Bump in the Corner of Young Chameleon's Eye

[LizardLurkin]

Yeah, that's the feeling I got from the repti turtle drops. My usual vet wasn't in yesterday who seems like they have more experience with chameleons. I also felt that it would be odd for him to still struggle with a vitamin A issue after I've been supplementing him for the months I've had him I hope I can have such a conversation over the phone because it's a 5 hour round trip and I hate for him to be away from his comfort zone for so long.

As for the misting, in the mornings it does take him a bit to wake up and start exploring. I'll have it go an extra 15 minutes later, to see if that will help. He is a clever little boy, though. He has learned the mister's blind spot and usually retreats there after a minute and a half of being like "Oh crap! Water!!!"
For both the morning and the evening, I have the mister go off for 4 and a half minutes.

 

[LizardLurkin]

I know, at the vet, they look into his mouth, squish around the lump, that sort of thing as a means of identifying infection. I do wonder if they'd give a test run of an oral antibiotic despite not finding anything immediately concerning in those checkups. Like, if they'll only prescribe something if infection were to become more apparent.

 

[LizardLurkin]

I got a call in and I'm a bit at a loss. The vet is confident in the drops and told me that they don't really make oral antibiotics for chameleons, but I know that's not true...But I also felt too sheepish to argue my case against a professional. They aren't the previous vet who I saw the last three times, maybe not a resident reptile vet either.

The prescribed medication is neomycin topical ointment. I see it is an antibiotic.
I used it before his eye was successfully flushed a couple months ago, and for a week after.
...But I am currently unsure how much it's helped, ultimately, if the squishy swelling ended up coming back.
;-; It's a little discouraging to make the long trip to the vet, on top of the payment of course, and come back with more questions than answers.

 

[Gloriawood]

Awww poor spooble! I really don’t have much advice, but if you feel a rinse would help his eye, I have used plain saline eye rinse and slowly dropped it in my noodle’s eye before. It seemed to help him a bit, but his eye was just a bit irritated. I know the antibiotics thing is not true, I have been given oral antibiotics for my guy before sooooo I’m not sure where the vet came up with that….. do you know when your normal vet will be back?

 

[Beman]

You need another vet... Switch up the misting schedule for when he is actually up and moving around. Mistking is so fine that even if they retreat they are going to get some mist regardless hopefully he will be triggered to clean it.

Never be afraid of standing your ground with a Vet. The truth is most of them have book knowledge of chameleons. Very few have real hands on experience with doing daily correct husbandry. And a lot will utilize care that would be for another reptile for a chameleon which would not apply because they just do not have the experience of treating. This is why we see incorrect information in threads where someone has taken their cham to the vet and they suggest to soak it, or use a heat lamp at night, or even to give a vitamin A shot when the cham is already being supplemented. All of these are incorrect for a chameleon. So yes when you are newer standing your ground can be more difficult just remember even at this stage of growth in the hobby you know more about husbandry than they do.

 

[LizardLurkin]

Honestly, I didn't even consider that I'd potentially be hooked up with another vet when setting up the appointment. From here on, I'll be careful to ask for my previous vet by name. With exotics, it is a mixed bag. I felt comfortable enough with my regular vet because she was checking out things I knew she should check around for, and was very aware of their temperaments and quirks, knowing of these forums, just surprisingly specific things like that. I don't think there's a chance for a true expert in state, but this visit threw me for a loop
I have kept his misting schedule as it was, with sessions going on as he's awake. It's good to know he isn't defeating the purpose of this schedule by finding the blind spot. I will give the saline rinse a try after finishing off the neomycin treatment, because I don't want to rinse the good qualities of the medication away.
They said reptiles take a while to heal, and to come back in a month, but earlier if the condition worsens. I'm always keeping a close eye on him with the wyze cham, general medical interaction aside. I will be keeping this thread updated as I figure out just what's going on here. I know eye issues are very complex, and I've seen so-so many things it could be, so I wanna help by giving any amount of information I can out of this experience, whether it be a solution or trial and error.

 

[MissSkittles]

Your regular vet might want to think about consulting with other vets, who may have more knowledge or experience with chameleons. While there may not be one in Alaska, there’s plenty of ways to communicate with one elsewhere.

 

[LizardLurkin]

This is true!
I'm not sure how that'd work. Should I recommend any names in particular? Or just mention the idea and see what she comes up with?

 

[MissSkittles]

This is true!
I'm not sure how that'd work. Should I recommend any names in particular? Or just mention the idea and see what she comes up with?

She might know someone, or you could look at the vet list. Not on the list for some unknown reason is Dr Dayna of https://www.auroraanimalhospital.com/staff/dr-dayna-willems who is a moderator here. She might be a good vet to consult.

 

[LizardLurkin]

Wow, that's a good idea.
I don't think I could ever make it to this place as it's a 7-9 hours drive one way but I'll definitely drop her name and contact info + pics of Spooble's eye at my next visit and discuss the possibility of consulting with her.
That's super cool, though, I had no idea there was a mod in state let alone one who is a veterinarian.

 

[LizardLurkin]

I found this video today, and I think this very likely has to be the answer to Spooble's troubles.

I can't quite articulate it, but, when he looks off to the side, it's like more of a mass of sorts gets revealed that is tucked away in the corner usually.

When they did the flush initially that released the plug, I was setting up an appointment for the eye to get lanced and drained, but the plug came out, so we thought "Wow! That solves that!"
Perhaps it was not originally an abscess, but became that way over time? Bad luck? Or maybe it was an abscess and the debris that came out was a red herring...
I'm gonna see about setting up this procedure with my usual vet, and keeping this thread up to date for all future puffy-eye cham havers.

 

[MissSkittles]

I don’t know if that was a true abscess, but whatever it was, it certainly was huge and maybe too big to come out on its own.

 

[LizardLurkin]

I don’t know if that was a true abscess, but whatever it was, it certainly was huge and maybe too big to come out on its own.

It's befuddling. I've been digging back through ages old threads of similar afflictions and the authors usually sort of vanish completely without a conclusion, so I'm not sure if I'm on the right track
Here's hoping, whatever he's put through next, makes him work harder at keeping the eye clean so there's no more repeats

 

[LizardLurkin]

Spooble has an appointment on the vet office's surgery day on Thursday. They're going to hold him for some hours and figure out what to do to it in that time frame.
Currently, the bump just becomes more noticeable with time.
I will highly suggest lancing it, and bring up oral antibiotics to my usual vet. (I'm not even sure topical ointment would be advisable for the lance operation, but I could be wrong.)
I'll post here how it goes.

I'm still applying the ointment if only in hopes that, if it is an infection, that maybe it'll stop it from getting worse. I do worry about him gaining resistance to it, but I am unsure what else I can do in the meantime. Currently, he is very active, hydrated, eating regularly, so I feel that he must be doing okay, obstruction aside.

 

[ehdee6]

I hope it goes well and little Spooble gets better. Did you request your preferred vet? If you have to speak up/stand up and make informed decisions and suggestions for him, don't feel bad about it.

 

[LizardLurkin]

Yes, I mentioned my preferred vet by name, and I know she's working that day.
I'm gonna go there with a few notes of discussion, namely mentioning Dr Dayna, and oral antibiotics being, well, a thing that actually exists and is also the standard for lancing operations.

I really, really hope she knows what to do instead of being "see how it goes" about it, too. I'm so nervous that it might become clear that she is also on a similar level of chameleon knowledge as the vet I saw recently, and things won't actually go anywhere But... She was already willing to poke around his eye before the last plug came out.
I like to worry.

 

[MissSkittles]

Yes, I mentioned my preferred vet by name, and I know she's working that day.
I'm gonna go there with a few notes of discussion, namely mentioning Dr Dayna, and oral antibiotics being, well, a thing that actually exists and is also the standard for lancing operations.

I really, really hope she knows what to do instead of being "see how it goes" about it, too. I'm so nervous that it might become clear that she is also on a similar level of chameleon knowledge as the vet I saw recently, and things won't actually go anywhere But... She was already willing to poke around his eye before the last plug came out.
I like to worry.

Sometimes it presents a dilemma in going to a vet that doesn’t have a great deal of knowledge or experience with chameleons. We always want the best for our beauties, but we also have the opportunity to possibly encourage and even help guide a vet to becoming experienced and knowledgeable. We can send them to either Chameleon Academy or Neptune’s videos to learn correct husbandry and there are several vets who they may be able to get a bit of help or guidance from. *I would hope that vets help each other and share their knowledge, and are able to spare the time, but asking can’t hurt. Some vets have literally written the books about chameleons - Dr Mader (now retired), Dr Divers, Chris Anderson, Dr Greek, and I don’t even know who else. Then Petr Necas has posted various videos of some interesting things that might help a vet. There’s also Dr Askew, whose video you found. Anyhow, I am rooting for a permanent solution for your sweeties eye.

 

[ehdee6]

I hope everything went ok today. Sending positive thoughts to you and spoobl(i)e boy!

Sorry I always see spooble and my mind goes to Scooby Doo.... How did you find his name?

 

[LizardLurkin]

Finally got home, let's see if I can summarize things well enough.

The vet poked around in his eye, digging out debris. This is what came out today. i asked her for a photo, but actually got a souvenir baggie instead:

These bits are a bit hardened, but there were no infectious materials found in the procedure. She isn't sure it's a vitamin A deficiency either, as it's only affecting the one eye. For now, it seems that this may really be a quirk of his, that he's prone to build up in that eye, possibly a development issue, so now we're brainstorming ways to prolong the build up, for less frequent visitations.
I did mention Dr. Dayna, and she said that there is correspondence and consultations between the vet offices, and that it may also be worth trying to get in contact with the vet office sooner with photos of his special eye. I'm not sure if they'll be amenable to over-the-phone or over-email consults, but maybe they'll pity me for being 9-10 hours away one-way.

We're going to try the fluker's reptarinse drops a couple times a week, now that there's no build up, to try and encourage more cleaning behaviors. It's very experimental.
At least, if it's not infection, and it's possibly as he was born, I'm willing to put in the effort to figure out how to make it easier for him.
I'll continue to keep this thread updated with discoveries, trial and error, whatever I can along the way.

 

[LizardLurkin]

I hope everything went ok today. Sending positive thoughts to you and spoobl(i)e boy!

Sorry I always see spooble and my mind goes to Scooby Doo.... How did you find his name?

The name honestly came to me in a dream. I was deep in chameleon research and wanted one really bad, but it was the winter months so my subconscious must've been reeling at the fact I couldn't have one shipped. In the dream, I named the chameleon Spooble, and a second, Speeble.
Follow your dreams