why are you breeding SICK animals?

casperpetersen

casperpetersen

New Member
why breed on a sick blood-line like transperent sunburst motherf#&%#! sorry....
but I am really curious about it... why keep something that never was ment to be?........
do you like to play "God"?

"Heil" humans destroyers of the world!:mad:
 
I think it had been determined that these animals are not really "sick". They seem to be doing well.

Besides, you accuse others of playing God, while YOU have decided which creatures are "not meant to be."

There's no playing God here, it's selective breeding. Personally, I think these trans. veileds are ugly as sin. But they seem to be doing well.

Captivity is very different than living in the wild. In captivity, it IS up to us to decide which animals are bred and which are not.
 
good point

Eric Adrignola said:
I think it had been determined that these animals are not really "sick". They seem to be doing well.

Besides, you accuse others of playing God, while YOU have decided which creatures are "not meant to be."

There's no playing God here, it's selective breeding. Personally, I think these trans. veileds are ugly as sin. But they seem to be doing well.

Captivity is very different than living in the wild. In captivity, it IS up to us to decide which animals are bred and which are not.
Click to expand...

I'm going to have to agree with you Eric. Albinism and other genetic variations occur in the wild as well, it's not like these traits just showed up when some mad scientist was playing in his basement.
 
It is my understanding that these animals came from wild caught stock.
I think it's kind of a fascinating trait/morph.
Since we really don't worry much about any kind of "purity" in veileds (not like pardalis locales) it should be interesting to see what colors (or absense of) appear in these animals in the following years.
As long as attention is paid to related animals and good breeding practices are maintained, there shouldn't be many issues with this.

-Brad
 
This is a controversial topic. Please remember the rule below:
Members must show respect for others at all times. This is crucial to maintaining a friendly environment. There are no exceptions.
Click to expand...

site rules
 
I didnt know a lack of skin pigment made an animal sick.....
Have you even owned one?
Have you ran any studies on them like Chris A.?
They appeared in natures as wild caught animals, so I guess they were ment to be.
The only thing that would effect them is exposure to UV radiation.
They arent even effected by a reptisun 10.0 with the absence of skin pigment.
Seems like your quick to judge.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/shock-1640/
 
Last edited:
Brad said:
This is a controversial topic. Please remember the rule below:

Members must show respect for others at all times. This is crucial to maintaining a friendly environment. There are no exceptions.

site rules
Click to expand...

Sigh... Really? Not even one exception just this once? You did read the opening post in this thread right? Ok... I guess it's not worth it.
 
sunburst

it's a pretty common trait found in veiled chameleons, the sunburst pattern that is, it gives them more yellow and orange pigments as opposed to turquoise or green.
 
I wouldn't even go that far. It's simply veiled chameleons with a lot of orange coloring. Nothing specific, just a nice-sounding marketing name.

It got so bad years ago people were just calling them "sunburst" chameleons... I was really irked when people would ask if it was possible to cross breed a sunburst chameleon with a veiled chameleon. AHHHHGHGHH!

the thing about pardalis is that the colors reflect a certain location in their range. With veileds, well, the color variations and size variations might very well reflect the different populations... but nobody seems to want to go to Yemen to find out!
 
casperpetersen said:
why breed on a sick blood-line like transperent sunburst motherf#&%#! sorry....
but I am really curious about it... why keep something that never was ment to be?........
do you like to play "God"?

"Heil" humans destroyers of the world!:mad:
Click to expand...

actually, it pretty much for the same reason why we breed so many different kind of dogs. If we let the nature run over, i'm pretty sure dogs like pug, golden retriever (prone to cancer), and many other will not survive in the wild due to natural selection.

I would not go so far as calling translucent a sick blood line just like we won't go so far calling a dachsund (weiner dog) a sick trait dog because they have short and stubby legs.

I believe just like others have said, translucent veiled seems to be a healthy species.
 
veiled

Eric Adrignola said:
I wouldn't even go that far. It's simply veiled chameleons with a lot of orange coloring. Nothing specific, just a nice-sounding marketing name.

It got so bad years ago people were just calling them "sunburst" chameleons... I was really irked when people would ask if it was possible to cross breed a sunburst chameleon with a veiled chameleon. AHHHHGHGHH!

the thing about pardalis is that the colors reflect a certain location in their range. With veileds, well, the color variations and size variations might very well reflect the different populations... but nobody seems to want to go to Yemen to find out!
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure that's what I said. It's a chameleon with traits that give it more orange and yellow.
 
eric

wait, you're right, i wasn't very specific with what i said. I said the trait is "sunburst" as in that's what the trait is called. You're right, i agree it's nothing specific. just lots of orange and yellow in the cham with a catchy marketing name. My mistake
 
I believe the transparent veilds that you're talking about are native to southern areas of spain and the Mediterranean.
 
Marc10edora said:
I believe the transparent veilds that you're talking about are native to southern areas of spain and the Mediterranean.
Click to expand...

For as far as I know the only species of chameleon native to southern europe is the common chameleon.

As for the main discussion I'll only add that just because an anomaly occurs and can survive in the wild doesn't mean that its reproductive fitness is anything like that of a normal specimen. Who knows, maybe translucent male veileds get rejected by females, or vice versa. It's very common for the females of the species to have build-in mechanisms to be able to choose the best males to father their offspring.
In captivity chameleons generally aren't given much of a choice in who they get to mate with.

PS: if any studies on mate choice in wild chameleons were ever done, I would love to hear about it.

- Suzanne
 
 
I might be wrong, but I could have sworn I read this somewhere on the forums. That is where I got it from. I'll have to look around and dig it up somewhere.
 
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