Xing the Canadian Border w/chams

[Chameleons Northwest]

I know next to nothing about trafficking in chams. We live not far from the Canadian border however, and so I am curious:

Is it possible to legally cross the border from Canada to U.S. with a live chameleon? I mean declaring it, and all, not hiding it in my wooden leg.

Does it depend on the chameleon?

I realize to some this is probably a really dumb question, like, "duh, you know you can't bring exotic animals across international borders". But, really, I don't know.

 

[JoshCrane1]

permits and or liscenses are required i think.

 

[royden]

I've been wondering the same. (I live even a little closer the gesang's, you must stop by on your way through Sandy) I go to Canada every couple months. I've wondered about breeding some day and selling them over the border.

Several phone calls to the border might help. But in my experience (importing a wife) you call 4 or 5 times, to 2 or 3 different crossings, and take an average of their answers.

Actually importing a wife was much more complicated.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Permits and licensing. Sounds pricey.

One of my biggest concerns would be whether the animal would have to be officially quarantined somewhere for 30 days.

To be more specific. I am wondering about me driving into Canada, purchasing a chameleon, and driving back home across the border. So, it would be my pet, and not for resale.

But, the possibility of breeding them and selling them across the border is interesting, too. Especially for someone like you, Royden, who crosses the border regularly anyway.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

I've been wondering the same. (I live even a little closer the gesang's, you must stop by on your way through Sandy) I go to Canada every couple months. I've wondered about breeding some day and selling them over the border.

Several phone calls to the border might help. But in my experience (importing a wife) you call 4 or 5 times, to 2 or 3 different crossings, and take an average of their answers.

Actually importing a wife was much more complicated.

Hopefully Ruth wasn't quarantined for 30 days.

 

[Vibrant Chameleons]

You need to apply for a SITES permit to import anything into Canada and to leave the USA. This is why the majority of breeders in the USA won't ship to Canada. It takes a long time to acquire all the paperwork needed.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

You need to apply for a SITES permit to import anything into Canada and to leave the USA. This is why the majority of breeders in the USA won't ship to Canada. It takes a long time to acquire all the paperwork needed.

That's what I was afraid of, and sounds too complicated and official for a casual exchange. Do you know if there are any quarantine issues?

 

[CarolenRunsen]

I doubt there would be any issues about quarantine or anything like that, but do not know for sure.
I was recently looking into getting one shipped from the states but realized quickly its not really worth it. Guess it takes about 6 months for all the paper work.
But if you live close, i think it would be quite simple to smuggle one across the boarder.... humm, something just came to mind, i wonder what the consequences would be if you got caught...

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

I doubt there would be any issues about quarantine or anything like that, but do not know for sure.
I was recently looking into getting one shipped from the states but realized quickly its not really worth it. Guess it takes about 6 months for all the paper work.
But if you live close, i think it would be quite simple to smuggle one across the boarder.... humm, something just came to mind, i wonder what the consequences would be if you got caught...

Two things would concern me about smuggling:

1. If they actually ask verbally, or on a form, if I am bringing across anything live. (I wouldn't mind with holding info from them if it didn't come up, but wouldn't want to lie.)

2. If they did discover the chameleon, they would confiscate it, and how on earth would they know how to care for it? I would have to hope it ended up with a reptile rescue group that wouldn't try to treat it like a bearded dragon. I can just see some poor 3 month old cham sitting in a glass tank on a log underneath a 150watt bulb. Not that I'm slamming rescue groups. Thank God for them. But I imagine the ones near the border are probably a little overworked.

 

[CarolenRunsen]

Well I'm sure that "Are you carrying any live plants or animals with you" is probably a standard question, so you would probably have to lie.

Having a chameleon confiscated would definatly be a huge downer. I would hope this would be their only action, i mean what if you ended up going to jail for a couple years cuase you tried to smuggle a chameleon to the north.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Well I'm sure that "Are you carrying any live plants or animals with you" is probably a standard question, so you would probably have to lie.

Having a chameleon confiscated would definatly be a huge downer. I would hope this would be their only action, i mean what if you ended up going to jail for a couple years cuase you tried to smuggle a chameleon to the north.

I'm talking about bringing one to the south (U.S.).

And, yes, it does seem like that live plants and animals question is pretty routine.

Royden- if you see this- can you tell us if they routinely ask you about live plants and animals?

I don't think I've crossed over since the most recent changes were made concerning 9/11 issues. When we went to Vancouver before, it seems we showed our drivers license, and were waved through. But, it does seem like there were signs posted- to stop at the guard house if you had anything to declare.

It's probably a whole different world now.

 

[dodolah]

Gesang, I think it's too much trouble, really.
I am pretty sure that they will ask.
as far as withholding info, that's a li'l bit cutting the edge along the line of compromising (if y'know what i mean )

 

[Dankmeleon]

just to let you know, they are looking for drugs coming back into america.

assuming you are american citizen and don't have a crappy car, you should be fine, just look nice and clean, I would not declare it and pay taxes on it and all that, especially because they are going to give you a hard time and make you fill out forms and all that crap, you'll be there for AWHILE

imo you should just come through and tell them you were attending a wedding and they'll let you right through, they aren't going to empty out your suitcases in the trunk unless you are suspicious, of course thats always a risky way of looking at things, and if you prefer it would be most wise to declare it etc, and I actually have no idea about the true details of doing so, but also food for thought, nobody ever did anything amazing without taking a ton of risk, and sometimes its smarter to do crazy things like that, like for example when you get across the border and were like wow I'm glad I didn't have to stay and wait and pay

just look like a tourist, camera around the passengers neck, brochures postcards laying about etc

of course that is really illegal though and as your legal counsel I would advise you against doing it, even though I would probably try my luck as federal government has more border issues to worry about than legal lizards, imho, good luck

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Gesang, I think it's too much trouble, really.
I am pretty sure that they will ask.
as far as withholding info, that's a li'l bit cutting the edge along the line of compromising (if y'know what i mean )

Yes, I do see the compromise. But I was thinking how we used to be able to flash our driver's license and get waved through. Then I remembered there were signs about declaring things, which would be the same as asking. Pretending I had nothing to declare would be "passive lying". So, no, I don't think I could have rightly just withheld the info. I like my conscience clean. And to stay out of prison, too.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

just to let you know, they are looking for drugs coming back into america.

assuming you are american citizen and don't have a crappy car, you should be fine, just look nice and clean, I would not declare it and pay taxes on it and all that, especially because they are going to give you a hard time and make you fill out forms and all that crap, you'll be there for AWHILE

imo you should just come through and tell them you were attending a wedding and they'll let you right through, they aren't going to empty out your suitcases in the trunk unless you are suspicious, of course thats always a risky way of looking at things, and if you prefer it would be most wise to declare it etc, and I actually have no idea about the true details of doing so, but also food for thought, nobody ever did anything amazing without taking a ton of risk, and sometimes its smarter to do crazy things like that, like for example when you get across the border and were like wow I'm glad I didn't have to stay and wait and pay

just look like a tourist, camera around the passengers neck, brochures postcards laying about etc

of course that is really illegal though and as your legal counsel I would advise you against doing it, even though I would probably try my luck as federal government has more border issues to worry about than legal lizards, imho, good luck

Thank you Dank, for the encouragement. Will you come visit me during my "internment"?

 

[Dankmeleon]

you could always fly and put him in your underwear, once you get on the plane you can take him out and keep him in a container inside of a small carry on box, but that doesn't really fit your situation living so closely, other underwear stuffing feel free to try your luck, its awesome practice for madagascar

 

[dodolah]

you could always fly and put him in your underwear, once you get on the plane you can take him out and keep him in a container inside of a small carry on box, but that doesn't really fit your situation living so closely, other underwear stuffing feel free to try your luck, its awesome practice for madagascar

wow Dank, sounds like you have many experiences in dealing with this stuff just kidding, bro!

 

[Dankmeleon]

i use to smuggle dance moves thats why

 

[royden]

It's not a standard question at all.

They want to know if you're bringing anything to leave into Canada. And on the USA side 'what did you buy?' That's about it. Where do you live? whay are you traveling? those are typical, but never live plants or animals, I never get that.

I'm guessing it's a lot of work to get the paperwork.

Yes Sandy, Ruth was quarantined. I called it a honeymoon though

 

[chamlover]

I am not too familiar with where you live but i live in NH which borders Canada and in Pittsburg NH there is a border that is unmanned in the evening. I live about 3 hours south of there but my brother-in-law lived there for several years and he said no one was ever there at night.You just drive through and there is a sign posted that tells you that you are suppose to drive about 30-40 miles over to the Vermont border to answer the questions and to show IDs I'm not sure where it is because i never went. Not that i had anything to declare anyway. I don't know anyone that has ever driven over there. Pittsburg has a population of about 10, kidding, maybe 500 and i think they think it is a waste of money to have anyone posted there all the time. Just a thought.

Of course if i were you i think i would try to find out what the consequenses would be if by chance you got caught. Going to prison doesn't sound like fun at all. And the poor cham! What would happen to him?
Debby