Sunday I purchased 3 nosey bes. 1 is a 6 month male and the other two are 1.5 months old. today I saw the 1.5 month female very weak and can barely hang on to the ficus. the first day I brought her home she was weak but not like this. she is almost white and gasping for air. the other two males are doing fine, so I have no idea. your help is greatly appreciated.
New Nosey Be female dying
- Thread starter Brain916
- Start date
Sporkthedork
New Member
Well from your previous posts, since you got them from the kammers I'm guessing they were in good condition before. Also if you're still keeping them in the same cage (from another post), my best guess is that the female is not getting enough nutrition due to the presence of the male. It's just a guess, but I think the male might be eating all of the food and thus the female is getting weaker.
Dsignrguy
Member
this "erks" me!!!
I've seen this alot lately, and I saw it at the show a couple of weeks back, so I really gotta ask, why the #&#^# are reputable dealers(or anyone for that matter) selling 1-1.5 month old babies??? to me, It just seems they are just too young and unstable. And also, why the hell would anybody buy one that young? Unless your an extremely advanced keeper, it's just not a good idea and your asking for trouble (and even if you are experienced, it can still be a crapshoot, especially when you stress them out with shipping and new environments)
at the show, one of the bigger chameleon dealers had some babies that were barely over a month old, and I even asked why they were selling them so young. They just said they would only sell them to advanced keepers, but I got the feeling just about anyone could have walked away with one had they had cash out.
Just my opinion
I've seen this alot lately, and I saw it at the show a couple of weeks back, so I really gotta ask, why the #&#^# are reputable dealers(or anyone for that matter) selling 1-1.5 month old babies??? to me, It just seems they are just too young and unstable. And also, why the hell would anybody buy one that young? Unless your an extremely advanced keeper, it's just not a good idea and your asking for trouble (and even if you are experienced, it can still be a crapshoot, especially when you stress them out with shipping and new environments)
at the show, one of the bigger chameleon dealers had some babies that were barely over a month old, and I even asked why they were selling them so young. They just said they would only sell them to advanced keepers, but I got the feeling just about anyone could have walked away with one had they had cash out.
Just my opinion
Chuck G
Avid Member
As a breeder,I have noticed some other breeders that will remain nameless of course selling very young chameleons and other practices I don't agree with.
This will always come back to haunt you,especially if they don't replace or refund your money.A few bucks made unethically today will cost you tomorrow.Blame it on the economy,I guess.Desperate to make money,people bend rules,where they normally wouldn't. I can only speak for myself and know I don't sell chameleons under 3 months to anyone,that includes experienced keepers and other breeders that I provide chameleons to once in a while.My concern is always for the chameleon first.
This will always come back to haunt you,especially if they don't replace or refund your money.A few bucks made unethically today will cost you tomorrow.Blame it on the economy,I guess.Desperate to make money,people bend rules,where they normally wouldn't. I can only speak for myself and know I don't sell chameleons under 3 months to anyone,that includes experienced keepers and other breeders that I provide chameleons to once in a while.My concern is always for the chameleon first.
Ryan Jarosek
New Member
I would agree. Call the Breeder
In my experiance with the Kammers they do not even bring babies that young to the show.
In defence with the Kammers whom I have done business with a number of times. I have been told by Ed that they do not bring anythign under 2 months old to the show. I have purchased a two month old at a show from them at one point. probably 2.5 months old.
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Ryan Jarosek
New Member
I really respect that! Chuck, I hope to buy a Chameleon from you next. I am going to need some pretty girls pretty soon.
PICHISPYTHONS
New Member
chuks right. anything under 3 months is just asking for trouble and i know times are hard but why risk tainting a good rep by selling extremely young chams. id call that kammers asap and talk to them about this matter. dont wait any longer as your little female nosy probably doesnt have much longer.
you know, this actually makes me upset by your guys responses. I asked for help not critisims on my part or the breeders, my main concern was for the female and everyone except 1 person avoided it. As far as a update, she died this mourning.
I am not bashing kramers kreations, they are good people, but the lady their told me they are 1.5 months and both are small. In no way after having them for 2 days was it my fault, since both my other chams purchased from them are completly healthy.
and to the guy asking why the he'll would I buy 1.5 month old babies, you sir are crowned IGNORANT. you point fingers in this post but do not supply any help. if you dislike breeders selling them that young, why not make another topic on this, and add REAL knowledge in this post?
I guess now it is time to ask for a refund, I spent over 800 from their stand, and over 1200 lifetime. but I wanted to say once again the people at krammers kreations are good people, very nice and accompdating. and I would still without a doubt recomend them
I am not bashing kramers kreations, they are good people, but the lady their told me they are 1.5 months and both are small. In no way after having them for 2 days was it my fault, since both my other chams purchased from them are completly healthy.
and to the guy asking why the he'll would I buy 1.5 month old babies, you sir are crowned IGNORANT. you point fingers in this post but do not supply any help. if you dislike breeders selling them that young, why not make another topic on this, and add REAL knowledge in this post?
I guess now it is time to ask for a refund, I spent over 800 from their stand, and over 1200 lifetime. but I wanted to say once again the people at krammers kreations are good people, very nice and accompdating. and I would still without a doubt recomend them
Sang
New Member
still, they should have known better about selling an animal at that age,when its far more suseptable to stress and anything else that could trigger an illness.
granted i know nothing of your keeping skills, but for anybody a chameleon of that age probably would of been wise to avoid. i believe there is a reason why everyone won't typically sell there babies till about 3 months.
im sorry to hear about your female.
granted i know nothing of your keeping skills, but for anybody a chameleon of that age probably would of been wise to avoid. i believe there is a reason why everyone won't typically sell there babies till about 3 months.
im sorry to hear about your female.
Dsignrguy
Member
First, I didn't offer advice on what to do because:
1. I'm not there and can't actually assess the situation
2.there are several people here who are more qualified to help you. Although I've been doing this for 7 years, I have never dealt with a cham under 3 months old, So I really wouldn't know what to tell you.
3. judging from your description and what I do know, There's nothing ANYONE could have done...even if you rushed to a vet, it most likely wouldn't have done any good.
Next, I didn't mean to come across that I was criticizing, pointing a finger, or condemning you, and I apologize for coming across that way. I was mad when I wrote that, but at the dealer, not you. I said it harshly so maybe down the road somewhere it might deter someone from making the same mistake. I also want to say that this is absolutely NOT YOUR FAULT!!!! I honestly believe there's nothing ANYONE could have done in this situation, and I hold the dealer 100% responsible for this situation. If they are going to sell babies that young, they should ...well, I just don't think they should do it. At that age, they can go from healthy looking to dead in a matter of hours with no explanation.
As far as the Kammers go, They ARE great people. The cham I have now came from them, and they were nothing but helpful to me when I got into the hobby. If I were to suggest to a newby where to go to get a first cham and for advice, it would be Ed and Liddy....no question....and I am actually quite surprised to hear thats who you got them from. The only thing I can guess is that through their vast experience and success in raising these little guys they may have lost sight of how delicate they can be and how truly hard it can be to get them through their first few months. Upon hearing you had some experience (I see you've been posting for a while, so I know your not completely new to this), They thought you could handle it, however, judging From the timeline in your post(and the fact that the other 2 are fine), The little girl was doomed long before you purchased her. She was probably way overstressed from being transported from L.A. to Sac., and even if she wasn't sold at the show, she may not have survived the trip back home.
Kosmo
New Member
I've got to add, you're coming to a forum for advice on a sickly Chameleon (near death). It takes time for an unhealthy animal to become a dead animal. I've read every health clinic thread that’s come up since i joined, every time i hear the same responses.
Take it to a vet...
You're an adult and are completely able to make an intelligent decision on your own. Your request for help prompted a discussion, which is a good thing... you're chameleon died, bad thing. We can't solve your problems for you, we can advise you the best we can but our answers will always be the same. Advice is great a vet is better.
I have no wish to be rude to anyone here, but honestly… smarten up... but I am deeply sorry for your loss.
Take it to a vet...
You're an adult and are completely able to make an intelligent decision on your own. Your request for help prompted a discussion, which is a good thing... you're chameleon died, bad thing. We can't solve your problems for you, we can advise you the best we can but our answers will always be the same. Advice is great a vet is better.
I have no wish to be rude to anyone here, but honestly… smarten up... but I am deeply sorry for your loss.
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