New Owner, Have a Couple Questions

[R3P0]

Hello,
After reading up on Chams, and researching them thoroughly, i purchased 2 baby veiled chameleons. 1 male, 1 female. 4 months old, from FLChams.com
They are great animals and both entertaining and enjoyable.

First the basics:
They ARE caged seperately, they only stayed in the same cage for about a week till i got around to buying the second cage.
Each cage has a UVB bulb, a spot bulb, vines, plants(fake for the time being), and temp./humidity gauges(digital). Wired mesh cages, like advised and everything. I have yet to have a problem with the enclosures. I mist regularly, and they havent had a problem drinking or anything so i havent gotten a giant dripper. Im waiting for those till they get big enough to warrant a constant drinking need. Because as of right now, every time i mist their enclosures, they stay away from the bottle and tend to shy away from getting wet. after i stop misting they climb down to the leaves and small pools of water and drink their fill.

Seeing as how they are only about 4.5 months old i havent rlly varied their food source, standard small crickets that are dusted regularly and gut loaded. So far thats all theyve been wanting or willing to eat. The pet store is running low on their cricket supply at the moment so im trying to diversify the chams' food sources in case i actually cant get any crickets. I picked up some small mealworms and offered a couple to each chameleon, but they wanted nothing to do with them, AT ALL. I tried both hand feeding and stationary bowl feeding, but they have yet to touch them. My male, Leon, still hasnt gotten used to me trying to hand feed him. Kam, the female, eats sometimes when i hand feed her(only crickets), but shes still a little hesitant. obviously they still have to get used to me and the new food so im not too worried.

So my questions are:
1. How do i introduce things like superworms or fruit flies into their diet and actually HAVE them eat them?
2. Should they be let out of the cage at all? (Leon [M] likes to move towards the door and escape when i mist his cage)
3. what would be a good rotation of "rations" for the chams to eat to nudge them into eating something more than just crickets?
4. Alternate sources for crickets/bugs online or something?

I kno it was long, but thanks in advance for any and all advice and help.

 

[thephotoprincess]

Congrats on the new babies!

I would suggest offering a variety of food. Mine really love silkworms - you can try to get them to hand feed using silkworms - if you wish to hand feed.

I let mine out. Sometimes they want to come out - I have trees and plants for them to hang out in to get a change of scenery and I also give them showers once a week or so.

Many people suggest not handling chameleons but if they are okay with it, I say go for it. Some are friendly, some are not. Respect them and don't force them. Hand feeding is a good way to build trust.

 

[krknieriem]

You may want to get a mistking at some point since you have 2 enclosures, hand misting will become a hastle at some point and you can set them up on timers so they do it while you are away. I have been able to escape for a weekend before by having everything on timers knowing that my cham would probably be happier with me gone and not trying to take him out...lol

 

[R3P0]

I dont actually PULL them out of the cage to try and hand feed them, i have a small dish for the mealworms and with crickets i just hold them. The male comes to the door when i go to open it when i need to fix a vine or before i go to drop some crickets in. Wasnt sure if i should let him roam or if it was better to keep him in the enclosure at all times seeing as how hes still a baby.

I do plan on getting a full misting system, but like i said, right now theyre still tiny and are doing fine with me soaking the cage twice a day.

 

[jannb]

Welcome to the forums and congrats on your veileds. Where are the pictures? I keep veileds and they are so very rewarding to keep.

To feed worms or fruits and veggie, just put them in a small shallow bowl or put them on a branch in the enclosure. Cut the fruits and veggies into small slivers so they want choke. Silkworms are excellent feeders.

You can allow them out of the cage as long as you are watching them and I wouldn't allow them together on the same tree since you have a male and female. You would not want them to mate this young. Are they brother and sister?

I'm attaching my blogs for you below for new keepers and the female egg laying.
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blo...-keepers-young-veiled-panther-chameleons.html
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/jannb/345-egg-laying-laying-bin.html

 

[Olimpia]

1. How do i introduce things like superworms or fruit flies into their diet and actually HAVE them eat them?

Chameleons love insects that love, so mealworms might not be active enough to attract their attention a lot. But try something like superworms (they move around a lot more than mealworms), baby hornworms, butterworms, and even roaches if you can handle it. It might take them a little time to get used to them but if you put them in a little dish or something and skip on the crickets that day, they may be tempted to go for something new. And once they do they'll realize they love new insects.

2. Should they be let out of the cage at all? (Leon [M] likes to move towards the door and escape when i mist his cage)

I think so, yes! They may be small, but there's no reason you can't take him outside on your hand for a few minutes of sunlight or put him on a small plant on your desk and let him stretch his legs for a little bit. If I have a chameleon that wants to come out I let them, because it's good for them mentally to get out of their cages for a bit if that's what they want.

3. what would be a good rotation of "rations" for the chams to eat to nudge them into eating something more than just crickets?

Since they're young, you shouldn't really starve them until they're hungry enough to try something new. But you can certainly skip crickets one day and see if they'll try out something else. Once they start eating other insects I recommend giving them several types of insects throughout the week, so they don't eat the same thing all the time. It'll be more nutritionally varied.

4. Alternate sources for crickets/bugs online or something?

My favorite place to order insects from is Mulberryfarms.com (to me they've been the most reliable) but there are plenty of the forum sponsors that sell insects and they're great too.

 

[R3P0]

Thanks for the help guys. =]
i'll try to post pictures tonite after work.

 

[kinyonga]

Welcome to the world of chameleons!

You didn't ask but I'm telling you anyhow...once your female is sexually mature, don't overfeed her constantly or she could have reproductive issues, maybe become constipated and even might prolapse. Provide her with an opaque container of washed playsand in the cage that is about 12" deep x 12" x 8" so that she will have a place to dig to show you that she needs to lay eggs. If she doesn't have a place she could become eggbound. Yes...female veileds can/do/might lay eggs without having been mated.

Since veileds have been known to eat the foliage, I recommend real plants be used and that they be well-washed both sides of the leaves before using them. I also recommend covering the soil in the pots with pebbles/stones that are definitely too big to ingest.

I recommend that no substrate be used. Too many of the ones available can cause an impaction.

Since one of the main problems that is reported on this forum is MBD here's some information that I post constantly....
Appropriate cage temperatures aid in digestion and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.

Exposure to UVB from either direct sunlight or a proper UVB light allows the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system to make/keep the bones strong and be used in other systems in the chameleon as well. The UVB should not pass through glass or plastic no matter whether its from the sun or the UVB light. The most often recommended UVB light is the long linear fluorescent Repti-sun 5.0 tube light. Some of the compacts, spirals and tube lights have caused health issues, but so far there have been no bad reports against this one.

A wide variety of insects that have been well fed and gutloaded should be fed to it. At that size you only need to feed it every two or three days. Feed it enough that it doesn't get fat (and, of course, doesn't get thin either).

Since many of the feeder insects we use in captivity have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorus in them, its important to dust the insects just before you feed them to the chameleon at most feedings with a phos.-free calcium powder to help make up for it. (I use Rep-cal phosphorus-free calcium). Not sure how to tell you to dust WC insects if that is what you will be doing.

If you also dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder it will ensure that your chameleon gets some D3 without overdoing it. It leaves the chameleon to produce the rest of what it needs through its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system but D3 produced from exposure to UVB shouldn't as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it. (I use Rep-cal phos.-free calcium/D3).

Dusting twice a month as well with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A will ensure that the chameleon gets some vitamins without the danger of overdosing the vitamin A. PrEformed sources of vitamin A can build up in the system and may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD. However, there is controversy as to whether all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene and so some people give some prEformed vitamin A once in a while. (I use herptivite which has beta carotene.)

Gutloading/feeding the insects well helps to provide what the chameleon needs. I gutload crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms, etc. with an assortment of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, etc.)

Calcium, phos., D3 and vitamin A are important players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon (muscles, etc.) and they need to be in balance. When trying to balance them, you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the insects and what you feed the chameleon.

Here are some good sites for you to read too...
http://chameleonnews.com/07FebWheelock.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200605020...Vitamin.A.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200406080...d.Calcium.html
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/
http://web.archive.org/web/200601140...ww.adcham.com/
If you can't access the sites above that have the word "archive" in you can do it through the WayBackMachine.

 

[R3P0]

Thanks For the info Kin, but there was a reason i didnt ask about it. I spent about 2 weeks researching every part of these guys, in and out =]. And ive gone thru 2 or 3 blogs and articles about housing,caring, and maintaining a female chameleon. And dusting before feeding has been a regular habit since day 1. Same with UVB lighting. The only problems ive had with these guys is feeding, and trying to get them to eat different insects. everything besides that has been smooth.

And i havent put in real plants yet because every time i offer them fresh greens or plants they dont take any, and when i leave them in the cage they dont touch them at all. ive tried hibiscus, jade, ficus, and a handful of other living plants but they didnt want anything to do with them.

So either these little guys are stubborn, or they need time to mature enough to want a varied palette. =]

 

[Olimpia]

1. How do i introduce things like superworms or fruit flies into their diet and actually HAVE them eat them?

Chameleons love insects that love, so mealworms might not be active enough to attract their attention a lot.

Move, not love. I just realized my mistake!

 

[camimom]

Thanks For the info Kin, but there was a reason i didnt ask about it. I spent about 2 weeks researching every part of these guys, in and out =]. And ive gone thru 2 or 3 blogs and articles about housing,caring, and maintaining a female chameleon. And dusting before feeding has been a regular habit since day 1. Same with UVB lighting. The only problems ive had with these guys is feeding, and trying to get them to eat different insects. everything besides that has been smooth.

And i havent put in real plants yet because every time i offer them fresh greens or plants they dont take any, and when i leave them in the cage they dont touch them at all. ive tried hibiscus, jade, ficus, and a handful of other living plants but they didnt want anything to do with them.

So either these little guys are stubborn, or they need time to mature enough to want a varied palette. =]

My male veiled is roughly 5-6 months old, and he munches away on his pothos and scheffelara. He wont touch greens though. FYI. your 'kids' are old enough to try new stuff, so live plants will be great for them, if they ever decide to munch. they also help with humidity levels. and yes, they are stubborn, there chams, there whole goal in life is to eat bugs, look cute and awesome, and worry us human parents to death!

 

[SonTigerPantherCham]

Olimpia, I am so glad its not just me that has to post edit!!
you made my day
anne