Proper Chameleon Habitat

[hljohnson28]

Hi guys I'm a first time Chameleon owner, I went to my local Texas reptile store to purchase my juvenile Jacksons Chameleon (named Samuel L Jackson) I know that the shop owner is an expert when it comes to all reptiles and I trust his opinion which is why I was confused (after much research) he told me that he does not use or sell mesh/wire cages for chams. I was confused until he said that here in Texas the circulation of a mesh cage lets out too much heat/humidity and that he had lost three chameleons to a mesh cage he also stated their claws can be ripped out and infection of the feet is common in chams so for obvious reasons I listened and purchased a glass enclosure. All I was wondering is if my boy will be alright or should I purchase a mesh cage any options or comments are helpful any other Texas chameleon owners? Thanks guys. -Hunter J

 

[carol5208]

I would think in your climate screen would have been the better choice. If he lost three chameleons, it was not due to them being in the screen. There was something else that lead to their deaths. He is right about the screen and the nails. That can happen, but does not mean it will. And sometimes they can lose a nail climbing on the screen, but does not mean if they do, that they will get an infection from it. Sounds like you were given some incorrect info on the habitat. Did you purchase a fish tank or a terrarium?. Also, we have many members who live in Texas and use screen. Even someone who is now a breeder(Panther chams, not Jacksons) and is very successful in keeping them alive in these type of enclosures.

 

[hljohnson28]

Here is Sam in his "cage"

 

[Gavinsons]

If he is an expert (glass cage or not) he should have known to use a taller cage. You can keep humidity in by more mistings and more plants. There are some that use glass successfully but you really habe to watch the heat because it is easy to overheat. I agree with carol, you were given some bad advise and should really look into a tall screen cage. One of my cages that I built has a screen top screen sides, plexiglass front door and plywood back. The screen is so small my panther can not climb on it. Same stuff that is used on a screen door. Also the substrate can be ingested by your cham and cause impaction and if it gets wet and stays wet could harbor mold and bacteria that can make him sick.

 

[hljohnson28]

He said that they do not care how high they are off the ground and the only reason they go so high im nature is to get away from pretadors but I guess I'll contact him and talk about a cage replacement

 

[fluxlizard]

I used to use glass tanks way back in the day.

My advice if you want to use your current tank-

take everything in there out, and instead put newspaper down on the bottom for your substrate, replace those branches with many twiggy branches that are all different sizes but mostly just the size so that if he's grabbing them his toe nails nearly touch but barely not quite. Get a 6" potted pothos vine from walmart or home depot and wash it well and repot it in organic non-perlite soil.

Don't know what sort of bulb he sold you but make sure you have a source of uvb from a light source.

He does have a point about screen cages and feet- I've seen it and seems to be more problem for jacksons- maybe because if the cage heats up they get active and wanderlust and climb on the screen.

But if you have a large cage with quite a bit of foliage, probably wouldn't have been a problem.

There are other ways of addressing humidity loss (simply run a humidifier in the room, use live plants, mist the plants, etc). And heat loss is actually a good thing for jacksons- they like background temps a bit cooler and can even take things very cool (they will thrive on sunny 65 degree days and 40 degree nights in the spring and fall if kept outdoors). Jacksons are a species that prefers higher elevations where the air is cooler. Probably why yours is opposite that incandescent light fixture.

Also, I'm in agreement about height- jacksons don't like to feel like they are down near the ground all the time. A taller tank would have been more appropriate if the expert there really wanted to insist on a glass tank. A front opening, front vented glass tank would have been better also.

 

[Gavinsons]

They do care how high they are or they would not go that high in nature. They use more vertical space than horizontal space. They are tree dwellers and fell more secure the higher they can get. They want to look down on things because it makes them feel safe. If you have ever read about cham cages on the floor or low in a room, some are stressed and as soon as they are lifted higher they become more relaxed. I try to get my cages higher than my head whis is 6 feet. Just some things to think about.

 

[fluxlizard]

He said that they do not care how high they are off the ground and the only reason they go so high im nature is to get away from pretadors

What he said right there would have my "balloon juice" detector going off really loudly. A comment like that is a sure indication that you can't trust the rest of what he tells you about caring for this lizard.

If you can replace your cage- it would be better. Personally having used both glass and screen for extended periods- screen is nice because it is larger for less money and you can put it outdoors when the weather is appropriate (probably fall and spring in much of texas).

 

[hljohnson28]

Thank you all for your help I will talk to him about a replacement cage thanks for all the support for a new member

 

[hljohnson28]

Talked to him today he says that I should not worry and he has sucsessfully raised chams like this for over 30 years he also said that if the cage was taller air flow would be worse so I'm going to trust him because

 

[leedragon]

Talked to him today he says that I should not worry and he has sucsessfully raised chams like this for over 30 years he also said that if the cage was taller air flow would be worse so I'm going to trust him because

do you want your chameleon to live past 1 month or not? 30 years ago people did not know how to care for chameleons and they die because people keep them like this, you barley have leave and branches for the chameleon to feel secure and drink off the drops from the leaves, you have enough things in the bottom for you chameleon to get indigestion and die of it and not are flow at all. the lamp in those conditions in going to create enough heat to suffocate your jackson.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKTbUaOQ0aA&list=PL4HFX9PBYVY2eIWT0v3ZgYSk-r76SEujI

do what he guy in the video say and read here about how to take care of chameleons, there is enough informations here about enclosure, ventilation temperatures and food for you to understand that you got fooled by the seller.

 

[hljohnson28]

Well what do you guys suggest I do should I get a refund and order my own cage?

 

[DeremensisBlue]

How to discern good advice when you don't know who to listen to

You are in a tough spot now. The great thing about the internet is that you can find information about just about anything, but you also get so many conflicting view points that it becomes a challenge to pick out what information is good.

So now you have a bunch of internet chameleon people saying that the cage is inadequate, but the “real” person in front of you who should know what he is talking about (been breeding for 30 years!) is saying this aquarium is the way to go and that he has been successful with it.

What can you do when you have no idea who is the reputable one? Here is my suggestion. Give yourself a couple hours to surf the net a bit. But not a Google search. Start at the sponsors to this chameleon forum. They at least should be some sort of representation of the best this community has to offer. Skim the care sheets and look at their set-ups. There will be differences, but you are looking for the similarities. There will be a common theme in what type of cages are used and how the cages are set up.

Go to this link to find all the sponsors of the forum.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/index.php?page=sponsors
Just click through the sites and pay attention to the images that show how they keep their chameleons and what package deals they offer for cages. Don’t shop, yet. Just look.

This forum has a great resource library. Since you are here you have decided this site has a chance of being trustworthy (it is!). Check out this care sheet
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/enclosures/

The greatest depository of chameleon community knowledge is a place called the Chameleons eZine at this link
http://www.chameleonnews.com/Home.html
Once again, you don’t have to read everything right now. Just look at pictures and get a feel for what is done by the people that specialize in chameleons.

And, in the end, you are welcome to stop by my website, http://dragonstrand.com . I have been working with chameleons for over 30 years as a keeper, breeder, and educator. (See...another 30 year big number thrown out). You will see that a number of articles in the Chameleons eZine are mine. I decided to start a company that provides the best possible chameleon caging for my community. This is not a pitch to come buy a cage from me. But drop by my website, look at the products, and browse through the blog area. I am passionate about offering the best caging education and products for chameleon people. I offer what is good to use - not what I am being given to sell by a large company or what I can easily make margin on. Once again, you are not shopping. You are just looking to get an idea for what feels right.

By surfing through these sites you will not know all the answers by any means, but you will start to be able to create a mental filter that will help you cut out the advice that goes against what the community has agreed is the best practices. You can then go back to the sites that seemed to communicate the best and settle in for some good research.

The goal here is for you to know what you need to do in this situation rather than listen to forum people or the pet store owner. Until you get your feet under you and know who you can trust you will have no idea who is steering you right. But by doing the surfing suggested, you can start building an idea of who appears to be pointing you in the right direction.

Bill

 

[hljohnson28]

Thank you all for all your help I'm going to go drop another hundred dollars on a new cage set up and hopefully I can get him to give me a refund also thanks for caring for Sam aka my baby

 

[sapphira80]

*applauds for DeremensisBlue*



That was the best, nicest advice I've ever seen anyone give on the internet. Your love for chameleons really shows through your compassion for this new owner. I hate when new people are ridiculed or made to feel like idiots when they make mistakes, because we've all been there. I commend you sir.



To hljohnson, all of that advice from deremensisblue is solid gold. It sucks that you bought a bad setup, but you can be happy that you found out it was wrong before your little chameleon died--some people don't. Just remember that pet store people are more salesman than pet expert, and never rely on one source for all your info.



Good luck, I'm sure you're thing to make an excellent chameleon keeper!

 

[hljohnson28]

Agreed you people are wonderful and helpful and care so much for chams even if their not yours thank you all for all your help if you check my second post you can see Sams new cage and setup

 

[Carlton]

Talked to him today he says that I should not worry and he has sucsessfully raised chams like this for over 30 years he also said that if the cage was taller air flow would be worse so I'm going to trust him because

What an odd thing to say about airflow and taller tanks! Never heard that one before and I've kept chams since the 80s. IMHO, if chams were easy to raise as he's suggesting there would be a lot more of them available (including jax, not just veileds!), and they would not have the general reputation of being very difficult to keep alive. I would want to see pictures of all these babies he's raised, and his successful setups.

In this case, the majority of opinions does sort of rule. As Bill said so well, once you start roaming around on websites you'll see patterns in what people are doing (especially breeders) and this will help you weed out the odd opinions. Its not completely cookie-cutter, as everyone's situation, climate, house conditions are different, but you'll see what we mean. This forum and the information it contains have been a labor of love for dedicated cham lovers for many years. Those of us who have been in the hobby a long time wouldn't have stayed members if it wasn't.

Also, think a bit about the conditions a wild cham would be living in...off the ground in trees or bushes surrounded by moving air. That air may be naturally humid compared to the average human home, but in no way was it a closed in glass tank. There are hybrid glass/screen terrariums on the market that work much better. With proper misting, live plants, and attention you can deal with the humidity problems a "ventilated" cage situation creates.

 

[Carlton]

Agreed you people are wonderful and helpful and care so much for chams even if their not yours thank you all for all your help if you check my second post you can see Sams new cage and setup

Oh that's so sad to see. Sam looks as if he wants out as soon as possible. I'm very glad you found us! We can help you make Sam's life a lot more pleasant!