Trouble with weakness and coordination

[Cml]

Hello
I came home last night and my adult female veiled chameleon was acting very uncoordinated, stumbling over her own front legs ( she almost seems drunk) and having problems with depth perception and grip weakness. We have only had the chameleon for around three weeks. We got her from someone who bought her from petco.
Handling- 3 or 4 times in the 3 weeks we have had her.
Feeding- crickets feed every other day. Crickets are gut loaded with cricket food that has calcium added. Their hydration gel also has calcium added.
Supplements - we haven't done any supplementing. From what I understand, less is more when it comes to supplements and chameleons. The former owner was using calcium supplementation.
Watering - monsoon misting system set to spray every 5 hours for an 18 second duration. Also hand misted 2 times a day. She also has a cup with a hole in the bottom that we put ice in twice a day as a DIY drip system. We have seen her drink.
Fecal Description - Firm brown and white. To our knowledge she has not been tested/treated for parasites.
History- We have only had her for 3 weeks. The reason the former owner was getting rid of her was because he was sick of having to buy crickets. Other wise she seemed very healthy and very pretty. She is pretty huffy ( more of a cold prickly, not really a warm fuzzy)

Cage Info:
Cage Type - XL Zoo-Med Reptibreeze 24x24x48
Lighting - Zilla slimline tropical 25UVB (brand new) zoo-med day blue and red bulb ( red stays on 24 hours) 12 on 12 off schedule for the rest.
Temperature - 71 to 89 from floor to ceiling with the top of the cage at mid level of the room. Night temps don't go below 71. The cage sits on our carpeted floor, on the main level of our house (which has a basement) on an outside wall and next to a heat vent.
Humidity - In the 50s. Humidity is created with combination of monsoon system set to spray every 5 hours and hand misting twice a day.
Plants - There is one plant of an unknown variety.
Placement - The cage sits on our carpeted floor, on the main level of our house (which has a basement) on an outside wall next to a heating vent in our carpeted reptile room.
Geographic location- Minnesota.

Current Problem - she seems weak and when she walks she does so very awkwardly with her front legs folding and buckling. He is also a very dark color and is obsessed with climbing to the bottom of her cage. She is now sitting on her potted plant. I was thinking it could be a problem related to egg laying but wanted to ask the forum and get help.
Any advise I could get would be great.
Thank you

 

[Lathis]

First, welcome to the forum. You've come to the right place. Thanks for filling out the form, too. That will help everyone help you.

I realize you have only had her for a few weeks, so you are learning and getting to know each other, but a couple of big things just out immediately.

A - Supplements. Yes, less is more, but she definitely needs plain calcium (no D3 and no phosphorous) several times a week (easy way to do it is to dust all crickets with the plain calcium). This does a couple of things:

1. Provides her with enough calcium to keep her bones healthy (prevents MBD)
2. Gives her extra calcium to promote proper egg formation (females will lay eggs even without a male present)
3. Balances the feeder insects, especially crickets, which are naturally high in phosphorous, again for bone health

B - She needs a lay bin ASAP. Especially since you may not know how old she is and she is going doing into the plant pots, she could be wanting to lay eggs. If she can't find a suitable place, she may become "egg bound". This can be fatal. Here are some resources to help:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/jannb/345-egg-laying-laying-bin.html

C - Get rid of the red light. Chameleons need total dark at night, no lights at all, and they can see red light. For the day, you can use a regular household light bulb. Nothing fancy needed.

Address those items NOW - don't wait. You will need to also get at least one other supplement - a multivitamin with D3 to use 2x a month. Check the care sheets for specific info.

Then go through the care sheet and information on this forum with a fine tooth comb:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/caresheets/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blo...-keepers-young-veiled-panther-chameleons.html

I do not have a female or a veiled, but this will get you started on the right path until a more experienced keeper can jump in. Best of luck and welcome to the wonderful world of chameleon keeping! Read up on feeders, nutrition, and supplements and ask lots of questions!

 

[rshewfel]

You should read the link on MBD in case this is the problem.

https://www.chameleonforums.com/wha...ase-mbd-looks-like-how-happens-how-fix-95071/

 

[Cml]

Her shortly after getting her

Her shortly after getting her

 

[Cml]

Her last night

Her last night

 

[Cml]

Her 10 minutes ago

Her 10 minutes ago

 

[Cml]

Pic of her cage

Pic of her cage

 

[CoolCham]

Get that laying bin in there, and feed her with some calcium. Looks like the start of MBD

 

[Lathis]

Get that laying bin in there, and feed her with some calcium. Looks like the start of MBD

She looks plunky too - very round about the middle. Eggs are a definite possibility, so get that laying bin together ASAP.

She's a pretty girl. Her joints don't look as bad as some cases that have come to the forum, but CoolCham is right. It could very well be the start of MBD. She'll need a little extra care, but hopefully she can come around. Rshewfel gave you a link to a great info post on MBD.

 

[ridgebax1]

Yes I agree, she needs a lay bin as soon as you can get one in there. I am concerned about the angle and direction of her front legs in the photo with her in the pot. I think she is clearly looking for a place to lay eggs. I am just worried about her front legs, they look like they are bending at odd angles. I also think her all her legs looked swollen in the photo of her on that hammock but that could just be because chams usually do not use those. They are arboreal lizards and are most comfortable with vines and branches to hold on to. They do not like to have a flat surface under them like that.

She probably does have some MBD especially if she has not been getting supplemented while making eggs. Her body will pull the calcium from her bones to use it in egg production. She may even need something more intense like calcium glubionate to replenish her calcium stores.

Here is a link to a video on proper laying bin set up https://www.chameleonforums.com/laying-bin-set-up-educational-video-77225/; plus search through the forum posts, some people put them right in the cage and some put them outside of the cage. Lots of different ways to do so. Just the most important thing too is to give her privacy. She needs to feel safe and secure to lay. If she is disturbed while the process is going on she may abandon egg laying which can also lead to fatal egg binding.

It probably would not hurt to have her seen by a vet to. I keep bumping on those front legs. I am not sure she could even dig properly.

 

[Tay And A]

You really really needed a care sheet before purchasing a Cham. I will gladly give you a free one if you'd like to message me. Looking at your Cham she may need immediate vet care. Looks like her front legs are not properly working.

 

[Lathis]

You really really needed a care sheet before purchasing a Cham. I will gladly give you a free one if you'd like to message me. Looking at your Cham she may need immediate vet care. Looks like her front legs are not properly working.

The OP was given this cham by a friend. I agree with you - research is critical. This situation is a little atypical. Likely she wasn't getting the best care prior to arriving at her new home. The important thing now is that the OP is here getting the proper information.