Tongue issue?

[Syn]

Alright well I'd just like to say I'm having issues typing with this keyboard, had to get a replacement so sorry if I miss any typos while typing this up..

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - 65(?) gallon reptarium. Will be moved into an LLL cage when he gets a bit bigger.
• Lighting - 5.0 Reptisun, unknown wattage house bulb.
• Temperature - 75-85 range in temperatures.
• Humidity - 50-90% humidity at any given time of day, the swamp cooler we have helps, and when I turn my room swamp cooler on it helps to get it up to the 90% humidity..
• Plants - Ficus benjamina, fake vines, wooden sticks for climbing.
• Placement - In my extra bathroom, out of sight, never bothered unless it is for feeding or checking up once-twice daily.
• Location - AZ

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon Veiled Chameleon, Unknown Age, Possible >1Year, Male
• Handling - Once a month to check him out.
• Feeding - Crickets, dubia roaches, things that move enough that he likes. Gutloading with Bug Bread.
• Supplements - Calcium every day not used by other supplement, w/D3 once to twice a month, Herptivite once a month, Minerall I once a month. Fed 12 at a time, or as much as he will eat.
• Watering - Spray 3x a day, for 2 minutes. Swamp cooler helps with any humidity. Drippers are ran during the warmer parts of the day or when I am not home.
• Fecal Description - Perfect, slight yellowing on occasion, not tested for parasites.
• History - This is a rescue chameleon, previously burned, unknown of the conditions before I had him. edit: (other than the vet checkup)
• Current Problem - Said veiled chameleon had gaped at me last night during his checkup, it looked like he had no tongue at all. I have tried to take pictures but I have already been bitten once, and it drew blood, I am reluctant to try again without getting some gardening gloves. However, when he drinks it looks like I can see a tongue but I am not sure how big it is.. I am thinking he may be having some vitamin issues. I have never once seen him shoot his tongue.

A vet visit will have to wait because of a speeding ticket we recently received, and before (as some of you know) we had a gecko prolapse on us. I'm sure you all understand... It's funny how things all happen at once! Thanks.

 

[jojackson]

I was going to say typing with your tongue must be difficult so I will forgive any typos Lol

Whats its behaviour like? How is it eating? Are you bowl feeding, free ranging bugs?
Have you tried hand feeding his favorite feeder, at a distance so he has to shoot?
How long have you had it? why the sudden concern?

 

[Syn]

Behavior is pissy as an adult male Veiled should be. I've never seen him eat, he is looking slightly thinner. I am bowl feeding.. but for some reason I think the crickets are escaping. He will not hand feed and he will not eat from my hand. I can not tell if he has a favorite feeder, and when I stick my hand in the cage he will puff up and hiss..

I've had it.. umm.. not too sure, a month? Two months?

Sudden concern is because last night he puffed up at me and it didn't look like he had a tongue at all, and he is looking somewhat thinner.

Pictures of him: https://www.chameleonforums.com/big-boy-needs-name-25330/

I got him around 5/24

 

[jojackson]

You've had him over a month and you havent seen him eat anything yet? and that didnt bother you, but puffing up did? *shakes head*
When did he crap last?
You rescued this lizard right? A vet checkup would have been a priority, atleast it is now IMHO. You need better than guesswork syn, a vet can open its mouth if your afraid and determin if theres a tongue issue or not, and provide the best advice/treatment if nessesary.
A month without even knowing if its eaten is pretty sloppy husbandry im afraid. If you want to 'rescue' an animal you must also take responsibility, including $financially and timewise.
How do you not notice where feeders are going?

For somebody with a 'zoo', kid, Im surprised.

 

[Syn]

I don't often see my chameleons eat, nor do I see anything but my leos eat, but they gain weight or keep a steady weight so I'm not concerned.

It was NOT the puffing up that concerned me, but the open space in his mouth, no visible tongue, and he looks a bit skinnier, now.

The person who had them before me had a vet checkup. Nothing was wrong, no parasites, nothing!! They were given Silvadine(?) for the burn, however.

He poops EVERYDAY, if not every other day. That's how I know he is eating!!!

Up until this week I had $500 saved for vet bills.
The prolapse cost about 280$, probably more after the interest etc, the ticket, well, I'm not sure. I'm just trying to help my Mom out.
Some money will be paid back, however, but not for some time.

Please, do not take that attitude with me, that is the exact reason I no longer post here. Most people would be grateful that I helped the little guy out.

If you are going to post on this thread, PLEASE OFFER ADVICE, and leave the other comments in your head.

 

[jojackson]

Kid you of all people should know by now, I tell it as I see it! Your a big girl, big enough
to 'rescue' a lizard, big enough to be responsible.

You said

I've never seen him eat, he is looking slightly thinner.

Why? If your monitoring weight, you'll be aware of gain or loss. If its crapping every otherday its eating, but is it eating enough? whats it weigh now? has it gained?

I am bowl feeding.. but for some reason I think the crickets are escaping. He will not hand feed and he will not eat from my hand. I can not tell if he has a favorite feeder

Dont you think if it had a vet check by the last owner, that the vet, or the owner might've noticed if it was lacking a tongue? And if it is lacking a tongue or has an issue with its tongue, dont you think this might be cause for it to be eating less, getting thinner? during the entire month that havent been concerned about not seeing it eating because your finding poo?

Daily observation of it eating, drinking, crapping and basking/moving about is very basic husbandry syn, how the hell else will you notice if theres an issue until another month or two goes by, by which time that $600 is going to be needed! Do you understand this?

As for puffing up, its adult male veiled, so what? Please get someone to help you hold the lizard (with full body armour kevlar and welding gloves if need be) and check out its mouth, SOON! if something looks wrong, off to your vet. ok

 

[Syn]

Thank you for your insight. Anyone else have any input?

 

[Rocky]

Hey, if you are afraid of him biting you put a sock over your hand. That usually works for my pissy veiled. If you need to open his mouth use the blunt rounded side of a credit card to get him to open his mouth. I cant give you any advice other than to take it to a vet. Maybe you should get some hornworms, they will entice him to eat and if he cant shoot he will probably go grab it (my chams usually bit bigger hornworms instead of shooting)

If he doesn't have a tongue you are probably in for a treat. I know some people have had chams live through it, but if you have a lethargic veiled who doesn't like to eat around you you may have some problems getting him to eat.

Also, maybe you should consider adopting him out to someone that can afford to take him to the vet etc. (I believe you have given this advice to other users as well)

 

[bimac6]

honestly i wouldn't consider what jo said of having an 'attitude', since he was just saying it was surprising.
but none of my beeswax!

if the dude is eating without your help then awesome! since you're finding doody, that means he's eating, right?
i've opened up murray's mouth before and i'm pretty sure they're contracted into basically nothing when they're inside their mouth

are you saying that you can't see that blob in there either?
because maybe you're just missing it? idkidk.

Murray is not eating right now, or to my knowledge, he's not.
there's still poo and stuff, but i also hand feed him just in case sometimes.

 

[bimac6]

oh and also! opening mouth!

what I do to check up on him is just touch the back of his casque, in like a pinching way, but don't squeeze down. so just touch either sides of his casque.
he can't get to you and he opens his mouth! vuala!

 

[Syn]

Rocky the money was never a problem until this week. Otherwise I have been fully capable of taking care of him. I've been looking for someone to temporarily take care of him but people are only interested in keeping.

Too hot for hornworms at this point in time, no one will ship them because it is MUCH too hot.. 90-110 easy..

I can't see the "blob", no. Which is odd.

He will open his mouth at me if I get close to him, anytime! I will try to get pictures tomorrow to see if he is any calmer... otherwise I will be getting some heavy duty gloves.

 

[bimac6]

How about when he's sleeping? And since I saw the 'kid' reference, how old are you?

 

[Syn]

Well when I first got him and woke him up because he wasn't looking that great... he ended up thrashing around a bit and he got me good between my fingers.

I'll see what I can do, if anything I will ask a friend to come over and get a second opinion.

 

[bimac6]

Ohjeez. Well since I have such a docile cham, I can't really see that happening lol. But I have had many comments about how sweet Murray is compared to many veileds.

 

[Syn]

Yeah, my first veiled was like that until I stopped handling him every now and then just to keep him somewhat "nice"... but I have since stopped because of the whole stress ordeal.. now he's a mean little sucker.

 

[Sang]

ALright, well after telling sabrina to go ahead and post on teh forums asking for help, since i didn't have any experience in the area. i was hoping for some more positive feedback, obviously that was not given.

i have had my female panther for 2 months, and just today, i finally saw her eat, and it was a pain in the but. some animals won't eat in front of you.
being an animal that normally keeps its mouth shut you may not see the tongue in a calm position, also the tongue from what i have seen moves when they hiss and almost sinks into other tissues.


My concern would be that possibly the tongue was previously amputated, or perhaps there was another problem with the tongue firing mechanism. and if you guys had any idea.


This is the problem, people come here for help, and you know they really don't get it without some Smug fucking attitude. Frankly its killing the forums.

we all own these animals, we all have done our research and we all have different situations and events that may affect our knowledge and ability to keep/care. its not fair to any one keeper to make snap decisions. YOU all have done something wrong in the past, lets not forget were we all came from at one point or another.

 

[kinyonga]

He could have his tongue stored down the hole in his throat when he's gaping at you. If he has no tongue and he's eating/pooping, then it shouldn't really matter....other than it will make it a little harder for him to lick up water. He should still havet the hyoid spike with some skin over it if he has lost his tongue....and he should be able to lick water up with that.

IMHO if you let him get a bit hungray and then can hold an insect between your fingers in front of him then if he has a tongue he should shoot it out to get the insect. It would be a lot less stressful than trying to open his mouth only to not be able to see if he has a tongue or not because its stored in his throat while gaping. Hope you understand what I mean??

 

[Syn]

Kinyonga that makes sense! I am reluctant to starve him if I am not seeing him eat in the first place, however.

How long would you suggest not feeding him to see if he will eat? What if he will not eat even if "starved"?

Thank you very much. I will try to get a picture tomorrow, if not tomorrow then perhaps Sunday.

 

[Syn]

Okay I got nipped but I got some pictures, I will edit this image and upload them after I adjust the lighting.

Okay stupid question, and I'm sure the answer is simple and I will be scolded later for not knowing.. but WHAT is that hole?

Also.. I think I see where the tongue is.. so perhaps false alarm?
In the first place I was more worried about the hole being where the tongue was removed, but now I think I see a tongue.

 

[lanceman]

This is the problem, people come here for help, and you know they really don't get it

I agree with ya sang. Thanks to those who do try like kinyonga else it wouldnt be worth readin anymore