I have raised panthers and veiled for several years with very little problems. Does anyone have any experience with the above variety? What are the chances that I could raise these with my limited experience? What is the longevity of these varieties? Special requirements? Any info would be helpfull. I don't want to get in over my head. David
rudis or elliott's
- Thread starter dectr6
- Start date
Trace
Captain Awesome
Hey there! 
Did someone say rudis and/or ellioti? I work exclusively with the bitaeniatus and related species. I think they are the coolest, bestest chameleons around.
Both I find are pretty easy to deal with in captivity. I kept mine in the same conditions and both thrived and bred for me. Both are what I consider a "communal" chameleon and by that I mean a male and a harem of females can live together in an appropriate sized cage. I will qualify this though and say: if you (or any of you reading this) does not already have extensive chameleon experience, then please house the rudis and ellioti individually. Both species breed several times a year and don't need seasonal cycling for it... unlike say the goetzei and true bitaeniatus that are part of that family. Live bearing babies are a little more touchy care wise than the ubiquitous pardalis and calyptratus. The rudis and ellioti babies can be kept together at birth, but I find that separate caging immediately reduces early infant death. Both species readily accept any appropriate sized feeders and they start eating immediately after birth. Like within minutes it seems
Clutch size ranges from 2 to 20ish individuals and can be sexed at birth if you know what you are looking for, otherwise they are easily sexed after aboot 3 months. Sexual maturity is aboot 6 months.
A couple of years. Not a long time like the bigger species that you are used to working with.
Cool and humid. Cool and humid. Cool and humid. Did I mention both like it cool and humid? Nothing over 80F ever and don't let it drop less than 70% humidity EVER. If you can't provide those conditions then you will not be successful with either.
I also noticed your thread on First Choice Reptiles... any of the rudis, ellioti and hoehnelii from Nick will be WC from him so prepared for that headache. I'm sure you've read the horror stories aboot working with wild caughts. Ask yourself if you are ready for that.
I've answered your questions as best I can, but if you have more specific ones aboot any of the species, please ask.
Cheers!
t
Did someone say rudis and/or ellioti? I work exclusively with the bitaeniatus and related species. I think they are the coolest, bestest chameleons around.
Both I find are pretty easy to deal with in captivity. I kept mine in the same conditions and both thrived and bred for me. Both are what I consider a "communal" chameleon and by that I mean a male and a harem of females can live together in an appropriate sized cage. I will qualify this though and say: if you (or any of you reading this) does not already have extensive chameleon experience, then please house the rudis and ellioti individually. Both species breed several times a year and don't need seasonal cycling for it... unlike say the goetzei and true bitaeniatus that are part of that family. Live bearing babies are a little more touchy care wise than the ubiquitous pardalis and calyptratus. The rudis and ellioti babies can be kept together at birth, but I find that separate caging immediately reduces early infant death. Both species readily accept any appropriate sized feeders and they start eating immediately after birth. Like within minutes it seems
Clutch size ranges from 2 to 20ish individuals and can be sexed at birth if you know what you are looking for, otherwise they are easily sexed after aboot 3 months. Sexual maturity is aboot 6 months. A couple of years. Not a long time like the bigger species that you are used to working with.
Cool and humid. Cool and humid. Cool and humid. Did I mention both like it cool and humid? Nothing over 80F ever and don't let it drop less than 70% humidity EVER. If you can't provide those conditions then you will not be successful with either.
I also noticed your thread on First Choice Reptiles... any of the rudis, ellioti and hoehnelii from Nick will be WC from him so prepared for that headache. I'm sure you've read the horror stories aboot working with wild caughts. Ask yourself if you are ready for that.
I've answered your questions as best I can, but if you have more specific ones aboot any of the species, please ask.
Cheers!
t
Thanks for all the answers Trace. I'm glad you told me about the wild caught thing. I don't want any wc animals for a variety of reasons. Are cb animals easy to find? Do you have any names? Thanks again. I may email you for more in depth questions. You seem to know what your talking about. It kind of bums me about how long they live though. I seem to really get attached to these little animals. David
Trace
Captain Awesome
Hey David!
I thought I replied to your questions already. My apologies!
I'm glad you are not into buying WC animals. The whole WC trade is sort of a sore point with me these days so I applaud your reluctance.
Sadly I can't think of any CB or CH rudis, hoenelii and ellioti of late. Heika (from here) has some of my original ellioti and has produced babies from them so perhaps shoot her a PM aboot offspring? Mike at FLChams for some CH/CB rudis maybe? I can't think of anyone who is working with any seriousness with the bitaeniatus critters.
I'm happy to answer questions any time aboot the bitaeniatus complex so fire away if you have more.
Cheers!
t
I thought I replied to your questions already. My apologies!
I'm glad you are not into buying WC animals. The whole WC trade is sort of a sore point with me these days so I applaud your reluctance.
Sadly I can't think of any CB or CH rudis, hoenelii and ellioti of late. Heika (from here) has some of my original ellioti and has produced babies from them so perhaps shoot her a PM aboot offspring? Mike at FLChams for some CH/CB rudis maybe? I can't think of anyone who is working with any seriousness with the bitaeniatus critters.
I'm happy to answer questions any time aboot the bitaeniatus complex so fire away if you have more.
Cheers!
t
Kent67
Retired Moderator
Can you tell us what it is "about" them that you like so much? I've only had a few from that complex over the years and although I like them, there didn't seem to be anything that different or special "about" them , other than maybe their size. Just curious "about" your preferences.
Cheers!
I like the fact that they are small and don't tend to have the head adornments or nose appendages. I think those like the mellers with that type of nose are REALLY ugly. I like that they tend to be more colorfull than say the pygmy type. Just a personal preference I guess. My favorite species is the Bradypodion thamnobates, but from what I hear they are all but impossible to obtain. thanks david
Trace
Captain Awesome
Moi?
I'm all abewt the bitaeniatus eh. Just abewt everyone knows that eh. I've been lucky enough to acquire all of the common and just abewt all of the uncommon members of that closely knit family and I enjoy comparing and contrasting said group eh. I'm also keenly interested in locality data, scale counts, gular patches etc. as I think the entire group needs further or clearer definitions concerned the different species eh. Read: I'm abewt as nerdy as they get eh. ZZZZZZZZZZ eh.
If there are any members working with the bitaeniatus, goetzei, ellioti etc. I'm interested in hearing your thoughts abewt them.
In the meantime, bitaeniatus eye-candy eh!
Chameleo trioceros bitaeniatus:
Chameleo trioceros rudis sternfeldi (red phase)
Chameleo trioceros ellioti (blue phase)
Chameleo trioceros goetzei goetzei
Cheers!
t
I'm all abewt the bitaeniatus eh. Just abewt everyone knows that eh. I've been lucky enough to acquire all of the common and just abewt all of the uncommon members of that closely knit family and I enjoy comparing and contrasting said group eh. I'm also keenly interested in locality data, scale counts, gular patches etc. as I think the entire group needs further or clearer definitions concerned the different species eh. Read: I'm abewt as nerdy as they get eh. ZZZZZZZZZZ eh.
If there are any members working with the bitaeniatus, goetzei, ellioti etc. I'm interested in hearing your thoughts abewt them.
In the meantime, bitaeniatus eye-candy eh!
Chameleo trioceros bitaeniatus:
Chameleo trioceros rudis sternfeldi (red phase)
Chameleo trioceros ellioti (blue phase)
Chameleo trioceros goetzei goetzei
Cheers!
t
Trace
Captain Awesome
PFFT. YEAH! Who needs parsonii?
Yes you do! I believe LLL just got some fresh imports in as well! How fortuitous... you could start cycling them now for spring breeding.
Thanks for the compliment! Right now I'm shooting with a Nikon D50 with either the AF-S DX Zoom-NIKKOR 18-70mm f/3.5-4.5G IF-ED for regular work and the Tamron SP AF90mm F/2.8 Di Macro Lens 1:1 for my close up pics. Honestly though, I think some of those pics were taken with my old Fuji point and shoot!
Cheers!
t
