Panther Chameleon - Curled, eyes closed, one eye seems sunken, wont come out of plant

[ChamNewbie]

Panther Chameleon - about 9 months old. Male.

I found him this AM curled under the plant leaves and he would not come out even after his UVB and heat lamp turned on. Which is not common because he comes out as soon as the light turns on and he hears stirring.

There seems to be some whitish film over his left eye around the lids. There is also some of the same film on the lids of his right, but more on his left (I thought he was about to start shedding again because I saw the film on Friday but today it is apparent it is just on the eyelid and not all over). Also, the left eye looks like it is agitated, as if it is a TINY bit sunken in or hes holding it closed more so than the right.

I feed him crickets, around 7 a day but for the last week have been feeding him Hornworms (2-3 a day depending on size). He enjoys them very much.

I have been dusting the crickets and hornworms with Repitcalcium without D3 every other day and witih D3 as well as Herptivite twice a month.

His basking branch is 8 inches below the heat lamp and the UVB basking branch is goes from 6 to 8 inches. His humidity is always between 60% and 90%. I have a habba mister but the timer is broken therefore I turn it on about twice a day for around 10 minutes as he takes his time in getting under it to "bathe" and will just sit there and turn dark colors. Also he has a dripper which is his preferred method of drinking water. the dripper drips twice a day for about 1 hours at a medium slow pace.

he has a mesh cage 32 height, 16 length.

I just picked him up, put him under the heat lamp and dusted and put a hornworm in there. It took him a few minutes to go at it because he likes to eat them from the head and the worm was hiding his head.

Now he is perched on the highest branch and just hanging out.

pics below.. any suggestions?

Are these signs of something greater?

thanks!

 

[ChamNewbie]

Mbd????

Does he have MBD???

 

[CLP]

I'm certainly not an expert, but it looks to me like he might have the beginnings of a shed started, which, as I'm sure you know, can make them a bit cranky.

I would lay off the hornworms though. They are fine as additions to other feeders, but you should not be feeding him only one feeder of ANY kind including crickets. Variety is key. Perhaps the hornworm only diet has upset his stomach. Try putting him back on crickets supplemented with other feeders like hornworms, superworms and silkworms and see if that helps. Keep in mind though that he's liable to refuse the crickets especially for awhile. Many chams go on "hunger strikes" when they have become accustomed to something else they prefer.

As for MBD, I can't really see any signs from the photos and if you've been dusting as you say and he has access to a good UVB bulb, it would be unlikely.

Good luck!

 

[ChamNewbie]

I will toggle between the hornworms and the crickets and thankfully he accepts them both. I planned to start giving him superworms after this batch is up ( I have 4 hornworms left).

I get paranoid because I did remember reading Chams wont show signs of being sick until its almost too late and he has never just stayed under the plant like that. Maybe he is cranky. Thankfully I found a vet, unfortunately they are closing now and will not wait but said to keep an eye and if anything take him later in the week.

I will keep everyone posted. But please, any more suggestions would be great!

 

[CLP]

It would also be helpful if you filled this out:

https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/

That way everyone knows exactly what your set up is like in case there is an issue with any of it.

 

[mcbdz]

Hello, what a pretty looking guy you have. Yes I would still be concerned due to him closing his eyes during the day. That and the film on his eyes do concern me. First things first. Please fill out the questionnaire CLP posted. Then we can go from there. and also, do you know the date you started using your UVB? They should be changed every 6 months.
Have you tried using a wet q-tip and gently tried to see if you could clean the film off his eyes? Important to know if it is a discharge or just his skin drying. Is he making any noises when he breathes? Good luck

 

[ChamNewbie]

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Panther, male, 9 months old. Since July 2012.

Handling - Once a week or less I pick him up to check him, move him or enter his cage to clean (with no harsh chemicals of course).

Feeding - Toggle between Crickets and hornworms. Crickets - 7 a day and hormworms 1 or 2. I gut load with Fluker's 12 oz Orange Cube Complete Cricket Diet and Fluker's 16-Ounce Cricket Quencher Calcium Fortified.

Supplements - I dust with Reptical without D3 twice a week and with Reptical WITH D3 and Herptivite twice a month.

Watering - I have a Monsoon (timer broken) which I turn on for about 8-10 minutes twice a day depending on how long he wants it for. He will sit under it and turn dark colors. He does not like to drink from the habba mister water though and enjoys a dripper I have set up which runs twice a day at a slow pace for about an hour at a time.

Fecal Description - Not tested for parasites but uniform and similar fecal every day. Dark brown, wet, no lumps or blood. Urate is is always white, no specs of yellow or orange.

History - no previous info.

Cage Info:
Cage Type - Mesh, 36" by 16"

Lighting - Lights are on for 12 hours. Reptisun 5.0 UVB (18 inch) and Exo Terra Sun-Glo Basking Spot Lamp, 100-Watt/120-Volt

Temperature - basking light gives about 90 degrees and branch is 8 inches below basking light. He is seen basking under it from time to time during the day and is not getting burned. He enjoys his ambient temperature and will move around when he gets too warm. Lowest temp is 70 degrees. He sleeps normal cycle.

Humidity - 65-90% which I measure with a humidity thermometer.

Plants - Live plant - croton.

Placement - cage is in my office. No vents next to cage and not a high traffic area. Only I am in the office. The cage is 2 feet off of the ground on a rack with a container underneath the cage to catch overflow water.

Location - I am in Miami, Florida.

Current Problem - Problem discussed earlier in post.

 

[ChamNewbie]

Hello, what a pretty looking guy you have. Yes I would still be concerned due to him closing his eyes during the day. That and the film on his eyes do concern me. First things first. Please fill out the questionnaire CLP posted. Then we can go from there. and also, do you know the date you started using your UVB? They should be changed every 6 months.
Have you tried using a wet q-tip and gently tried to see if you could clean the film off his eyes? Important to know if it is a discharge or just his skin drying. Is he making any noises when he breathes? Good luck

Thank you! we he seems ok now just as if his eyes are agitated. I just finished filling out the questionnaire.

I got the UVB back in july but since then have changed it once so this one is from October 25, according to Amazon order

I did try to clean it off - seems it is dry skin only and not in the eye.

What worried me was him not coming out in the AM after 2 hours of his lights being on and when I tried to touch him he kept his eyes closed and wouldnt budget.

Maybe he is cranky. Now he just finished basking and is moving towards UVB.

 

[mcbdz]

I would continue to keep a close eye on him. Remember to increase your calcium to daily and try and add more different feeders. online there are tons. I and going to give you a link to a blog to read. I feel you need to improve gut-loading(feeding your feeders) read and you'll understand better. Hoping he's just having a cranky pre-shed or weather change.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/65-supplements.html
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/useful-info/

 

[ChamNewbie]

I would continue to keep a close eye on him. Remember to increase your calcium to daily and try and add more different feeders. online there are tons. I and going to give you a link to a blog to read. I feel you need to improve gut-loading(feeding your feeders) read and you'll understand better. Hoping he's just having a cranky pre-shed or weather change.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/65-supplements.html
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/useful-info/

Thank you for your help! I will check out the blogs and let you all know status.

 

[mcbdz]

So, how is he today? Acting more his self or still strange?

 

[carol5208]

I think your chameleon looks fine...no signs of mbd and his eyes do look like a shed. just take the advice of changing up your gutload. That needs some improvement. Good luck!!!

 

[ChamNewbie]

So, how is he today? Acting more his self or still strange?

He is doing MUCH better.. It seems he was just cranky as you all said



He has been eating well and still has not shed but his eyes look better. He is "tanning" haha.. basking at the moment.

Thank you for asking!

 

[ChamNewbie]

I think your chameleon looks fine...no signs of mbd and his eyes do look like a shed. just take the advice of changing up your gutload. That needs some improvement. Good luck!!!

Thank you for your advice! Will do.

 

[deadhd5]

The white could be hard water deposits if you live in an area (like I do) where the water is really hard. I had this kind of build up on my nosy be, and after he shed, I installed an RO filtration system to prevent the build up.