Veiled Chameleon Questions/Concerns

[SangrelX]

Chameleon Info:

Your Chameleon: Male Veiled Chameleon (previously thought female Tarsals are growing in enough now to see)
Been in my care for 1 week...

Handling: Little as possible - he has been shifted around a bit lately due to attempting to arrange his cage properly and get a feeding cup situated that he will use

Feeding: 10-20 Small crickets in feeder cup as well as meal worms

Supplements:
Zoomed Calcium Spray no Phosphorus or D3 (daily),
Rep-cal with D3 (Twice Monthly),
Rep-cal Multivitamin (Twice Monthly)

Watering:Dripper and Misting as well as fogger that runs 3 hours a day

Fecal Description: have not found any in cage? weird

History: No significant history - was bought from Petco kept in a very bad setup... He looks healthy and stays active...


Cage Info:

Cage Type: Full mesh cage reptibreeze (OLD MODEL will replace soon) 30L-18D-30H

Lighting: Reptisun 5.0, 100W incadescent basking all on timer will adjust shortly to 12 hour timer

Temperature: 70-85 around cage areas about 90-95 at highest point in basking area -- I keep an eye on temperatures daily and he keeps his skin temperature around 80F by moving around the cage

Humidity: Misting, Dripper, 2 live plants, and Fogger about 55% to 60% humidity

Plants: Live Plants Hibiscus and Pothos

Placement: Cage in 80F Animal room (currently housing Snake, Tarantula, New Cricket colony and 3 Ferrets (dont ASK)

Location: East Coast, USA

Current Issue/Question

A few questions / concerns
1. Feeding... he is having issues using a feeding cup I have recently made a new one cut out like you see people doing with the white milk jugs - this allows crickets to climb around for him to see and shoot I hope this solves that issue please advise!

2. Cage habits... He has taken to climbing to the top of the cage and hanging right below the uvb light.. its a Reptisun 5.0 but he hangs right below it like he is sunning himself on it...? weird

He also hangs below the heat light at random times but he doesnt stay long probably because its a bit hotter then the uvb

NOTE: BOTH Lights are not directly on the mesh of the top of the cage... they are about half inch off the mesh

I snuck into the room to spy on him earlier while he was doing this he was a nice green but when he saw me he turned blackish/gray like he was threatening me or showing signs of being scared... ?

I left him alone and just watched him and when his lights turned out he was still up there.. so im sure he is asleep there right now....

soo those are the major concerns right now -- he is skinny too.. I can see what looks like 2 ribs on each side poking out when he is stretched out like he is too skinny when he is in certain positions i can see all his ribs stretched against his skin..

he is also a bit wrinkled looking.. I have seen him drink once from a leaf and during the day his cage is misted and kept wet and water drops on the leaves so I hope he isnt dehydrated

Any tips, hints, advice Please share it...

 

[camimom]

Chameleon Info:

Your Chameleon: Male Veiled Chameleon (previously thought female Tarsals are growing in enough now to see)
Been in my care for 1 week...

Handling: Little as possible - he has been shifted around a bit lately due to attempting to arrange his cage properly and get a feeding cup situated that he will use

Feeding: 10-20 Small crickets in feeder cup as well as meal worms

Supplements:
Zoomed Calcium Spray no Phosphorus or D3 (daily),
Rep-cal with D3 (Twice Monthly),
Rep-cal Multivitamin (Twice Monthly)

Watering:Dripper and Misting as well as fogger that runs 3 hours a day

Fecal Description: have not found any in cage? weird

History: No significant history - was bought from Petco kept in a very bad setup... He looks healthy and stays active...


Cage Info:

Cage Type: Full mesh cage reptibreeze (OLD MODEL will replace soon) 30L-18D-30H

Lighting: Reptisun 5.0, 100W incadescent basking all on timer will adjust shortly to 12 hour timer

Temperature: 70-85 around cage areas about 90-95 at highest point in basking area -- I keep an eye on temperatures daily and he keeps his skin temperature around 80F by moving around the cage

Humidity: Misting, Dripper, 2 live plants, and Fogger about 55% to 60% humidity

Plants: Live Plants Hibiscus and Pothos

Placement: Cage in 80F Animal room (currently housing Snake, Tarantula, New Cricket colony and 3 Ferrets (dont ASK)

Location: East Coast, USA

Current Issue/Question

A few questions / concerns
1. Feeding... he is having issues using a feeding cup I have recently made a new one cut out like you see people doing with the white milk jugs - this allows crickets to climb around for him to see and shoot I hope this solves that issue please advise!

2. Cage habits... He has taken to climbing to the top of the cage and hanging right below the uvb light.. its a Reptisun 5.0 but he hangs right below it like he is sunning himself on it...? weird

He also hangs below the heat light at random times but he doesnt stay long probably because its a bit hotter then the uvb

NOTE: BOTH Lights are not directly on the mesh of the top of the cage... they are about half inch off the mesh

I snuck into the room to spy on him earlier while he was doing this he was a nice green but when he saw me he turned blackish/gray like he was threatening me or showing signs of being scared... ?

I left him alone and just watched him and when his lights turned out he was still up there.. so im sure he is asleep there right now....

soo those are the major concerns right now -- he is skinny too.. I can see what looks like 2 ribs on each side poking out when he is stretched out like he is too skinny when he is in certain positions i can see all his ribs stretched against his skin..

he is also a bit wrinkled looking.. I have seen him drink once from a leaf and during the day his cage is misted and kept wet and water drops on the leaves so I hope he isnt dehydrated

Any tips, hints, advice Please share it...

congrats on your cham.
first how old is he?
second- his temps are too high. at the highest temp, it should be 85. replace that 100w with a 50-60 watt house bulb.
He will need time to learn to cup feed.
you havent foudn pooop, but that doesnt mean it isnt there. hes prob too small to see it well. gets lost in plants.
babies like to hang upside down, no worries.
turning blackish is him being stressed, you scared him. he doesnt know waht to do with you.
dependin gon how young he is, they always look very skinny, just keep feeding him the way you have, and he will be fine.
as for his skin being wrinkled, he is probably about ot shed.
when you find his poop, the whiteish part, is the urate, his pee. if it is white, he is hydrated, if it is yellow he needs more water. if it is orange, more water asap.


Post a picture!

 

[SangrelX]

Sorry forgot Age -- I honestly dont know the age I think petco got him at 2 weeks or so and I bought him about a week later so if I wagered a real guess I say 6 weeks max

so temps are too high... What temp do these guys keep themselves at as in Skin temperatures? I have a good IR Gun I can read temps with and he maintains himself at 78-81F on skin by moving in and out of the plants

and I am sure i did scare him because I move his cage around a bit too much right now trying to make it work right with drainage, feeding cup, and such

poor guy i feel bad about scaring him

as goofy as it sounds I knew how to read fecal matter lol -- I always watch the ball pythons for any signs of dehydration lol

sooo to recap-- lower temps, give time with new feeding cup, leave him alone for a bit let him finally settle in and dont worry about the hanging on the cage..

im betting the hanging is just like when a human sleeps our eyes tend to stay shut easily because the muscle is naturally closed - I assume their claws and toes are naturally closed meaning when they sleep its a firm grip

i just dont want the guy to fall... I am thankful its a male too so I dont have to worry about a nesting box or Egg issues .. I think pet stores should NOT sell females due to the extra care they take and they ALL need a better education on Chameleon care because let me tell you lol Pet Smart and Petco didnt have any proper information

 

[camimom]

Sorry forgot Age -- I honestly dont know the age I think petco got him at 2 weeks or so and I bought him about a week later so if I wagered a real guess I say 6 weeks max

so temps are too high... What temp do these guys keep themselves at as in Skin temperatures? I have a good IR Gun I can read temps with and he maintains himself at 78-81F on skin by moving in and out of the plants

and I am sure i did scare him because I move his cage around a bit too much right now trying to make it work right with drainage, feeding cup, and such

poor guy i feel bad about scaring him

as goofy as it sounds I knew how to read fecal matter lol -- I always watch the ball pythons for any signs of dehydration lol

sooo to recap-- lower temps, give time with new feeding cup, leave him alone for a bit let him finally settle in and dont worry about the hanging on the cage..

im betting the hanging is just like when a human sleeps our eyes tend to stay shut easily because the muscle is naturally closed - I assume their claws and toes are naturally closed meaning when they sleep its a firm grip

i just dont want the guy to fall... I am thankful its a male too so I dont have to worry about a nesting box or Egg issues .. I think pet stores should NOT sell females due to the extra care they take and they ALL need a better education on Chameleon care because let me tell you lol Pet Smart and Petco didnt have any proper information

I dunno what temp they keep them selves at, however like snakes, they cant really regulate their own temp, no sweating and all. but basking temps should be around 85, i keep mine at 80. If he ever sits there gaping, hes too hot.
ye ano wories about hanging upside down. my boy did it all the time. first time he fell asleep upside down, it scared the hell ou to fme, i thought he would fall.
Yes, females are hard. frankly, i think pet stores like that shouldnt sell chams at all. but it is what it is.

 

[SangrelX]

LOL I checked on him a minute ago he is hanging there all 4 paws upside down with his tail curled up sleeping!!! LMAO
Craziest thing ive ever seen an animal do Sleep upside down !!!

ive never seen him ever gape he is always green and active -- now I do admit he stays a bit lower in the cage then the top half which might be his simple way of saying hey its too hot up there

I think next step is to drop down to a 65w bulb for sure and monitor his new feeding cup - I have been tong feeding about 4 crickets daily before he stops taking em from the tongs -- he takes em from the leaves if I drop one though so I know he is hungry he just needs to figure out the darn feeding cup! lol

Please keep tips and advice coming last thing I want to do is cause this little guy harm.. We have no children and treat our animals as children -- they are all given the best we can give them

 

[camimom]

LOL I checked on him a minute ago he is hanging there all 4 paws upside down with his tail curled up sleeping!!! LMAO
Craziest thing ive ever seen an animal do Sleep upside down !!!

ive never seen him ever gape he is always green and active -- now I do admit he stays a bit lower in the cage then the top half which might be his simple way of saying hey its too hot up there

I think next step is to drop down to a 65w bulb for sure and monitor his new feeding cup - I have been tong feeding about 4 crickets daily before he stops taking em from the tongs -- he takes em from the leaves if I drop one though so I know he is hungry he just needs to figure out the darn feeding cup! lol

Please keep tips and advice coming last thing I want to do is cause this little guy harm.. We have no children and treat our animals as children -- they are all given the best we can give them

Yea they sleep in some of the strangest positions, the curl tailing is normal.
yes, drop the bulb, and him hanging lower in the cage is his way of saying dad im too hot.
good job with tong feeding. it took my guy about 3 weeks to get used to cup feeding.
if you have questions, keep posting or Pm me.

 

[SangrelX]

well it seems everything is being done properly..

Please everyone chime in as well I want as many opinions and as much information as possible lol

 

[SangrelX]

Starting to worry my little Guy is still hanging upside down in the same spot he was in last night directly under the uvb reptisun 5.0 .. its been hours it can't be safe there can it.. to Much uvb and heat I would think..

Should I move him or just let him be .. I mean is he smart enough to move when he needs to

 

[kinyonga]

Are you shutting the lights off at night?

Here's some information I hope will help you with things like supplements, gutloading, etc....
Appropriate cage temperatures aid in digestion and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.

Exposure to UVB from either direct sunlight or a proper UVB light allows the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system to make/keep the bones strong and be used in other systems in the chameleon as well. The UVB should not pass through glass or plastic no matter whether its from the sun or the UVB light. The most often recommended UVB light is the long linear fluorescent Repti-sun 5.0 tube light. Some of the compacts, spirals and tube lights have caused health issues, but so far there have been no bad reports against this one.

A wide variety of insects that have been well fed and gutloaded should be fed to it.

Since many of the feeder insects we use in captivity have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorus in them, its important to dust the insects just before you feed them to the chameleon at most feedings with a phos.-free calcium powder to help make up for it. (I use Rep-cal phosphorus-free calcium).

If you also dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder it will ensure that your chameleon gets some D3 without overdoing it. It leaves the chameleon to produce the rest of what it needs through its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system but D3 produced from exposure to UVB shouldn't as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it. (I use Rep-cal phos.-free calcium/D3).

Dusting twice a month as well with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A will ensure that the chameleon gets some vitamins without the danger of overdosing the vitamin A. PrEformed sources of vitamin A can build up in the system and may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD. However, there is controversy as to whether all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene and so some people give some prEformed vitamin A once in a while. (I use herptivite which has beta carotene.)

Gutloading/feeding the insects well helps to provide what the chameleon needs. I gutload crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms, etc. with an assortment of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, etc.)

Calcium, phos., D3 and vitamin A are important players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon (muscles, etc.) and they need to be in balance. When trying to balance them, you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the insects and what you feed the chameleon.
Please note that various supplements have various amounts of D3 and vitamin A and so some can be given more often than others. The idea still is not to overdo the fat soluble vitamins like D3 and prEformed vitamin A.

Here are some good sites for you to read too...
http://chameleonnews.com/07FebWheelock.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200605020...Vitamin.A.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200406080...d.Calcium.html
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/
http://web.archive.org/web/200601140...ww.adcham.com/
If you can't access the sites above that have the word "archive" in you can do it through the WayBackMachine.

 

[SangrelX]

original post stated the lights are on timers and would be adjusted to 12 hour times

so yes they are turned off at nights

I specifically asked for information on the behavior as in him hanging upside down under the UVB light like its a drug lol

and if he was intelligent enough to move himself if need be or should I go ahead and pull him down myself

he turns himself dark black and shows his white stripes when he see's me looking at him while he hangs there kind of like telling me Hey dont move me im happy here

so i left him alone


However much to my delight when I came home he was on the highest spot right under the basking light
if my temperatures were truly too high wouldnt he be smart enough to move?

it seems like his cricket count went down too now they either jumped out of the cup OR he ate them

its hard to tell but I put more in for him to eat in the morning
I dont see any hanging around the cage floor but they have places to hide (Hibiscus, Pothos)

he is active and seems very healthy
I just want to ensure all that I can do is being done and its being done correctly

so any input on this crazy behavior AND any input on him turning black when he sees me watching him hang on the ceiling would be great -- I assumed his turning black was to warn me away

He does not do that when I watch him on his vines only when he hangs to the ceiling