Where is the Faly thread?

[clarkrw3]

I don’t want this thread to turn into a he said/she said thing or it will get closed as well.

I’m serious though when I say I’d like an adult discussion about the locality. A new thread that perhaps mentions the history, what to look for in a true Faly, the future within the hobby, some different perspectives etc. A round table perhaps? Would that be of some benefit? Or would it just end up heavily moderated or closed?

Im all for it cause i have been around an have done my research. the prob is trace to have that happen people gotta tell the truth an they just wont or it wouldnt end up like that everytime.

I agree with Rob. This is like steroids in baseball. You can look at the players and know which ones did and didn't but it's hard to get a handle on how wide spread it is because people will lie to the death. There are people that will NEVER tell the truth so you just have to let the animals speak for themselves and those that are honest will show through. I mean look at how many animals Tom has purchased only to have them all but this one look crossed. People just take short cuts on the females, and other smaller breeders trust these big breeders that are taking shortcuts with the females.

We really should not be breeding or buying females that we don't have a brother from that has been proved out. What really should be talked about is breeding ethics. However, people without ethics never want to talk about them rather they want to sling mud on others.

 

[Olimpia]

I didn't see this thread in particular, but I'd like to put in my two cents to defend Jim. I've dealt with him a few times and hope to do so again in the future - he has always been helpful, polite, and most accommodating with me. When we realized that I had gotten a faly-banja by mistake instead of a Nosy be he gave me several very good options to correct the situation, including refunding me part of my money even if I didn't want to send him back. I took none of the options and opted for just leaving it at that, since I was more than happy with the animal anyway. He has also been very helpful if I ever wanted his opinion about something.

The man produces thousands of panthers every year, according to an old interview of his. I'm personally inclined to trust his opinion, since this is literally what he does for a living.

I didn't see what he wrote, though. Shame the thread was closed, I totally missed it.

 

[clarkrw3]

I didn't see this thread in particular, but I'd like to put in my two cents to defend Jim. I've dealt with him a few times and hope to do so again in the future - he has always been helpful, polite, and most accommodating with me. When we realized that I had gotten a faly-banja by mistake instead of a Nosy be he gave me several very good options to correct the situation, including refunding me part of my money even if I didn't want to send him back. I took none of the options and opted for just leaving it at that, since I was more than happy with the animal anyway. He has also been very helpful if I ever wanted his opinion about something.

The man produces thousands of panthers every year, according to an old interview of his. I'm personally inclined to trust his opinion, since this is literally what he does for a living.

I didn't see what he wrote, though. Shame the thread was closed, I totally missed it.

I hear you Olympia and that is one of the reasons I was totally shocked with what he posted and the tone he took.

All this said, you got an accidental cross and Rob did as well, and if you read the email from Jim that Rob posted on Fauna you can understand why he has these issues. There is a thread right now about a pink ambilobe on the forum from Jim. He produces great health and beautiful animals but has had problems with unintentional crossing which is well documented on these forums. Maybe he is old school when locales just weren't a big deal I don't know. I will say at least people are getting health animals from him rather than the sick animals I and others have received from some other very high profile breeders.

 

[Sticktongue]

I just joined Fauna and have never been on before.. Where at do i go to find the other thread. I want to read the rest.

EDIT! I believe i found where, but my account is not activated yet. Carry on

 

[drcrossfire]

Here's the important Faly thread:

https://www.chameleonforums.com/faly-girl-digging-80367/

 

[drcrossfire]

I just joined Fauna and have never been on before.. Where at do i go to find the other thread. I want to read the rest.

EDIT! I believe i found where, but my account is not activated yet. Carry on

Can u post link

 

[Sticktongue]

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/


scroll down a little. On the left it says site navigation and under it says chat. I'm assuming its in there, but not sure since i cant access it untill my account is not activated

 

[robmd1]

if you go to fauna look under Reptile & Amphibian - Lizard Discussion Forums ya cant miss it

 

[BocaJan]

Just wanted to say that I loved the cammy, whatever it is, with all the red spots. It would be something that would be an asset to my collection and I bet that it's owner is proud to show it off.

Congratulations on such beautiful animal.

 

[clarkrw3]

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304511

 

[Sticktongue]

Ok i'm not even close to an expert at falys, or any local for that matter so take it however you want...

I am/use to be into hunting dogs. The same thing has happened with dogs. German shorthair pointers use to ALWAYS be dark colors. Liver, roan, black. That was their colors. Now their are WHITE and liver GSP's all over the place. Why? because people bred them with English pointers (white/oranage/black/liver) People pulled some tricks and cross bred and passed them off to AKC as pure breds. Same thing with silver labs.. their is NO such things as a silver lab. Labs are chocolate, black and yellow. They cross bred with a weimeriner and played some tricks on the AKC and got them to be an official lab..
Yes i know i'm talking about dog breeding on a chameleon forum, but the same principle applies. Gene pools got mixed up at one points. On purpose or not, it happened and it will NEVER be the same as it once was for the falys. Their will be a few breeders like rob that will keep it pure, but other than that.. They are gone.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Bottom line is, Jim's goal is to sell his chameleons and that includes bashing other peoples lines under the guise of educating all of us. Females from different locales can get mixed in with anyone's line and won't get recognized until it's too late. Most people that want to preserve certain locales are doing the best they possibly can.

Chuck. That is pretty lame. Surely you know that such as Rob has a history of bashing everyone's bloodlines, and is on a short leash here.

We all know that many Faly bloodlines are polluted. But do you now claim that we cannot have a legitimate disagreement about what is normal, and what is not ? Does everything get a pass because the poster cannot be challenged in a civil way ? Personally, I could care less if folks want to trash my bloodlines. Been going on since day 1

Just as your cheap shot above, that has been how too many here respond when these discussions occur. With the cheap stuff.

FYI, I commented about the "Faly" of another about a month ago here. Here are the rep comments that I received from Rob and Clark:

"while we have a diff of opinion on falys you are rite on on this one congrats..rob"

"That's what I have been saying for a while" -clarkrw3

Do you see the humor ?

 

[Chameleon Company]

Not saying it was a personal attack but when you try to sell some of your "unpure" Faly's and your sales are down and someone that has "pure" Faly's sales are up...mission accomplished. Subtle, yes, but this is what motivates certain individuals.

Chuck. This is more nonsense. See my earlier post, but I have always been consistent on this topic.

 

[robmd1]

Chuck. That is pretty lame. Surely you know that such as Rob has a history of bashing everyone's bloodlines, and is on a short leash here.

We all know that many Faly bloodlines are polluted. But do you now claim that we cannot have a legitimate disagreement about what is normal, and what is not ? Does everything get a pass because the poster cannot be challenged in a civil way ? Personally, I could care less if folks want to trash my bloodlines. Been going on since day 1

Just as your cheap shot above, that has been how too many here respond when these discussions occur. With the cheap stuff.

FYI, I commented about the "Faly" of another about a month ago here. Here are the rep comments that I received from Rob and Clark:

"while we have a diff of opinion on falys you are rite on on this one congrats..rob"

"That's what I have been saying for a while" -clarkrw3

Do you see the humor ?

no humor the faly you said wasnt wasnt, whats a shame is ya cant say the same thing about your own stuff jim an thats where the prob lies.. oh an im on a short leash cause people like you wont tell the truth.. theres a fauna thread all about it ya should take a look. ill also say ive been good not startin nothing, i like this site to much an dont wanna be banned over silly things like this.

 

[clarkrw3]

Chuck. That is pretty lame. Surely you know that such as Rob has a history of bashing everyone's bloodlines, and is on a short leash here.

We all know that many Faly bloodlines are polluted. But do you now claim that we cannot have a legitimate disagreement about what is normal, and what is not ? Does everything get a pass because the poster cannot be challenged in a civil way ? Personally, I could care less if folks want to trash my bloodlines. Been going on since day 1

Just as your cheap shot above, that has been how too many here respond when these discussions occur. With the cheap stuff.

FYI, I commented about the "Faly" of another about a month ago here. Here are the rep comments that I received from Rob and Clark:

"while we have a diff of opinion on falys you are rite on on this one congrats..rob"

"That's what I have been saying for a while" -clarkrw3

Do you see the humor ?

Ok, Jim I gave you rep on that post...but post pictures of that animal and all the picture of this clutch that YOU are questioning and there is a BIG difference!! Not even in the same ball park. I posted pictures of two chams in the thread that got deleted and you didn't want to comment on them. Also lets see all the offspring you have produced from Iceman and not just WC's and lets have a REAL conversation about it rather than just bashing.

 

[Chameleon Company]

Hey Tom. Sorry I bumped up your thread for pictures I never thought that would happen. Jim VERY specifically in his first post said "You got a cross there Tom, at very most only 75% Faly, you have a ambanja cross"

Now I have the brother to yours and he is NO QUESTION a 100% Pure Faly. I posted pictures of my guy in the same pose and a picture of my WC and asked him to comment on those two because they look SO very similar and he wouldn't do it. Shortly after that it got deleted. Jim posted a bunch of WC pictures in the thread but wasn't willing to post any of the offspring he has produced.

Clark, this is incorrect. I was responding to a post of yours when it was locked. Like many, I do not keep a thread up continuously.

But let me point out again, your rep to me when I noted the exact same ambanja/Faly points to another person's Faly a month ago. You and Rob have always been fiine with going after other folks product.

As for all my animals. None are above reproach. Anyone should be able to post a dissent, if done in a civil manner. I have no fear of disagreement.

Last night, I used pictures. Others added more pictures. Of WC's. Why the recoil from doing so ?

 

[diablocham]

Ok, Jim I gave you rep on that post...but post pictures of that animal and all the picture of this clutch in question and there is a BIG difference!! Not even in the same ball park. I posted pictures of two chams in the thread that got deleted and you didn't want to comment on them. Also lets see all the offspring you have produced from Iceman and not just WC's and lets have a REAL conversation about it rather than just bashing.

WHATTTTTTTTTT?????? DONT TELL ME THE CLUTCHES FROM ICEMAN ARENT PURE FALYSSSS????

 

[Chameleon Company]

Ok, Jim I gave you rep on that post...but post pictures of that animal and all the picture of this clutch in question and there is a BIG difference!! Not even in the same ball park. I posted pictures of two chams in the thread that got deleted and you didn't want to comment on them. Also lets see all the offspring you have produced from Iceman and not just WC's and lets have a REAL conversation about it rather than just bashing.

Clark. Perhaps you have time to comment on every post. The thead locked while I was replying to one of your posts.

Look. The evidence is there. You have supported the questioning of the bloodlines of others animals. But then went a bit awry with folks questioning yours in the same manner.

I could care less if some folks have civll disagreements wiht my bloodlines. So what for chrissakes

 

[robmd1]

WHATTTTTTTTTT?????? DONT TELL ME THE CLUTCHES FROM ICEMAN ARENT PURE FALYSSSS????

go look at the fauna thread itll inlighten you as to what you have..

 

[Chameleon Company]

I didn't see this thread in particular, but I'd like to put in my two cents to defend Jim. I've dealt with him a few times and hope to do so again in the future - he has always been helpful, polite, and most accommodating with me. When we realized that I had gotten a faly-banja by mistake instead of a Nosy be he gave me several very good options to correct the situation, including refunding me part of my money even if I didn't want to send him back. I took none of the options and opted for just leaving it at that, since I was more than happy with the animal anyway. He has also been very helpful if I ever wanted his opinion about something.

The man produces thousands of panthers every year, according to an old interview of his. I'm personally inclined to trust his opinion, since this is literally what he does for a living.

I didn't see what he wrote, though. Shame the thread was closed, I totally missed it.

Olimpia. Hope all is well. I would encourage management to repost that thread. Locked if they must. But let people see not only what was posted, but who took what approach, and what tone.

I am exceedingly comfortable with it.