So another question? Mixing animals?
- Thread starter Whatcamo
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Whatcamo
New Member
Correct me if I'm wrong but my friend that has a lot of dart frogs says they don't secrete the toxins anymore do to being captive bred and the lack of natural prey that helps them build the toxins?
Josh diegosuarez
New Member
Darts would not thrive in a chameleon environment and a chameleon would not thrive in a dart environment. The humidity is the biggest problem there. Darts needs a practically completely enclosed glass cage to keep humidity near 100% and they can't handle heat. A cham needs air flow and heat. And toxic or not, your cham will eat every frog they see! They don't differentiate between small moving things. Small and moving = food. That's an expensive snack that's not very good for your cham.
Mixing animals is generally frowned upon because it is an incredibly difficult and ADVANCED thing to do.
The poison issue, as you pointed out, is true if the frogs come from a long enough line. You still have the issue of your cham eating your valueable darts.
i was about to make a lengthier post but I see ferretinmyshoes has already nailed most of the basics...
even if you were to find two species that have the same care requirements, you must then consider their territory within the enclosure and also make sure that none of their defensive territory overlaps.
Even if those are considered, care must be considered for cross-species infections and contaminations; something that is harmless or even beneficial to one species can on occasion be deadly to another.
The poison issue, as you pointed out, is true if the frogs come from a long enough line. You still have the issue of your cham eating your valueable darts.
i was about to make a lengthier post but I see ferretinmyshoes has already nailed most of the basics...
even if you were to find two species that have the same care requirements, you must then consider their territory within the enclosure and also make sure that none of their defensive territory overlaps.
Even if those are considered, care must be considered for cross-species infections and contaminations; something that is harmless or even beneficial to one species can on occasion be deadly to another.
Olimpia
Biologist & Ecologist
Yea, as a student on a limited budget I just cringe thinking about a $50 frog ending up as lunch! lol Poor things, they're so pretty, I'd hate to risk it. An like others have said they wouldn't do well together.
If you had the space for something more closely resembling a zoo exhibit, like a room-sized cage fully planted and naturalistic you could perhaps research mixing species that belong to the same ecosystem, say panthers and giant day geckos, like grandis, who are more humid-loving. Perhaps, it's the first combo that pops into my head but I'd have to look into it.
But it would have to be considering the environment of each species, trying to combine only those that would live in the same niche together in the wild. Otherwise one will suffer while one does well.
Obviously zoos do it successfully, if the day ever comes to try something like this in enough space it wouldn't hurt to get a hold of the people in change of those exhibits and e-mail/call them to get their tips and experiences. Most people are more than happy to share info, so it's worth a try to see what they have together and how they do it.
If you had the space for something more closely resembling a zoo exhibit, like a room-sized cage fully planted and naturalistic you could perhaps research mixing species that belong to the same ecosystem, say panthers and giant day geckos, like grandis, who are more humid-loving. Perhaps, it's the first combo that pops into my head but I'd have to look into it.
But it would have to be considering the environment of each species, trying to combine only those that would live in the same niche together in the wild. Otherwise one will suffer while one does well.
Obviously zoos do it successfully, if the day ever comes to try something like this in enough space it wouldn't hurt to get a hold of the people in change of those exhibits and e-mail/call them to get their tips and experiences. Most people are more than happy to share info, so it's worth a try to see what they have together and how they do it.
pssh
Avid Member
While I wouldn't recommend it, it is possible to house dart frogs and pygmy chameleons together with enough space. However, if you have to ask if the general concept is okay, you shouldn't be trying it. Even incredibly experienced keepers can have troubles with housing multiple animals together, so as a newer keeper, it is likely to end in failure with one or more of the animals dying or becoming ill.
Zen Reptiles
Avid Member
The only chameleons and dart frogs that could live in harmony would be some pygmy chameleons and some Mantella dart frogs. The Mantellas (like milotympanum for example) can take some airflow and dry periods, unlike most other Dentrobatids.
In a word, though. No.
I have seen large day geckos and adult male panther chameleons living together. This wasn't by choice of the keeper....a huge male grandis simply escaped one day and was living in a panther cage for a few months.
So based on seeing it with my own eyes, that's the only mix I would ever say could work with chameleons.
In a word, though. No.
I have seen large day geckos and adult male panther chameleons living together. This wasn't by choice of the keeper....a huge male grandis simply escaped one day and was living in a panther cage for a few months.
So based on seeing it with my own eyes, that's the only mix I would ever say could work with chameleons.
Maurer3D
New Member
Definitely a bad Idea.... But you could build the cages on top of each other and make it appear that its one cage. If you want to make it more authentic you would do Mantellas as Dart Frogs are from South America and Panthers are from Africa and Madagascar.
Basically you would just construct the cages with a buffer for lights misters and heat between them. I built something like that for Red-Eye Tree Frogs and Dart Frogs when I was younger.
This is the basis design of what I am talking about.
Basically you would just construct the cages with a buffer for lights misters and heat between them. I built something like that for Red-Eye Tree Frogs and Dart Frogs when I was younger.
This is the basis design of what I am talking about.
djfishygillz
Avid Member
Definitely a bad Idea.... But you could build the cages on top of each other and make it appear that its one cage. If you want to make it more authentic you would do Mantellas as Dart Frogs are from South America and Panthers are from Africa and Madagascar.
Basically you would just construct the cages with a buffer for lights misters and heat between them. I built something like that for Red-Eye Tree Frogs and Dart Frogs when I was younger.
This is the basis design of what I am talking about.
Cool idea, if I was into frogs I would steal that idea in a heart beat. Good post all together
Lizardlover
New Member
Dart frogs, aside from possibly mantellas, would not work with any species of chameleon. However, I think that in captivity it is best to keep species seperate especially those that require such different care. Also, pardalis only come from Madagascar, not Africa and Madagascar.
