Chamaeleo Senegalensis Information?

[luevelvet]

Chamaeleo Senegalensis Experiences?

Hey Everyone,

I will apologize in advance for the long post...

I came across a very healthy juvenile Senegalensis at a local shop and have fallen absolutely in love with her. She’s approximately 3" SVL, maybe 4-5 with the tail. She's very clean looking with exception to a couple of small blemishes that looks very much like they will be gone during the next few sheds. I've seen her at the shop for the last two weeks, the last time being yesterday. She looked very comfortable, a bright green, and was actually hanging out in the open this week. She hasn't lost any weight in the two weeks they've had her and they claim that she eats like a champ.

Well, as I mentioned before, this little girl stole my heart and I've already made plans to purchase her. But, like any responsible chameleon keeper, I thought I would ask around before actually buying her to make sure I know what I'm in for. Based on the blemishes and the past history of this species, I'm almost 100% she’s WC, though by looking at her, you wouldn't necessarily think so. She’s very clean.

As a frame of reference for where I'm coming from, I've read almost all there is to be read online; including Kristina's article on Chameleon News (I don't know how this community can thank her enough). My intention is to start with one, get to know the species and it's quirks with a long term goal of acquiring a partner and researching its reproductive behaviors and breeding details. I'm not convinced that this hasn't been done already, but based on the lack of information online, it's not diversely documented. I intend to document all of my research and findings publicly so every can enjoy these humble and adorable creatures and maybe one day lessen the numbers that come from the wild.

With all of that being said, here is what I know so far:

Melle the Meller's has just moved into his free range setup (pics later) and I now have his old place up for rent. It's 18x18x36 and heavily planted.

Reptisun 5.0 of course, with a 60 watt basking lamp.

Automatic mister set to mist three times per day lasting ten minutes each session.

I hear they can handle temperature ranges from 76 - 96.

That's about all I have found of actual husbandry guidelines for them. I'm thinking that perhaps there isn't much difference between them and many of the rules of thumb for keeping chameleons, with exception to the importance of a heavy foliage and cover.

Now for the questions...I figured I would ask the advice of others who have cared for them long term.

Temperature and Humidity
What is the optimal temperature range for these guys? 76-96 is a wide range and I will keep good documentation to see which she prefers the most. Also, I can't imagine the mister not providing enough humidity throughout the day, but I can't find any specific info on their preferences so I thought I would ask, do they require specific humidity levels?

Breeding
I can't seem to find much, other than Kristina's article that mentions to much about breeding. Anyone have any info on this topic in regards to Senegalensis?

Please feel free to provide your thoughts, advice, criticisms etc as you wish in this thread. Any discussions regarding this species can be helpful moving forward.

On a side note, this potential project has reignited the idea to develop research tracking software to maintain easy to input and easy to review records of what's happening during the project. Hopefully I wll have something up in the next few months, we're still in the design phase.

If you've made it this far, thank you! I hope everyone who knows anything about this species will chime in a let it be known. For now, wish me luck and I will most certainly keep everyone updated.

Thanks,

Luis

 

[kinyonga]

I haave kept quite a few Senegals over the years but never bred them or hatched the eggs.

I keep the basking temperature in the 80 to 85F range. The rest of the cage varies depending on the season...but it would be 76 ish in the winter and could go as high as 95F in the summer. IMHO its better that they aren't kept at the high end of the range for too long.

You said..."I can't imagine the mister not providing enough humidity throughout the day, but I can't find any specific info on their preferences so I thought I would ask, do they require specific humidity levels?"...in my experience humidity can be somewhat lower as long as they get the opportunity to drink well every day. They do need to drink a lot.

Once acclimated they don't seem to be any more difficult than veileds or panthers.

 

[luevelvet]

Great, thanks for the reply. I should've added the question of how to sex them. Is there any sure way of telling other than hemipenal bulges?

Thanks again,

Luis

 

[kinyonga]

Males are sort of slimmer and females have a somewhat plumper shape....but its not always easy to tell that way. Its relatively easy to see the difference in the tailbase/hemipene area. Sorry that's not much help.

 

[chamelisa]

A chameleon often overlooked

Great, thanks for the reply. I should've added the question of how to sex them. Is there any sure way of telling other than hemipenal bulges?

Thanks again,

Luis

I found this for you:

http://members.tripod.com/noimports/id23.htm

There is disturbing content but it is important for everyone to understand what imports go through.

Males will have a hemipenal bulge. Adult females tend to be larger than the males. They are scary when not receptive too. I had two males and neither of them had what it takes to breed with the females I had. It states that they may or may not have tarsal spurs but I remember my two males having them.

They are very nice chameleons. If I can find some photos in my archives, I'll post them here. They had soft pastel patterns when the humidity was just right. I named one Limon. She had a bunch of subcutaneous nematodes which were interesting to have removed. Gross, but interesting no less.

Added: I forgot to mention that only one female came in gravid. She laid her eggs. I believe it was 38 and 3 were infertile. The 35 hatched but didn't survive very long. I will try finding my notes but since that time there have been a couple of computer crashes. So my notes are on CDs and it will take time to locate the photos and notes on this species. I'm sorry.

 

[kinyonga]

Senegals don't have tarsal spurs. Gracefuls that look somewhat like Senegals can have spurs.

 

[luevelvet]

I've also read that color can be an indication of gender, but I've also read otherwise. Do males stay as nice bright green as the females supposedly do, or do they tend to stay brown/gray, per the adcham site?

Thanks again,

Luis

 

[chamelisa]

Senegals don't have tarsal spurs. Gracefuls that look somewhat like Senegals can have spurs.

Probably so. I only kept 8 and that was a while ago. I'm sure they were senegalensis though as they were IDed by others as senegalensis. So I must be remembering incorrectly about the tarsal spurs.

My apologies!

 

[jones5233]

I have a senegal now. here is a good website for some info on them.
http://chameleonnews.com/?page=article&id=164

 

[luevelvet]

Jones5233,

That's the best article I've found on them yet, and the one of the only articles online to boot. I ordered a copy of every available Chameleon Magazine being sold through here, so hopefully they will have something to offer.

All of my research begs the question, has anyone documented any successful hatching and/or rearing of the neonates? If so, does anyone know where I can find any notes or websites relating to these successes?

I know Senegal's aren't the most popular or ornate of species but it seems like there's a lot of research to be done.

Thanks again everyone. I truly appreciate the responses.

Luis

 

[laurie]

I kept 3 of them for about a year. Never have any luck breeding. My guess was I had 2 males and 1 female, but none every wanted to be friends. All were easy to care for after I did a course of panacur for parasites that I assumed they came in with. I lost one of the males and never knew why. One morning he was just dead. The day before he seemed fine. That upset me so I sent one to my sister, 2 years later she still has him, sold the other one to a kid about 100 miles away. Still see the guy and he is in love with "Lucy", even kept my name for her. Lucy will not JUMP several inches into the guy( I am awful at names) hand when he opens the door. I didn't beleive it till I saw her do it. She was never that friendly with me. She is also doing great.

I used the same basic care as I do for my panthers and veileds. Sorry I can't be more help. Good luck.

 

[luevelvet]

We're actually excited to witness this behavior with them as well. Based on Kristina's article, I thought it was a fun little perk about their personalities and the more I read and hear stories the more they seem like the exception to the rule in regards to handling. I just called the shop and asked them hold the one they have. Pictures will surely follow this evening as well as an appointment with Dr. Alfonso for some fecal samples.

Thanks everyone. Keep the comments coming!

Luis

 

[luevelvet]

She's Here!

So I picked her up yesterday. I think it's a she based on her slightly plump belly and lack of hemipenies, though she may not be old enough for that indicator. She's very comfortable around people, rarely shying away when approached and even ate like a champ right from my fingers. She seemed to enjoy the mister and drank a good deal before the lights went out.

Here are some first day pics. As I mentioned before, she has a few blemishes but nothing that doesn't look like it will go away on it's own. I haven't had time today to call into Dr. Alfonso to schedule a fecal float, but that's next. Oh and she weighs a whooping 8.3 grams!

Now on with the pictures...

 

[jones5233]

she looks to be very healthy through the picks. I think i even c in the fourth one her content cheverons (light blue ones rinning across the back).

 

[luevelvet]

Just wanted to post an update.

Simone has adapted very well and is eating like a champ. Shes grown a gram or two in the past two weeks and is starting very confident of her suroundings. I've noticed shes definitely on a schedule and falls into routines our mellers hasn't displayed as much. She's usually waiting for me to feed her at her cage door around the same time every day and she certainly doesn't over eat. She knows her limits. She will refuse any more than 4 items in any one sitting and only when enough times goes by will she show any interest, if at all the same day.

Well, so far, that's it. shes looking good, eating good and looks to be as strong as can be. I'll be waiting a little while longer before I acquire a male, since I'll have my hands full with some quadricornis that will be on their way shortly.

On with the Pics!

 

[chamelisa]

What are her favorite feeders?

 

[luevelvet]

She was onto small crickets early on, but quickly took to small dubia's. She went after one silk worm with much reluctance and hasn't shown much interest since. She *really* likes those roaches, about 3-5 .5" ones a day.

 

[luevelvet]

New Skin = New Pics!

So Simone shed last week so I thought I would post the dramatic difference in her new look. She's almost a day glow green. I'm still on the look out for a few more to start my project with but patience is certainly a virtue with what I saw at the last reptile show....

At any rate. I think she's entering her 6th month based on the chart that Kristina had posted on the Chameleon News site. Last week she was 10grams and eating roughly 6-8 small 1/2" roaches but suddenly shes increased her intake to astonishing 12-20 food items per day. Shes takes anything I hol in front of her and comes back for more. I'm actually surprised she can fit so much inside of her!

Ok, on with the pics!

Luis

 

[Jakedn]

Wow, that is truly a huge difference. She's one gorgeous chameleon too .

 

[kinyonga]

Not so sure its a "she".