Parsonii chams on sale?!! Too good to be true?

[Action Jackson]

Balderdash. I approached you about buying a male Yellow Lips Calumma parsonii parsonii twice and both time a flat out no.

I did kick you off my page. It was all give and no contribution back from you. You would not allow me to join two other Calumma sites. Then started to waste my time by not contributing to Calumma parsonii parsonii breeding programs. That was a complete waste of my and my members time. Not long ago you were just a Jackson's keeper not a Calumma keeper. I have always been about Calumma and Calumma parsonii ssp.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

I’m not sure what breeder programs you’re talking about. Pretty much all the serious keepers/breeders have or have had parsons from me. You’re right I used to work with species like Jackson’s starting some 26 years ago but for the last 11 years I’ve been working with Parsonii and other calumma. I’m about to hatch out my 10th clutch of Parson’s with more in the incubator not to mention working with and still keeping, calumma brevicorne, calumma o’shaughnessy, calumma globifer and all 4 types of Parson’s commonly seen. So I have a little bit of experience with calumma also Jeremy.

 

[Motherlode Chameleon]

I’m not sure what breeder programs you’re talking about. Pretty much all the serious keepers/breeders have or have had parsons from me. You’re right I used to work with species like Jackson’s starting some 26 years ago but for the last 11 years I’ve been working with Parsonii and other calumma. I’m about to hatch out my 10th clutch of Parson’s with more in the incubator not to mention working with and still keeping, calumma brevicorne, calumma o’shaughnessy, calumma globifer and all 4 types of Parson’s commonly seen. So I have a little bit of experience with calumma also Jeremy.

Who's not serious about breeding Calumma and Calumma parsonii parsonii. And no not all serious Calumma parsonii ssp. breeders do not have Calumma parsonii ssp. or Calumma from you Craig.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

 

[Mendez]

As a young chameleon keeper, I have a huge amount of respect for the both of you guys (@Action Jackson & @Motherlode Chameleon). You both keep, and have kept, species that are on my bucket list. You guys are both awesome and continue to inspire the younger generation of chameleon keepers such as myself. While this is a civil dispute and I love seeing the older (but not too old) generation using words like "balderdash," either take this discussion to private dms or just acknowledge that you both are two awesome dudes and go your separate ways (or become friends )--I strongly recommend the latter. Anyways, that's my two cents, take it or leave it.

But seriously, you two guys are amazing.

 

[Thompson]

nvm

 

[Motherlode Chameleon]

I have kept chameleons for 27 years now. I have had experience first hand with Calumma parsonii parsonii the entire time. I have been a part of breeding programs that have produced captive bred Calumma parsonii parsonii from as far back as the mid 1990's. I have bred a half dozen species although my main concern has been the Calumma genus. However I have had breeding activity including eggs from Calumma oshaughnessyi, Calumma malthe and breeding activity from my Orange Eye White Lip Calumma parsonii parsonii. I was one of the main thread posters on the Calumma Parsonii Forums (now closed) about topics about Calumma Parsonii ssp. that were not being address. My main concern has been on species and forest conservation of chameleon species in Madagascar and Africa. However I these past years I have continued to make progress towards breeding these Calumma species and Calumma parsonii ssp. and phases.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

 

[Thompson]

I have kept chameleons for 27 years now. I have had experience first hand with Calumma parsonii parsonii the entire time. I have been a part of breeding programs that have produced captive bred Calumma parsonii parsonii from as far back as the mid 1990's. I have bred a half dozen species although my main concern has been the Calumma genus. However I have had breeding activity including eggs from Calumma oshaughnessyi, Calumma malthe and breeding activity from my Orange Eye White Lip Calumma parsonii parsonii. I was one of the main thread posters on the Calumma Parsonii Forums (now closed) about topics about Calumma Parsonii ssp. that were not being address. My main concern has been on species and forest conservation of chameleon species in Madagascar and Africa. However I these past years I have continued to make progress towards breeding these Calumma species and Calumma parsonii ssp. and phases.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

They weren't being addressed by people of the forum or like, these conservation issues affecting Calumma parsonii species aren't being addressed in the wild and you are bringing attention toward the?

 

[Action Jackson]

Jeremy. I could say so much about what you wrote but I will refrain from doing so. I only responded to you because you again took a dig at me for apparently not selling you a Parsons. I will say that several serious keepers have multiple Parson’s that were produced by me and at least one has produced offspring from one of my CBB females. That said I certainly can decide who I want to sell too.

I hope one day you are successful breeding, hatching and raising a healthy clutch of calumma/calumma parsonii. I know it would be a big accomplishment for you after so may years of being involved with them.

 

[reddog]

@Action Jackson I know you work with cristifers. Are you going to continue producing them? I have read you say in a few places that this might be your last clutch.

 

[Action Jackson]

@Action Jackson I know you work with cristifers. Are you going to continue producing them? I have read you say in a few places that this might be your last clutch.

It looks like this will indeed be my last clutch. I’ve had much more interest in them this time (this is my 5th clutch) than I have in the past but there hasn’t been any fresh blood from WC’s coming in so that pretty much stops me from going forward. I also have a large collection of the big Parson’s and almost continually have babies so space is a big problem for me also.

 

[Motherlode Chameleon]

They weren't being addressed by people of the forum or like, these conservation issues affecting Calumma parsonii species aren't being addressed in the wild and you are bringing attention toward the?

There are captive issues, wild issues and importation issues. My main issue as of now is that Calumma parsonii ssp. when imported are often imported as adults. In the wild Calumma parsonii species may take 4-5 years to become adults. Meaning when you collect them it takes a minimum of 4-5 years to relpace them as breeders in the wild population. That means collecting breeding adults is extreely harmful to wild populations. I think only young Calumma parsonii spp. that are either collected, ranched or farmed should be exported. That are one to two years of age and easily replaced by next or the year after next years hatchlings. The downside means there is no or not much captive hatched Calumma parsonii ssp. breeding. However you have got stable and sustainable imports with a healthy breeding non threatened adult wild population of Calumma parsonii parsonii in Madagascar. I was posting issues such as these. I have posted here as well, if you look here at my posts about Calumma parsonii ssp. I have posted (plus articles and video's). This concept is an agricultural term called an animals fecundity. Some wild Calumma parsonii parsonii are estimated to be over 20 years of age. I happen to think those Calumma parsonii parsonii have lived long enough in the wild that they should stay there.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

 

[Motherlode Chameleon]

Jeremy. I could say so much about what you wrote but I will refrain from doing so. I only responded to you because you again took a dig at me for apparently not selling you a Parsons. I will say that several serious keepers have multiple Parson’s that were produced by me and at least one has produced offspring from one of my CBB females. That said I certainly can decide who I want to sell too.

I hope one day you are successful breeding, hatching and raising a healthy clutch of calumma/calumma parsonii. I know it would be a big accomplishment for you after so may years of being involved with them.

Thanks for the encouragement.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

 

[Thompson]

I have kept chameleons for 27 years now. I have had experience first hand with Calumma parsonii parsonii the entire time. I have been a part of breeding programs that have produced captive bred Calumma parsonii parsonii from as far back as the mid 1990's. I have bred a half dozen species although my main concern has been the Calumma genus. However I have had breeding activity including eggs from Calumma oshaughnessyi, Calumma malthe and breeding activity from my Orange Eye White Lip Calumma parsonii parsonii. I was one of the main thread posters on the Calumma Parsonii Forums (now closed) about topics about Calumma Parsonii ssp. that were not being address. My main concern has been on species and forest conservation of chameleon species in Madagascar and Africa. However I these past years I have continued to make progress towards breeding these Calumma species and Calumny parsonii ssp.

There are captive issues, wild issues and importation issues. My main issue as of now is that Calumma parsonii ssp. when imported are often imported as adults. In the wild Calumma parsonii species may take 4-5 years to become adults. Meaning when you collect them it takes a minimum of 4-5 years to relpace them as breeders in the wild population. That means collecting breeding adults is extreely harmful to wild populations. I think only young Calumma parsonii spp. that are either collected, ranched or farmed should be exported. That are one to two years of age and easily replaced by next or the year after next years hatchlings. The downside means there is no or not much captive hatched Calumma parsonii ssp. breeding. However you have got stable and sustainable imports with a healthy breeding non threatened adult wild population of Calumma parsonii parsonii in Madagascar. I was posting issues such as these. I have posted here as well, if you look here at my posts about Calumma parsonii ssp. I have posted (plus articles and video's). This concept is an agricultural term called an animals fecundity. Some wild Calumma parsonii parsonii are estimated to be over 20 years of age. I happen to think those Calumma parsonii parsonii have lived long enough in the wild that they should stay there.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

that is a great point and argument and of course you’ll meet people who will be mad and disagree but I commend you for advocating for this and bringing this type of conservation issue facing this species to light

 

[Motherlode Chameleon]

I got in touch with Backwater Reptiles a while ago. This article is what most suspected. That listing is an uncorrected typo/ or left over add from their past hatched clutches of CH Calumma parsonii ssp. There is no Calumma parsonii ssp.for sale at 199.00.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

 

[GrayMadder]

I got in touch with Backwater Reptiles a while ago. This article is what most suspected. That listing is an uncorrected typo/ or left over add from their past hatched clutches of CH Calumma parsonii ssp. There is no Calumma parsonii ssp.for sale at 199.00.

Best Regards
Jeremy A. Rich

I kinda thought so, I'm not comfortable purchasing from them either.
Maybe one day I can own a cristifer.