids. This is evolution at work - an adaptation that is small but useful gets passed along, until nearly everyone in the future has the same adaptation. I wish I hadnt just packed up my text books or I would quote the exact gene name(s) that account for this. And we would not be the only species that looks similar to us if our bretheren subspecies of homonid had not died out over time. It's just our luck that we were the species to survive in the long run, but we weren't the only species that looks like us more than they look like apes.
Another huge point for me is that creatures don't lose the genetic information of who they were millions of years ago. Those genes just get turned off and replaced with other things, but they stay there in the records, so to speak. So we can literally take a chick embyo, play around with turning things on and off and turn on scales, teeth, and long tails. That is fascinating! Why would a chicken have all the necesary genes to become a reptile if it hadn't been one at some point? You can't turn on scales in our skin because out skin cells were not scales at one point nor are they scales changed over time to become feathers.
Also, I have an issue with the perfect world idea. It only looks perfect because everything has had such a long time to work out the kinks, and weed out most of the things that don't work or don't make sense. But the world is full of quirky examples of engineering gone awry, like in the digestive tract of rabbits for example. They can't trully digest their food until it passes through their gut, is pooped out, and then reingested to get all the nutrients in the poop that were fermented at the very end of the rabbit's GI tract. What?! LOL Anyone can agree that this is not efficient nor very practical, and no one in their right mind would call this a perfect system. I certainly don't want to ruin anyone's awe of the world, of course, but it's not nearly as flawless as it appears at first glance.
And now, for fun, I'm going to link to one of my favorite critters since I started studying things with a microscope. Say hello to the adorable
(and freaking amazing! Who says that we're the pinacle of evolution?) little water bear: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XOxXHJGKsYIprimestick
New Member
Thos videos prove nothing.... One is a simple bell shaped curve, A color morph isnt an evloutionary event. The genes for the base collor will continue to reappear on a regular basis, if not most of the time. The platipus video was chock full of "I THINK" and its "GUESSD" so its all bull in my book. Evolution has no ground to stand on. I will never beleive untill some one can bring me someting that has evolved. Also we didnt come from no damn fish.
primestick
New Member
Thats incorrect the original "locale" is the middle east... this is accepted by christians and "brainyaks" alike.
fluxlizard
Avid Member
My understanding is that you are incorrect. Middle africa is thought to be the point of origin. The few humans that left Africa and populated the entire rest of the world started by leaving Africa and entering the middle east. Those few humans spread out from there. Because of this, there is larger genetic difference sometimes in a single village in africa than there is any other two people in the entire world- for example chinese and europeans are more closely related when their dna is examined than two africans may be that live just several miles apart. This is exactly because only a few left africa for the middle east and from there the rest of the world.
SweetObsolete
New Member
Yes, I most certainly believe in evolution. There is actual a ton of proof about it, ranging from fossils, genetic selection, social research studies, to carefully thought out theories (with evidence backing them up).
I think a common misconception though is that evolution is deliberate. Evolution happens through random mutation, very slowly. It can be sped along with artificial selection (I have personally made bacteria "evolve" in a class to be immune to certain anti-biotics). Also, we did not evolve from monkeys. Humans, chimps, and bonobos evolved from a common ancestor. That's also something that I don't think most people really understand.
Frankly, to not believe in evolution if you have studied it at all would be absurd. I have to assume that people who claim it doesn't exist haven't thoroughly studied/researched the subject.
I could honestly go on about this forever.
I think a common misconception though is that evolution is deliberate. Evolution happens through random mutation, very slowly. It can be sped along with artificial selection (I have personally made bacteria "evolve" in a class to be immune to certain anti-biotics). Also, we did not evolve from monkeys. Humans, chimps, and bonobos evolved from a common ancestor. That's also something that I don't think most people really understand.
Frankly, to not believe in evolution if you have studied it at all would be absurd. I have to assume that people who claim it doesn't exist haven't thoroughly studied/researched the subject.
I could honestly go on about this forever.
jojackson
New Member
Olympia, This is because you are looking at it in a biased manner, via your own perpective,
its 'perfect' for the rabbit! Both efficient and practical since by this means it survives on the diet avail to it, the diet it has evolved this adaption for.
This is perfection, even if you think it could be done better! LOL
You might want to reassess that primestick, here are two examples you can see and touch that have evolved, and rapidly too!
On the contrary...Evolution at speed in todays world.
http://fauceir.wordpress.com/2010/04...ard-evolution/
http://www.canetoadsinoz.com/evoluti...canetoads.html
SweetObsolete, see links above, also pg #4
primestick
New Member
Error 404 - Not Found and No Such URL at This Domain
evolution must be fake cant even find it on the net...
Cainschams
New Member
JFC, I so want to reply to this thread in more detail but I have to refrain because of site policy. Biting tongue so hard it might have to be sewn back together
primestick
New Member
Personally I don’t think post threads like this should be allowed to exist. All they do is separate the community down the lines of belief. Evolution is still a Hypothesis and Christianity is a faith. Apparently people that are open minded are too close minded to leave Christians or whatever religion you have alone. I have been a Christian all my life and I have always disliked the views of other Christians that think they must impose their belief on others. The same goes for all the evolution people, always telling me I’m ignorant for not “Believing” in evolution. I think any one that wants to impose views on other people is ignorant and closed minded. I am the most open minded person I have meet. I like the lets agree to disagree. We all are here for a common reason CHAMELEONS, why are we arguing or trying to disprove others beliefs. So I think God made the earth you thing random shit in space ran into each other and we came about 1,000,000,000,000,000 years later… who cares… WE HAVE CHAMELEONS doesn’t matter how we believe they got here just spend time taking care of them and posting pics of their AWESOMENESS. This thread should be closed in my opinion and banned from reposting anything like it.
jojackson
New Member
Prime, try the original links on page 4, must've messed the links due cut n pasting of shortened text display.
p.s. we 'evolution people' dont all share the same veiws either, neither do we all give religious beleif a hard time.
If you feel unable to contribute in an adult manner, simply dont, but dont take it apon yourself to deny others the opportunity to share ideas.
Cainschams, ive been sucked in to this one myself, please share your thoughts, just take a deep breath first and remember not everyone thinks like you. Id love to hear your thoughts mate...
p.s. we 'evolution people' dont all share the same veiws either, neither do we all give religious beleif a hard time.
If you feel unable to contribute in an adult manner, simply dont, but dont take it apon yourself to deny others the opportunity to share ideas.
Cainschams, ive been sucked in to this one myself, please share your thoughts, just take a deep breath first and remember not everyone thinks like you. Id love to hear your thoughts mate...
primestick
New Member
Prime, try the original links on page 4, must've messed the links due cut n pasting of shortened text display.
Cainschams, ive been sucked in to this one myself, please share your thoughts, just take a deep breath first and remember not everyone thinks like you. Id love to hear your thoughts mate...
I've read all about evolution and know it well. Im a sophmore working on a biology major. I think that adaptation is possiable and evoulution on small scale might happen... but I dont beleive that evolution has taken place on such a large scale as to create us humans that have language and the knowledge to make chameleonforums.com and talk about where we came from.
Dupontman2
New Member
AMEN Brother, I am with you on this! Why cant we all just get along!! I know, I stole the quote!!
jojackson
New Member
As far as I can see here, we are all getting along, nobody seems upset by others veiws excepting those who have not expressed theirs by choice.
Im not sure I understand this mate, can you elaborate please? Your thoughts are just as interesting to us as anyone elses, can you explain why you accept evolution on 'a small scale' ?
Im not sure I understand this mate, can you elaborate please? Your thoughts are just as interesting to us as anyone elses, can you explain why you accept evolution on 'a small scale' ?