What is this call?
- Thread starter piercy
- Start date
bermudababe
New Member
looks like it could possibly be a side striped chameleon
THECHAMMAN
Established Member
maybe a rudis
Trace
Captain Awesome
It's a male "red phase" Chamaeleo trioceros rudis sternfeldi. There are a few common names for the species including; Ruwenzori Side Striped Chameleon, Rough Chameleon or Mountain Chameleon.
I notice he is in with a Flapneck or Graceful Chameleon as well as something else. Is he something you are considering buying?
Trace
I notice he is in with a Flapneck or Graceful Chameleon as well as something else. Is he something you are considering buying?
Trace
toddmkeller
Avid Member
Lol I Like the cham in the top right of the photo which appears to be flapneck? But yes I believe you have a Jeweled Rudis also know as the red rudis https://www.chameleonforums.com/jeweled-rudis-aka-red-7110/
Hope this helps
Happy Thanksgiving
Todd
THECHAMMAN
Established Member
woo hoo my 1st right guess. it looked like cameron B's so i guessed rudis.
Niels Pedersen
Established Member
Hi
I would think this chameleon is the "new" species from the bitaeniatus complex (rudis subgroup), from kilimanjaron, North Tanzania. As most poeple can see its closly related to Ch.(T) sternfeldii, from Arusha. But i think it will be officially named next year.
I think most chameleon enthusiasts, from the states, suffer from the fact that "the go to place" ADCHAM has not been updated since the miocene.
Rudis has no subspecies ! And its geographical range does not include Tanzania !
I havent found any Up to date species lists in English, on the net. But the DGHT (German) is usualy a good bet.
http://translate.google.com/transla...ons/systematik.htm&hl=da&ie=UTF-8&sl=de&tl=en
Also our Danish (sorry) site is usualy updated emidiately after eventual changes are made (or before its official, if possible). But i think it will be some years before google translation, can decifer danish, in to understandeble english
(
http://translate.google.com/transla...ew&id=21&Itemid=37&hl=da&ie=UTF-8&sl=da&tl=en
Also (and this is nothing personal guys) whats with the popular names ? Are they realy helping anyone ? I´m my opinion they are just adding to the confusion.... Please back me up here, fellow CCD nuts (Compulsive Chamaeleomanic Disorder)
Ps. Very pretty speciment, one would think he deserves better than being housed with other totaly different species
I would think this chameleon is the "new" species from the bitaeniatus complex (rudis subgroup), from kilimanjaron, North Tanzania. As most poeple can see its closly related to Ch.(T) sternfeldii, from Arusha. But i think it will be officially named next year.
I think most chameleon enthusiasts, from the states, suffer from the fact that "the go to place" ADCHAM has not been updated since the miocene.
Rudis has no subspecies ! And its geographical range does not include Tanzania !
I havent found any Up to date species lists in English, on the net. But the DGHT (German) is usualy a good bet.
http://translate.google.com/transla...ons/systematik.htm&hl=da&ie=UTF-8&sl=de&tl=en
Also our Danish (sorry) site is usualy updated emidiately after eventual changes are made (or before its official, if possible). But i think it will be some years before google translation, can decifer danish, in to understandeble english
( http://translate.google.com/transla...ew&id=21&Itemid=37&hl=da&ie=UTF-8&sl=da&tl=en
Also (and this is nothing personal guys) whats with the popular names ? Are they realy helping anyone ? I´m my opinion they are just adding to the confusion.... Please back me up here, fellow CCD nuts (Compulsive Chamaeleomanic Disorder)
Ps. Very pretty speciment, one would think he deserves better than being housed with other totaly different species
THECHAMMAN
Established Member
there are some, but usually are in danish or some other european language.
Trace
Captain Awesome
Niels,
I agree with what you are saying! Years ago, when I first got my hands on my group of "reds" they were imported as Chamaeleo trioceros rudis sternfeldi so I've gone with that scientific name in the meantime. From my personal work with the bitaeniatus complex, there is definitely a considerable difference between the regular "green" rudis and the fancier "red" variety. (Size, scale counts, crests etc.) so I've felt they've needed their own specific name for years. Interestingly enough, even within the "red" group I've noticed differences between some specimens and wonder if there aren't localities or (sub-species?) with them! I only use common names when I'm discussing chameleons with people who haven't been in the hobby long otherwise I'm a complete nerd with it comes to taxonomy! "My name is Tracey and I suffer from Compulsive Chamaeleomanic Disorder"
I know I'm eagerly awaiting the new official breakdown of the bitaeniatus complex to hopefully validate some my findings. The whole bitaeniatus complex has truly been an interesting group to work with.
Cheers,
t
I agree with what you are saying! Years ago, when I first got my hands on my group of "reds" they were imported as Chamaeleo trioceros rudis sternfeldi so I've gone with that scientific name in the meantime. From my personal work with the bitaeniatus complex, there is definitely a considerable difference between the regular "green" rudis and the fancier "red" variety. (Size, scale counts, crests etc.) so I've felt they've needed their own specific name for years. Interestingly enough, even within the "red" group I've noticed differences between some specimens and wonder if there aren't localities or (sub-species?) with them! I only use common names when I'm discussing chameleons with people who haven't been in the hobby long otherwise I'm a complete nerd with it comes to taxonomy! "My name is Tracey and I suffer from Compulsive Chamaeleomanic Disorder"
I know I'm eagerly awaiting the new official breakdown of the bitaeniatus complex to hopefully validate some my findings. The whole bitaeniatus complex has truly been an interesting group to work with.
Cheers,
t
Niels Pedersen
Established Member
I´m sorry to hear you courght the bug too.... thats sure to screw up ones priorities in life
Just for a note on the popular names:
Rowenzori side stripe.... Must be the real rudis from Rowenzori mts. ???? Never seen one in captivety thoug - and what about the bitaeniatus from this region ??? what is their popname ???
Jeweled "rudis"... Must be real sternfeldi, from Arusha... or ??? At least the lateral pattern in hi contrast males look like "jewels" or diamonds...
"Red" Rudis... looks pretty mutch like the depicted animal, so that must be the one from kilimanjaro...
And there is one more new undiscribed (.. bitaeniatus complex/rudis subgroup/cf.sternfeldi....ish thing) - from Kenya http://www.teraechis.cz/Web_somalia...Afriky/FOTOGALERIE_HERP/Chamaeleo_Loita_V.jpg
Rough chameleon.... Hmmm if we assume that the this is a cham from the same group... what about maybe schoutedeni or schubotzi ????
Still dont really get the point of theise popnames....
Sang... whatever... Your right... no disrespect to the ADCHAM contributors
- but it must be frustrating that only a handfull of true CCD´s have access to the more advanced infomation, that are readely avalible to the public in europe... thats it !
In the light of the stated purpose, by someone assoiated with ADCHAM in a previous topic i attended. The goal was never to make an "ultimate-up-to-date-guide-to-all-known-infomation-on-chameleons" But rather a startingpoint for the newbie and semi-newbi, to gather valueble infomation on captive maitenence and husbondry. So my opinion is: If you only source of infomation is the ADCHAM website, you dont realy have any predisposition to awnser in advanced topics like taxonomy, zoogeography, speciation, radiation ect....
Just for a note on the popular names:
Rowenzori side stripe.... Must be the real rudis from Rowenzori mts. ???? Never seen one in captivety thoug
- and what about the bitaeniatus from this region ??? what is their popname ???Jeweled "rudis"... Must be real sternfeldi, from Arusha... or ??? At least the lateral pattern in hi contrast males look like "jewels" or diamonds...
"Red" Rudis... looks pretty mutch like the depicted animal, so that must be the one from kilimanjaro...
And there is one more new undiscribed (.. bitaeniatus complex/rudis subgroup/cf.sternfeldi....ish thing) - from Kenya http://www.teraechis.cz/Web_somalia...Afriky/FOTOGALERIE_HERP/Chamaeleo_Loita_V.jpg
Rough chameleon.... Hmmm if we assume that the this is a cham from the same group... what about maybe schoutedeni or schubotzi ????
Still dont really get the point of theise popnames....
Sang... whatever... Your right... no disrespect to the ADCHAM contributors
- but it must be frustrating that only a handfull of true CCD´s have access to the more advanced infomation, that are readely avalible to the public in europe... thats it !
In the light of the stated purpose, by someone assoiated with ADCHAM in a previous topic i attended. The goal was never to make an "ultimate-up-to-date-guide-to-all-known-infomation-on-chameleons" But rather a startingpoint for the newbie and semi-newbi, to gather valueble infomation on captive maitenence and husbondry. So my opinion is: If you only source of infomation is the ADCHAM website, you dont realy have any predisposition to awnser in advanced topics like taxonomy, zoogeography, speciation, radiation ect....
Last edited:
Susan James
New Member
Niels and all,
We are beginning to assemble a team to update Adcham.com. The effort is being managed by Edward Pollak, PhD and our webmaster, Ping Look. Slow going
. We will be asking for volunteers to contribute, that have the time and experience to donate information to the site. We will certainly ask Trace if she is interested in providing information about the bit complex that she has worked so hard on. And experienced European keepers are more than welcome to contribute if they wish. It will still not be all chameleon things to all people, but a more useful tool to assist the chameleon keeper.
And thank you, Sang.
Susan James
Trace
Captain Awesome
Wow, that's a pretty sexy looking chameleon! Although I'm a little biased towards the whole group.
You brought up the schoutedeni and the schubotzi - two species that I have not been able to work with. They come from such a small area and high altitude that I don't think they are collected at all. Are there any European keepers working with either species?
And not to deviate away from Piercy's original question... I hope you have separated the two (maybe three?) chameleons by now. The rudis require much lower temperatures and higher humidity levels than the Flapneck Chameleon. They come from vastly different areas of mainland Africa and should be kept by themselves with the proper husbandry parameters to ensure their ongoing health and happiness.
Cheers,
t
P.S. Thank you for the compliments Susan.
Niels Pedersen
Established Member
No I dont belive so.
eisentrauti
Avid Member
Hi,
I've talked with Nicola Lutzmann about some problems with the bitaeniatus complex.
He said to me that there were no rudis imported to europe the last years (so there are probably not much in the US) .
He has kept some of the real rudis a few years ago. He also says to me that the climate in the habitat of rudis is very cold, they live in such high regions that most of the catchers didn't even look after them. They take the animals which live at the beginning of the mountains. To get such low temperatures he put them in refrigerators for wine bottles!
I've talked with Nicola Lutzmann about some problems with the bitaeniatus complex.
He said to me that there were no rudis imported to europe the last years (so there are probably not much in the US) .
He has kept some of the real rudis a few years ago. He also says to me that the climate in the habitat of rudis is very cold, they live in such high regions that most of the catchers didn't even look after them. They take the animals which live at the beginning of the mountains. To get such low temperatures he put them in refrigerators for wine bottles!
