Baby Panther - Home for less then 48 hours

Catahoula

New Member
Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care? Male panther approximately 8 weeks old. Brought him home Friday evening, so he's only been her about 36 hours.
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon? The only time he's been handled is from the store cage to the carry home cage, then the carry home cage to our cage
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders? He is being fed the same crickets he had at the store. They sent us home with our first batch. Offered him some (5-8) yesterday morning, yesterday evening, and this morning. However, we haven't seen him eat anything yet.
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule? ZooMed Repti Calcium with D3. I know he needs a plain calcium supplement, D3 supplement, and multi-vitamin, so the one I listed was just for his first day home.
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking? Misting 3-4 tiimes per day for approximately one minute until all the leaves are dripping. We have seen him drink a few times.
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Haven't seen any yet.
Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites? No
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you. He was taken to the pet store at about 6 weeks old by a local, well known breeder. He was in the store for 2 weeks before we brought him home. When we saw him in the store he looked healthy and active and even got to see him hunt his crickets one evening.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions? 16x16x20 screen terrarium
Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule? ZooMed ballast with a 5.0 repti sun bulb, ZooMed duel mini dome with a 75 watt basking buld and a 50 watt night bulb.
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? The highest basking spot is just under 85 degrees and the temp goes down from there to about 77 degrees.
Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps? Lowest over night temp would be 75 degrees, because that is what the houses thermostat is set at. There is a duel thermometer/hydrometer in the back of the cage and a digital thermometer in the front of the cage near the basking spot.
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity? Humidity stays at about 51% during the day, but drops to about 40% at night. Along with misting the cage we also have a repti fogger on during the day
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind? Schefflera arboricola from a local nursery along with some dowel rods to allow for horizontal movement as well as verticle.
Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor? The cage is in the corner of the living room, which doesn't get used much. It is on a table abour 2.5 feet off the ground. No fans are on, but there is one air vent in the same room with the slats mostly closed up.
Location - Where are you geographically located? We are in Florida

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.
We have had this baby for less then 48 hours, but he has been a dark brown color ever since we left the store and we haven't seen him eat anything yet. He's just grasping a branch with his head down. Sometimes he's looking around and sometimes he seems to be sleeping. Just really worried about if he is going to be ok, or if this is "normal" during a transition period from one place to another.
 
He could just be stressed out still because of the move i would just give him a bit of time keep trying to feed him and what not if he doesn't get better a vet check up is always something that u can do.
 
I'm hoping that's the case, but how long should we wait before going to a vet? I don't want him to get too weak from not eating.
 
If you have the chance you should try and get him some natural sunlight without baking him. Make sure he has a constant drip and mist the cage several times during his time outside. See if you can get him drinking. If you take his cage outside be sure he has the option of getting into the shade. If he warms up outside and lightens up, put some small crickets in the cage and see if he goes after them. Your basking temps look right. How big are the feeders you are offering? They should be no larger than the space between his eyes and at 8 weeks this should be around 1/4" crickets. The crickets should be gutloaded with some sort of wet gutload like squash or apple or mustard green prior to feeding off to aid hydration. I would say your objective right now is to make sure he is getting plenty of drinking opportunity. Hope this helps.

A picture of your enclosure would really help.
 
I'm not sure if I did it right, but I'm trying to attach a picture of the enclosure.
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He has been drinking which makes me feel a little more comfortable. My main concern is his brown color and the fact that I haven't seen him eat anything.
 
Where are you measuring your 85F? I looks like that heat source might be a little overkill for the size cage you have. Typically you would have the basking spot near the top. The scewers are going across lower than what I would expect to be the highest temp in the cage. IMO, you should tie the probe from your thermometer to the basking spot stick around 3-5 inches down from the top screen and reach a temp of 85 there. If you were to do that now I think you would see much higher than 85 going by the wattage of the bulb you are using. I use 40watt regalar incandescent bulbs to achieve 85-90 this time of year around 5 inches from the top screen for adults on a branch of appropriate size. For 8 weeks old you should lower that to 83 max temp. If you dont go closer to the top they will end up on the top screen upside down. I attached a pic showing how I adjust my basking spot for a panther. You can also use natural branches (I prefer crape myrtle) and rinse them off really well with piping hot tap water first. Connect them in a network with small zipties. Its a lot easier than trying to make pathways with barbecue scewers. JMO
 
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The 85 degrees was measured at one of the highest spots the cham can get to on one of the verticle shoots of the plant. Down where the first set of dowels are it's about 81 degrees. I have the probe in there so I can move it around and measure different areas. There is a stationary thermomete in the back of the cage under the fogger that is reading about 78 degrees.

We were hoping to use the same light system for when he moves to his adult cage, so before we got him we measured all around raising the dome away from the cage to get a better range.

So do you think he doesn't want to be at the very top becuase it's too hot for him? Would this effect whether or not he wants to eat?
 
The 85 degrees was measured at one of the highest spots the cham can get to on one of the verticle shoots of the plant. Down where the first set of dowels are it's about 81 degrees. I have the probe in there so I can move it around and measure different areas. There is a stationary thermomete in the back of the cage under the fogger that is reading about 78 degrees.

We were hoping to use the same light system for when he moves to his adult cage, so before we got him we measured all around raising the dome away from the cage to get a better range.

So do you think he doesn't want to be at the very top becuase it's too hot for him? Would this effect whether or not he wants to eat?

If he is too hot he would not want to eat. I see you used calcium with D3 for his first supplemented crickets. You should not use that anymore. It would be better that he had well gutloaded crickets with no supplement than overdoing the d3 IMO. Get either repashy calcium plus for lightly dusted crickets for every feeding or phosphate free calcium without D3 and by lightly i mean barely any. Dusting should be the size of a matchhead for around a dozen feeders in a cup so that you can barely tell they have been dusted. Hydrate with mistings and a drip for now and see how he does. Does he respond to hand misting the cage? Close up pics of the baby would help as previously stated.
 
heat burn.jpg

Oh my gosh, I'm so broke up right now. Woke up this morning and the poor thing is peeling from what I'm guessing is heat burn. I don't know what to do and I'm so afraid he's going to die.

Reducing the temperature in his cage and trying to get some silver sulfadiazine from the vet, but he looks so bad I'm afraid it's too late.

Any more advise would be greatly appreciated if you think it'll help save him.
 
shedding.jpg

Ok, so the picture in the above post was from about 6:30 this morning. At 9:30 when the vet opened my boyfriend went armed with pictures to see if they could offer some help. We were worried that the baby was too stressed to be moved, that's why we didn't take him in. The vet prescribed and anti biotic ointment and wished us luck.

The picture in this post is what he looked like at 10:30am when he got home with the medicine...MUCH better to say the least.

We are still keeping a VERY close eye on him and have made adjustments to his light system to find a more suitable temperature for him.

THANK YOU so much for all the help. Tonight we will be getting the proper calcium supplement for his daily use and will follow the instructions posted above. I will continue to post updates in case anyone is interested in how he is doing.

Feel free to offer any more suggestions/advice to help. We definitely want to do everything that is right for this little guy. He's barely been with us for 3 days and we were both a wreck worried about him.
 
Relax it will be fine. Your cham is shedding. While he is young he will do that often. it is completely normal, and would be a problem if he didn't shed. just give him extra misting to help him get the shed off. But don't remove it, he has to do that or you might hurt his skin. He dons not need and cream or anything but extra misting.:)
 
If your vet prescribed an antibiotic ointment for a shed IMO I do t think they are qualified to treat exotics.

At first we didn't think it was a shed. The poor baby was so dark brown and seeming lethargic, so we thought he got burned by his light. We were petrified to attempt transport to a vet and cause more stress so we asked the vet if we showed him pictures instead if he could offer any suggestions. The result was an over-the-counter cream to help. To be fair, our vet didn't get an opportunity to do an exam of our cham.

By the time we made it home with the cream he had turned the lightest shade we've seen him since bringing him home.
 
Boyfriend here, with more pics, because I know how much everyone enjoys pics. :D

Having him start a shed the second day home caught us off gaurd. But we did the right thing by checking and re-checking our entire setup and contacting our vet. I've been lurking on these forums for the past 6 months getting great tips on enclosures, feeders, gut loading, and health care. Thanks to all of you Copernicus is going to have a really happy life, and of course I'll post more pics. :cool:
 

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Boyfriend here, with more pics, because I know how much everyone enjoys more pics. :D

Having him start a shed the second day home caught us off gaurd. But we did the right thing by checking and re-checking our entire setup and contacting our vet. I've been lurking on these forums for the past 6 months getting great tips on enclosures, feeders, gut loading, and health care. Thanks to all of you Copernicus is going to have a really happy life, and of course I'll post more pics. :cool:

Good, his being ok was the goal of all of us. You were doing everything you could, but when I saw the shed picture, I let out the breath I had been holding.:)
 
Here's the rest of those pics I promised. ;)
 

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At that age I would be useing a 40watt household bulb for his basking spot.Other than that your setup looks fine.Babies can be sneekie eaters.Give him some space and count your feeders that go into his enclosure.Somtimes thats the only way you can tell if there eating.Water is the key with the little guys.While your doing your research,look into a misting system.They can shed as often as every month while there growing. Good luck:)
 
At that age I would be useing a 40watt household bulb for his basking spot.Other than that your setup looks fine.

We have since switched his heat source to a regular 40 watt incandescent bulb. Thank you for the suggestion.

Still keeping a close eye on him, from a distance, but still seems to be doing good. Water intake is good. He likes licking up drops after his cage has been misted. Still waiting to see him eat, but doing our best to keep track of the feeders in his cage.
 
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