Skin Problem

[Redmuzza]

Hi Guys , have a 41/2 year old male panther. Eating and pooing normally, no change in normal temperament. He has started with a skin issue down his back. Any advice much appreciated.
Cheers Pete

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi. That looks like a thermal burn and a pretty bad one. You most definitely need a good vet who will provide some silver sulfadiazine cream and possibly oral antibiotics as well. How close is your basking light to basking branches? Can you post some pics of your enclosure? What are basking temps?

 

[Redmuzza]

Thanks for the reply. Basking temp is usually 27 28 degrees and there is a mesh between the heater and uv lights.

 

[Redmuzza]

Vivarium. Mistking system and air flow fans.

 

[MissSkittles]

Your basking temp is good, but your cham sits way too close to the light/top. There should be around 20-22 cm between basking branch and lights. You want that distance for correct uvb levels as well (assuming you’re using a T5 with either 5.0 or 6% bulb). If you have any silver sulfadiazine on hand, you can apply a thin layer over the burn. Neosporin (without pain relief) can also be applied, just until you can get to the vet. The burned dead tissue is already starting to lift, so be careful not to pull at it.

 

[Beman]

Are you using a ceramic heat emitter?

 

[MissSkittles]

Vivarium. Mistking system and air flow fans.

Do you have an intentional water feature or is that drainage that hasn’t been eliminated yet? What are your humidity levels? Do you have a clean up crew?

 

[Redmuzza]

Are you using a ceramic heat emitter?

Hi, yes I am

Do you have an intentional water feature or is that drainage that hasn’t been eliminated yet? What are your humidity levels? Do you have a clean up crew?

yes it’s an intentional water feature that runs thru a filter. I have a clean up crew and the humidity in between mists is around 70-80%

 

[Beman]

Hi, yes I am

Ok this is why he has the thermal burn all along the spine. CHE are dangerous with chams if they are not used at an acceptable distance. They cause thermal burns because the temps they produce are very high. With a cham only needing a basking spot of 80-85 max and a distance between the cham and the fixture being at least 9 inches away.
You want to get him into a reptile vet and get them to prescribe silver sulfadiazine cream for the topical treatment of the burn. They may need to give you antibiotics as well as that is a pretty severe thermal burn and infection is very possible. He will lose that entire area of tissue due to the burn.

 

[MissSkittles]

Hi, yes I am

yes it’s an intentional water feature that runs thru a filter. I have a clean up crew and the humidity in between mists is around 70-80%

That’s really on the high side for humidity. Ideal is between 50-70% during the day for panthers, so you’re pushing it. I see what looks like a fan on top - am I correct? If not, adding one to draw the air out to increase air circulation is needed. High humidity + high heat + lower ventilation of a glass enclosure is a recipe for respiratory infection. Is there any reason in particular that you have the water feature? Things like that serve no purpose for a chameleon and can increase risks of harm (increased humidity, bacteria, etc).

 

[ClumsyChameleonMama]

Ok this is why he has the thermal burn all along the spine. CHE are dangerous with chams if they are not used at an acceptable distance. They cause thermal burns because the temps they produce are very high. With a cham only needing a basking spot of 80-85 max and a distance between the cham and the fixture being at least 9 inches away.
You want to get him into a reptile vet and get them to prescribe silver sulfadiazine cream for the topical treatment of the burn. They may need to give you antibiotics as well as that is a pretty severe thermal burn and infection is very possible. He will lose that entire area of tissue due to the burn.

Even on a thermostat? Sorry to jump in I'm a new owner and have a ceramic heat bulb ATM for my guy, his branch is 9 inches away from the CHE and the thermostat probe is set to 30, placed directly under the CHE on the branch

 

[CalamityCrow]

Even on a thermostat? Sorry to jump in I'm a new owner and have a ceramic heat bulb ATM for my guy, his branch is 9 inches away from the CHE and the thermostat probe is set to 30, placed directly under the CHE on the branch

I would honestly just get an incandescent light bulb and monitor the heat from that. Not only does it provide more light but they don't tend to get too hot. Also they're quite inexpensive. I'd also lower it to 28 or so. 30 starts getting into the "too warm" range.

 

[Beman]

Even on a thermostat? Sorry to jump in I'm a new owner and have a ceramic heat bulb ATM for my guy, his branch is 9 inches away from the CHE and the thermostat probe is set to 30, placed directly under the CHE on the branch

Hi there welcome to the forum. So the reason why CHE are dangerous is due to the heat output it is to me like sitting in front of a space heater. The heat is far more intense. As you can see in this thread this is what can happen quite easily with these bulbs. So we lean towards a regular incandescent bulb instead because they do not have that focused heat index. If your looking at nine inches to basking branch and setting your thermostat for 30c then that is sitting already at 86 just at the branch... But as you rise up the heat gets far hotter. So say the cham comes up off the branch 3 inches they are sitting in more like 33c. Which at that distance and temps your higher risk for a thermal burn. A regular incandescent bulb with the thermostat set at roughly 28c is going to then put the actual exposure at 30 where they rise up. So still within safe basking levels.
There are also arguments about them not seeing light and being able to differentiate and understand that is an area of heat for them. Which if you think about it you know if you stand in the sun your going to be warmer than if you stand under a tree in the shade. They do this as well. Moving down into their plants to cool off.

CHE have their place in the hobby. Say in winter you just can not keep your enclosure within limits at night because your temps drop below 50-55F and you want to just warm it up a bit to 60F this is when a CHE is helpful. Because they do not put out light to disrupt sleep.

 

[ClumsyChameleonMama]

Hi there welcome to the forum. So the reason why CHE are dangerous is due to the heat output it is to me like sitting in front of a space heater. The heat is far more intense. As you can see in this thread this is what can happen quite easily with these bulbs. So we lean towards a regular incandescent bulb instead because they do not have that focused heat index. If your looking at nine inches to basking branch and setting your thermostat for 30c then that is sitting already at 86 just at the branch... But as you rise up the heat gets far hotter. So say the cham comes up off the branch 3 inches they are sitting in more like 33c. Which at that distance and temps your higher risk for a thermal burn. A regular incandescent bulb with the thermostat set at roughly 28c is going to then put the actual exposure at 30 where they rise up. So still within safe basking levels.
There are also arguments about them not seeing light and being able to differentiate and understand that is an area of heat for them. Which if you think about it you know if you stand in the sun your going to be warmer than if you stand under a tree in the shade. They do this as well. Moving down into their plants to cool off.

CHE have their place in the hobby. Say in winter you just can not keep your enclosure within limits at night because your temps drop below 50-55F and you want to just warm it up a bit to 60F this is when a CHE is helpful. Because they do not put out light to disrupt sleep.

Cool thank you. I'll be changing his heat lamp to an incandescent as I also posed the same question into the sub-editor r/chameleons to find out there and got told pretty much the same thing. I have another CHE so will keep that one boxed until I need it, I've only had my guy for 3 days and even with 3 months of research I'm happy I'm still learning

 

[Beman]

Cool thank you. I'll be changing his heat lamp to an incandescent as I also posed the same question into the sub-editor r/chameleons to find out there and got told pretty much the same thing. I have another CHE so will keep that one boxed until I need it, I've only had my guy for 3 days and even with 3 months of research I'm happy I'm still learning

I am now over 5 years into the hobby and I still learn new stuff. I think that is one of the most important things about keeping chameleons. Continue to learn and grow it will just make you more prepared and help you understand your cham even more. Please post a thread if you would like to get additional help or a review of your husbandry.

 

[ClumsyChameleonMama]

I am now over 5 years into the hobby and I still learn new stuff. I think that is one of the most important things about keeping chameleons. Continue to learn and grow it will just make you more prepared and help you understand your cham even more. Please post a thread if you would like to get additional help or a review of your husbandry.

Update on this. I realised how bad the heat was from the CHE this morning when I removed it to replace with the basking lamp... it melted my dressing gown I replaced with the basking lamp and then had to buy the dimming thermostat as my original was on/off which left about 5 seconds in between each on off cycle he's now happily basking away and has turned a much better colouration

 

[elizaann2]

Update on this. I realised how bad the heat was from the CHE this morning when I removed it to replace with the basking lamp... it melted my dressing gown I replaced with the basking lamp and then had to buy the dimming thermostat as my original was on/off which left about 5 seconds in between each on off cycle he's now happily basking away and has turned a much better colouration

I'm happy to hear that! Sorry about your dressing gown though

 

[Beman]

Update on this. I realised how bad the heat was from the CHE this morning when I removed it to replace with the basking lamp... it melted my dressing gown I replaced with the basking lamp and then had to buy the dimming thermostat as my original was on/off which left about 5 seconds in between each on off cycle he's now happily basking away and has turned a much better colouration

Love that you got the new fixture. Sorry for your gown. Sucks. Temps should sit much better for him. Should see better coloring and more activity with temps being reduced.