Dirt floor cage

[Shaggz]

Hello everyone, this is not only my first post but also my first chameleon to own. I haven't received the little guy yet because I'm still getting the pieces for my small/sun bath cage but I'm already looking toward the future of my big cage. I know a carpenter and I'll be getting one built so I can have the perfect dimensions for my home. I was wondering if there's a way to have soil at the bottom of the cage and have plants growing in it,with a drainage setup and rocks covering the top? I was thinking the chameleon poo would fertilize, the mist system would water, the soil would keep up the humidity, the drainage would keep from over watering, and the look would be pretty cool. I've read that no substrates should be used with a panther chameleon other than a paper towel but is this the same thing? Is this a good idea or is reality going to kick in?

 

[Boldie]

You will get a lot of people saying using substrate is a big no no but I have been using it for about a year now, with no problems. I do clean the pop out whenever I see some though and do a full clean out when ever he sheds, replacing the substrate. This just keeps it fresh and tidy and stops any bacteria build up. As I have a glass exo terra I have my substrate on top of a layer of clay balls and use a tube to syphon any excess water build up before it contacts the substrate.

Sent from my Lumia 800 using Board Express

 

[SaintJimmy]

Yeah usually I'd say no on the dirt.. I'm still gonna say no.

But I mean, as long as your cham doesn't wander around the bottom constantly and eat the dirt.. Actually as long as they don't eat the dirt period they're good.

 

[Tay And A]

I would really recommend not having substrate. Chams can accidently swallow the dirt instead of their food. They can get an enormous amount of problems from doing so. :\

 

[bradley]

You could do as you want and place large stones over all the dirt so nothing can be eaten accidentally.

 

[Julija]

I would say, it depends on how you feed your chameleon. If you let the feeders out for your cham to run around and hunt them, then substrate is not a good idea, because it can be accidentally ingested with a feeder, which can lead to impaction. Impactions are dangerous and can be deadly.

However if you cup-feed or hand-feed than I don't think substrate is a problem. As long as there is enough space and branches to roam around in the upper part of the enclosure, chameleon has no reason to go down where the substrate is.

I have been keeping my cham in a terrarium with coconut substrate for a year and a half and have not had any problems. However, I do hand-feed exclusively.

Also, I agree with Bradley - you can just cover substrate with stones. To sum it up, better save than sorry in this case.

Hope this helps
Julija

 

[Kate]

Because of the constant dampness it could get mouldy and grow bacteria which will cause its own problems. I had substrate for a long time and it didn't always dry out between misting. There was always an area in a back corner that didn't always stay fresh. By using paper towel it can be changed easily and often.

 

[szpond]

Because of the constant dampness it could get mouldy and grow bacteria which will cause its own problems. I had substrate for a long time and it didn't always dry out between misting. There was always an area in a back corner that didn't always stay fresh. By using paper towel it can be changed easily and often.

Very similar to what I was going to say! I love paper towel nowadays. I don't know why I ever dealt with substrate.

What a lot of people do is that they'll use potted plants with a non-toxic soil with rocks (too big to be eaten accidentally) covering the soil. It looks really cool too. Then just put paper towel on the actual bottom of the cage.

My new enclosure will have a screened bottom, so I'm going to do some experimenting with this and see what kind of drainage system I can get together. Only 2 more sides of the enclosure need to be screened up, then it'll be done!

 

[Shaggz]

I will have a drainage system on the bottom and the heat lamps and air so I'm thinking it won't get too damp. And I'm basically wanting to make the entire bottom of my cage a planter pot with several plants growing in it. There will be plenty of branches and vines and I was really wanting to have a free roam feeding with the crickets coming from the eco terre feeding rock set up high on a piece of grapewood but if i have to choose I'll make one of those hanging feeder cups that the crickets can climb up. Also why I'm here on the cage forum could I get some feed back on my temp cage. Its just for him while he's a little guy and will be used for sun bathing. And how do you post pics haha.

 

[Olimpia]

If you do it properly, it could work out very nicely.

I'm not on the anti-substrate camp, as I think it's a weird inconsistency to recommend that owners keep a big tub of soil/sand in with females for egg laying but then require all the plant pots to be covered in stones. (And if you don't think your females are eating mouthfuls of the stuff to taste the suitability of the egg-laying medium, you're kidding yourself! )

If your drainage is good, you add earthworms and other housekeeping bugs to keep the soil moving and healthy, and cover the surface of the soil I don't see any problem. I do highly recommend bugs in your soil, as it will keep it oxygenated and make a big difference in how it holds up - I put them in all my terrariums and it really keeps everything from getting stale. Also, depending on how long/often you mist you may not have soggy soil, if you'll just have to play with how long you need to mist for your chameleon's health and then zupplement directly on the plants if it's not enough. But that might mean that you water only once or twice a week and the soil maintains a healthy water content the rest of the week vs. being drenched all the time.

 

[Shaggz]

Thanks for the bug tip olimpia what kind do you suggest?

 

[Ferrah88]

Thanks for the bug tip olimpia what kind do you suggest?

I have substrate in Marimo's cage without any problems. (Of course, I do have drainage with extra precautionary screen covering the holes so bugs don#t escape....)

I use the following:

Earthworms to "renew" the dirt and eat some of the poop and dead leaves.
Springtails to eat the dead leaves that the worms don't fancy
Woodlice (I only have a couple) for variety.

I'm not sure if there's anything else, but these are ones that have been keeping my terrarium nice and clean and living I would certainly recommend the worms and springtails though, they seem to work best!

 

[Olimpia]

Ditto what Ferrah said! At the very least do earthworms if that's the only thing you can find/order, but having some fauna in the soil will keep it healthy and clean.