Newbie both to site and Chameleons - poo question

[tipposan]

Hi Everyone,

We are new to owning a Chameleon and I am looking for some general help with looking after our Graceful Chameleon.

We got him/her (pet store staff differ on its gender) this past Christmas and it seems to be doing well. It is fairly young, still smaller than my 12 year olds hand, but seems to be doing well.

It is eating about 3 -4 crickets a day and drinks everytime we mist the leaves. We have been keeping handling down to about twice a week. I imagine that will go down when they go back to school. I encourage them to even drop that down to once a week but it is hard for them since they are used to taking the snake (we have a ball python that is about 3 years old) whenever they want and for as long as they want.

I am concerned that it has only pooped once (that we can see) since Christmas. Is this "normal" or is there something I should be worried about.

Since we are new, we haven't gotten into vitamins or other things but I saw some cool feeding rocks that can be used for coating crickets as well as for feeding them. I am also looking into a drip for water.

I will post some pics of the tank when I get a chance but we purchased it as a kit. Basically we got a tank with vented top, light source with UVA and UVB bulbs, water dish, branches and leaves and humidiy and temperature guages.

Thanks

 

[jr andrade]

Theres a couple things.. Lose the dish, and the chameleon should not be in a glass tank.. They need fresh air and need the open ventilation of a screened cage. What are your basking temps? Poop is directly linked to temps in the cage and since it is eating well i figure it should be pooping regularly.

Use the little dripper for a dripper or make a simple one from home. There are plenty of guides on how to make one. I use a gatorade bottle with a pin sized hole on the bottom.

Be aware that the usual time for pooping is in the morning after warming up under the light.

Your supplements should consist of:

Supplementing is key to your animals health but make sure not to over do it and dust lightly every time you use a supplement.

Multivitamin (Mild enough to be used often 2-3 times a week)

Calcium (Every day dust lightly)

Calcium w/ d3 (USE RARELY: 2 times a month)

I use Sticky Tongue Farms products.

 

[tipposan]

Yeah, store people were also not sue why the dish was there. Was told that the tank would help maintain the humidity. The entire top is screened and it has a ventilation strip across the lower third - it's an Exo-Terra cage.

When it gets bigger, we will be looking into a "more screen than glass" cage.

Will check on basking temp, night now.

Dripper is on the way, just need some time to get in place.

I was just really concerned that we were under feeding it since we were under feeding our snake when we got him. That is also why I was looking into a cricket feeder. While we are on the topic, any suggestion as to the best feeding method. I do 3 a day now but maybe 6-12 at a time and let him eat as he wants?

Also noticed that sometimes I see ribs when he is on the hunt - looks really thin - adding to my feeding concern.

Posting more pics in my gallery.

 

[tipposan]

Pascal's current home

Here is what his current setup looks like.



Pascal's home by closhusan, on Flickr

Note: will be removing the water dish soon - not sure why it is there.

 

[wontbme]

Here is what his current setup looks like.



Pascal's home by closhusan, on Flickr

Note: will be removing the water dish soon - not sure why it is there.

beautiful setup, use the dish as a vegitation dish. chop up some celery some lettuce, collard greens, even some fruit!
my chameleon loved eating it... also mix in some worms to draw her/his attention

 

[carol5208]

a couple of things that I see need to be changed. Get rid of the red light and replace with an ordinary white housebulb. Make sure your chameleon can bask under the light. Fix your vine so it is about 8 inches below the light. There is no where for to him to bask as it looks from the pics. That could be why you are not seeing poop. They need the heat for digestion. Try a 40 watt bulb for starters. not sure of what the temps should be for a graceful. Hopefully someone can chime in on that but is is probably in the low 80's like a Veild. Also, if it is a female they can lay eggs from about 5 months on, even if never having been mated. If that is the case, she will need a laying bin. Please post some close up pics of your cham of the vent area so we can try and determine the sex. You have him/her in a terrarium which is better than a fish tank cause of the extra ventilation. What is the size of that?

 

[carol5208]

beautiful setup, use the dish as a vegitation dish. chop up some celery some lettuce, collard greens, even some fruit!
my chameleon loved eating it... also mix in some worms to draw her/his attention

you are right it looks beautiful but we need to get it more functional!

 

[wontbme]

you are right it looks beautiful but we need to get it more functional!

you draw up some good points, i hadn't noticed the red bulb. theres nothing wrong with using it as a night bulb though.

a day bulb is a necessity though.

that cage is very small 8 inches will be half the cage. I'd say that 4-6 inches would be fine aslong as the chameleon isn't in direct contact to the bulb (burning)
or you can elevate the bulb to suit his/her needs

 

[carol5208]

you draw up some good points, i hadn't noticed the red bulb. theres nothing wrong with using it as a night bulb though.

a day bulb is a necessity though.

that cage is very small 8 inches will be half the cage. I'd say that 4-6 inches would be fine aslong as the chameleon isn't in direct contact to the bulb (burning)
or you can elevate the bulb to suit his/her needs

gosh, you think it is that small? I guess the pics are decieving then? as far as the red light for night, it is suggested no light at all. What purpose is having the red light on for? It just might disturb their sleep. I would like to know the demensions of the cage please.

 

[wontbme]

it's a baby. i have to assume it'll grow in there no?

it looks like an 18x18

i could be wrong, i'd love to be wrong lol

anyway, the red light could be used to maintain the same heat overnight, and the red will simulate moonlight. it's obviously not completely dark at night in the wild.

 

[carol5208]

it's a baby. i have to assume it'll grow in there no?

it looks like an 18x18

i could be wrong, i'd love to be wrong lol

anyway, the red light could be used to maintain the same heat overnight, and the red will simulate moonlight. it's obviously not completely dark at night in the wild.

the cham does not look all that small in the pic, but then again pics are so deceiving. Gosh I hope it is not 18 X18 cause that is so small. I'd love for you to be wrong too! Go out in the forest at night, and it is pretty darn dark unless you got a full moon. And unless you live on mars or something, I have never seen the moon look red!!!lol!

 

[wontbme]

LOL

i meant the red could simulate the same amount of visibility.

and if you read the original post it said that the avatar was a 10 year old holding the chameleon, so half of a 10 year olds hand? i'd say 3~ inches

i hate how the original poster isn't saying much! lol!

 

[carol5208]

ah ah good detective work there! I don't think gracefuls get that big. I might be wrong as you don't see them that much around. In the avatar it looks to be a juvi I think. Yes, it would be nice for them to come back. Hello out there!?

 

[wontbme]

baha

i know nothing of panthers, i'm more of a veiled guy. But i know better than to underestimate their size!

If you say that they don't grow that big then i'll take your word for it.

but seriously where are you OP lol

 

[tipposan]

Thanks everyone. Just some notes:

The tank is 18" x 18" x 24". This is a starter tank and fully expect to have to move up to bigger one.

Thanks to Wontbme for the great suggestion to use the water dish for worms and other items. I might do that for the frogs that we have as well as I have a small water dish from when the snake was a baby.

The red bulb is a heat bulb and is also needed for UVA (or UVB I forget) while the white light is for the other UV. The small vine across with the leaves is about 7 inches from the light while the larger vine is about 10 inches from the red light. This is where he/she likes to bask right now. I have also seen a magnetic platform that will allow a ledge at any height - thoughts on that for a basking area? The only thing is that it has to go on one of the glass sides.

We don't have a night light as we always have some ambient light coming in from the darn streetlight outside our house, thus never completely dark where the tank is.

As a way of maintaining the temp, I turn the light on in the morning and off at night (to simulate normal cycle) but during the day I often turn the red light off as a way of regulating the amount of heat. Is that bad?

The more time I look at the set up, the more and more I want to change it. I thought the front looked bare so I threw in the log but now I want to add more vines/leaves and remove some of the ground vegitation so it can move throughout the tank. Right now it spends most of the time in the leaves and only comes out to eat or bask. Thoughts?

 

[Elizadolots]

I am not aware of red bulbs that emit UVB, but could be wrong. However, I'd ditch the red light. You can just use a regular incandescent bulb, the kind you buy at the grocery store for $1.

And you do not need a light at night. It's probable you don't need any additional heat at night, but if you do, there are ways to add heat without adding illumination. People here have done their own studies and shown that light at night retards growth in babies. That can be assumed to mean it's not healthy.

That's really not a tiny baby. 12 year olds (and it's a 12 year old, not a 10 year old) often have hands as big as many adult women. To me, it looks about the size of my Fischer's. As such, that size enclosure isn't bad, but the Graceful will grow, so a somewhat bigger enclosure is probably a good thing.

tipposan, can you take close up pictures of the base of the tail? What needs to be visible is the underside of the tail (the "vent" that poop comes out of) seen from the side. With that, some of the experts here can give you a very good guess on gender.

By the way, welcome to the forums. You're going to find a wealth of information here. Sadly, you may find out that you were given a lot of incorrect information at the pet store. That has happened to lots of us, don't let it get you down.

Some advice on the board: you'll get well meaning advice from lots of people and sometimes it will be in conflict. When that happens, enlist a moderator to help you. They can help you both with the correct information and with learning what posters are the most reliable.

**edited to add**

If the light coming from outside is really bright, consider covering the enclosure at night. I wrap all four sides of mine loosely at night so they aren't bothered by me being in the same room watching TV and playing on the computer.

 

[Manda509]

it's a baby. i have to assume it'll grow in there no?

it looks like an 18x18

i could be wrong, i'd love to be wrong lol

anyway, the red light could be used to maintain the same heat overnight, and the red will simulate moonlight. it's obviously not completely dark at night in the wild.

Yes, i use a small infrared as well as a low watt ceramic bulb that emits no light at night to maintain heat at night right now due to it being winter and cold in my house and my cham sleeps and poops just fine.

 

[camimom]

As Elizadots said I am not aware of any red bulbs that give off uvb. So please remove it.
For uvb, you can get a reptisun or reptiglo 5.0 UVB bulb.
For basking, a regular house bulb works just fine.

 

[K9Luvn]

Welcome to the Forum. Beautiful little Cham you have

Your set up is beautiful too, but you will find things that make it much more suitable for a chameleon. I agree you red light does not give out any UVB only heat. Please make sure your white light is a uvb light. The Chameleon must have a UVB light every day. It looks like you got the exo terra set up with the compact flourescent light hood. Does you light hood look like the one in this link along with the twisted type light bulbs http://www.herpsupplies.com/product.cfm?groupid=1159&id=PT2225 It should show on the bulb what type of light it is. Just unscrew it and have a look, then we can make sure you have the light then is best for the health of your Chameleon. I would also get rid of the substrate on the bottom of your enclosure and either put reptile carpet for looks... or nothing at all. I have nothing down on mine and it makes it easy to clean. I use both fake and keep potted plants with large river rock to cover the soil in my plants. I honestly don't think I would bother putting the magnetic ledge it is just more money from the petstore that is not needed. You can simply have sticks or vines that runs accross the top for basking. Much cheaper and more what a Chameleon is used to basking on.

You are in the right place to learn all you can about the care and needs of you chameleon. People on this forum will guide you much better then petstore. You are on your way to having a healthy pet by Chameleon keepers that are very passionate about their care. Again ... Welcome and don't ever be afraid to ask questions. Reading and asking is how we can all learn.

 

[Slyfox]

Have to agree regards to petshop knowledge.. We were given a wealth of crap information and all the wrong setup.. He sold us a waterfall, wood bark chips, a red bulb and said we had to pay more because we wanted a male £85 for baby veiled... Infact this is what he gave us when we asked for a full charm setup



As you can see it is almost comical, luckily we never brought the Cham..

After reading and taking advice from this forum this is now the setup I have for my veiled Which we finally brought from an experienced breeder for £45



Just a bare glass bottom execpt a few river rocks holding my coconut shell up with some fruit for the crickets and some river rocks in the plant pots.


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