Thinking of going glass...need input!

[smpliprfct]

I have a male jackson's that is pushing a little over one year and is currently housed in the classic screened cage as are all my other chameleons. The problem is that his humidity is the BIGGEST pain - even with a humidifier, mist king and dripper!!! While these things added with several sides of his enclosure being plastic wrapped keep him in the 60-80% range it still drops and is inconsistent more than i want. So instead of busting my hump and having a really unsightly cage (NOT THAT THAT IS MORE IMPORTANT THAN HIM) I was wondering if anyone keeps their jackson's in glass? I recently read a post that a quad might be happy in that terrarium so am i wrong in thinking that jackson could be kept in the same? Where would I order a glass cage that has the proper ventilation for him and room for the mist king? Is this just a pipe dream? Any input would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Mr Wilson]

We switched FROM a glass enclosure to a screened after our veiled, Rosalita, got sick and died.

We are also have a terrible time keeping the humidity up. Though I don't think the hydrometer is really right. We have the sensor in the upper right corner of the tank and it's almost always saying 10%. When we mist with the plastic around 3 sides we get it up to about 60% but it does tend to drop pretty quickly. We check the humidity with an analog hydrometer as well, we put it right into Shooter's feeding cup and basking area (since that's where the fatty tends to hang out) and that tends to read around 50%-60%.

 

[Syn]

We switched FROM a glass enclosure to a screened after our veiled, Rosalita, got sick and died.

Please remember veileds are vastly different from jacksons, which are a montane species. I can't offer much else on the subject, however, because I have not owned any montane species.

 

[Mr Wilson]

Please remember veileds are vastly different from jacksons, which are a montane species. I can't offer much else on the subject, however, because I have not owned any montane species.

Ah yeah, I guess that is true. I just know that from the info Jim from Chameleon Company gave me, the biggest issue with glass enclosures is that they do not provide enough air flow and ventilation, even with a screen top, and that they tend to allow bacteria to grow faster because they hold in so much moisture.

 

[Syn]

Ah yeah, I guess that is true. I just know that from the info Jim from Chameleon Company gave me, the biggest issue with glass enclosures is that they do not provide enough air flow and ventilation, even with a screen top, and that they tend to allow bacteria to grow faster because they hold in so much moisture.

That's an aquarium, not a terrarium. (I think)

You are correct in saying there is not enough air flow even with a screen top, but with things like the exo terra terrariums, etc.. they also have other areas where there is air flow, so it doesn't restrict it.

See this post:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/eve...-chameleons-glass-31937/?highlight=glass+cage

 

[fowlers]

i keep hoehnelii in glass enclosures, as long as there is mesh at the front and top you should be ok, the exo terra terrariums should be ok too as they are front ventilated, just make sure they dry out before mistings. i even keep my panthers in more or less the same enclosures as the hoehnelii and they do great as well

also the only problem i have at the minute is raising the humidity at night for the hoehnelii, but hopefully should be getting a fogger soon, to see if it sorts the problem

rob

 

[Mr Wilson]

That's an aquarium, not a terrarium. (I think)

You are correct in saying there is not enough air flow even with a screen top, but with things like the exo terra terrariums, etc.. they also have other areas where there is air flow, so it doesn't restrict it.

See this post:
https://www.chameleonforums.com/eve...-chameleons-glass-31937/?highlight=glass+cage

Ours was the exo terra terrarium. I'm just speaking from my own experience with the terrarium. The major issue we actually had with the terrarium was that while they did have vents for air flow, the crickets were able to escape from the vents, and I'm talking 1/2" crickets or bigger. So our issue then became "Do we allow crickets to escape and run around our house or do we somehow block the vents so that the crickets do not escape." We did end up blocking them (they were honestly small vents anyway, I can't imagine how much "air flow" they actually provided, given the entire top was screen). The other issue with the exo terra is the back of it is a piece of styrofoam that the chameleon could climb around on which was GREAT. The issue was that at the bottom on the right and left sides, there were openings that then went along the entire back of the styrofoam that we had to block because the crickets would find their way into the holes then climb up the back and get wedged between the foam and the glass.

 

[Syn]

Ours was the exo terra terrarium. I'm just speaking from my own experience with the terrarium. The major issue we actually had with the terrarium was that while they did have vents for air flow, the crickets were able to escape from the vents, and I'm talking 1/2" crickets or bigger. So our issue then became "Do we allow crickets to escape and run around our house or do we somehow block the vents so that the crickets do not escape." We did end up blocking them (they were honestly small vents anyway, I can't imagine how much "air flow" they actually provided, given the entire top was screen). The other issue with the exo terra is the back of it is a piece of styrofoam that the chameleon could climb around on which was GREAT. The issue was that at the bottom on the right and left sides, there were openings that then went along the entire back of the styrofoam that we had to block because the crickets would find their way into the holes then climb up the back and get wedged between the foam and the glass.

In that case you really can not blame the terrarium. The "small holes" do make a difference! If anything, you could have been cup feeding.

With that being said, I can understand completely why there wasn't enough air flow. You basically turned it into an aquarium.

Just a question for you as well, did you let the aquarium dry out between mistings, or did it even have enough time to dry out?
I'm not trying to scold you or anything, I am just trying to help you (and everyone else) understand why there wasn't enough air flow and could have made your chameleon sick.

 

[Mr Wilson]

We did allow it to dry out, as well as cleaned it every week to week and a half by cleaning out all of the substrate (we use coconut husk to help absorb any excess moisture as well as keep humidity levels) and using a terrarium cleaner by Zilla.

We did cup feed, but every once in a while they did escape. The whole front of the top screen part was wide open, so I guess we figured they didn't really do much damage. Hopefully we weren't the actual reason Rosie died. We did get her from a Pet Store (I know, bad idea) and the one in the "tank" with her at the store had died in the tank, so that should have really been a warning to us.

I just really wanted to give my input on the way the exo terra is built though. I would imagine the Jackson chams need a lot of air flow as well though, no?

 

[Syn]

I'm sure the OP is glad you posted your opinion, then.

As far as coconut husk goes, I am almost sure it is an impaction risk (as is most other substrate).
Perhaps your cup was a little shallow, next time a deeper cup can be used.
As was said, you did cover a lot of ventilation, but as to why Rosie had passed away, I am not a vet and could not tell you.

Use this as a learning opportunity.

 

[sandrachameleon]

I have a male jackson's that is pushing a little over one year and is currently housed in the classic screened cage as are all my other chameleons. The problem is that his humidity is the BIGGEST pain ....

I dont own a jack. What i am about to describe is from an aquaintance (person at my workplace) who has one. I visited this guys place only a couple times. but we talk chameleons often, and I feel he knows what he's doing.

His chameleon is kept in a large cage that has solid sides, a solid back, and sliding glass doors on front. The top is screen. there are multiple ventilation points (screen covered holes) on both sides, several near the bottom, several mid way up, and a couple near the top. these circular vents each have a plastic cover thingy you can use to restrict/reduce the ventilation points. Anyhow, mr.Jackson (the guys chameleon) looks healthy to me, and is a couple years old now.
hope that helps.

 

[kinyonga]

I've kept dwarf jackson's in glass cages for years and as long as you make sure that the basking light is to one side/corner of the cage and you don't leave water laying stagnant on the floor of the cage there should be no problem.

Mr Wilson....just because your chameleon lived and died in a glass cage doesn't prove that the cage was the reason. Both it and the one in the store in the glass cage could have been sick and died from that. Did you have an autopsy done?

 

[Leilaskeeper]

I can add my two cents in regarding exo terra glass enclosures. I own one.

Air flow is SO important and the Exo Terra enclosure works great - you just have to work with it. If you're using coco substrate or organic soil or whatever, you need proper drainage. Brad Ramsey has often suggested to myself and others to use hydroton, charcoal and soil (all separated by screen). While this option is successful, I have also found much success with just using rocks below my organic soil. Whichever option you choose, they both offer dry soil between mistings which decreases your risk of mold growth substantially. Every week or two, I comb through the soil and pat it down.

As for the background, yes there is an issue with crickets getting behind the wall. I've dealt with this by blocking them with my vines. I no longer have this issue. I free range, cup feed and hand feed.

Other than that, I can see how you could potentially put your cham at risk by blocking the air vents. Stagnant air can potentially cause respiratory issues which could have possibly been the reason why your cham died unfortunately. Did you have conclusive evidence as to your chams death? Can you confirm that the reason he/she died was directly related to the enclosure? I ask this because I stand behind Exo Terra product 100% and I think with proper care and maintenance, it makes an excellent home for a chameleon. If someone can show me evidence that their product is directly responsible for a chams death, I would not sell this product to herp enthusiasts.

 

[Leilaskeeper]

We did allow it to dry out, as well as cleaned it every week to week and a half by cleaning out all of the substrate (we use coconut husk to help absorb any excess moisture as well as keep humidity levels) and using a terrarium cleaner by Zilla.

We did cup feed, but every once in a while they did escape. The whole front of the top screen part was wide open, so I guess we figured they didn't really do much damage. Hopefully we weren't the actual reason Rosie died. We did get her from a Pet Store (I know, bad idea) and the one in the "tank" with her at the store had died in the tank, so that should have really been a warning to us.

I just really wanted to give my input on the way the exo terra is built though. I would imagine the Jackson chams need a lot of air flow as well though, no?

I just have to note that you did admit to blocking the front vent near the bottom where the door lock is located. The purpose of that vent is so the air can enter and be released from the top screen. Because you blocked the lower vent, air was not able to 'flow' through and that could be why your cham died. Please do not discredit Exo Terra product for your inability to use the product properly. You should have called Exo Terra with your concerns so they could properly advise you on your mistake.

 

[Zen Reptiles]

Haven't read all the replies, just wanted to add my input.

I would use glass for jacksonii, but with ventilation on the BOTTOM and top.

3 or 4 inches of screen on the bottom, and just a screen top.

You might also want to add a single computer fan (or similar sized fan) at the top or bottom. A good company that makes them is Silenx http://www.silenx.com/index.asp

Humidity will be kept in longer with the glass, but if the fan is set on low with a dimmer or something, it will prevent it from getting too muggy in there.