New Member- Lifespa of Panthers

[Becca G]

Hello all! Wish I had found this forum sooner. I have had my ambilobe panther (Leon) since Jan'05. Got him from Kammerflage and he was about 4 months old then. Was wondering about the lifespan of panthers and when they get older what exactly happens. My chameleon has been slowing down not eating or drinking as vigorously for the last 6 months or so. But still seemed completely healthy. Now in the last month his behavior has changed (he started hanging out in the lowest branches of the cage) and about 2 weeks ago he started refusing to eat or drink. I have been spraying him like crazy and have gotten him to drink by dripping water over his snout with a syringe. I even gave him some diluted ensure when he looked like he was going to die. He perked up but is still only eating aout 1 big tomato horn worm every other day. Right now he is in a smaller screen cage then usual, it's 24" length by 30" height. Normally hes in a much taller cage. The lighting is exactly whats recommended by the Kammers, I've always followed there instructions. Reptisun 5.0 24" bulb and reptisun basking spot lamp. I maintain the humidity by a combo of several long mistings a day and drip cup. There are no live palnts. The cage is high off the ground and not in a high traffic area. The temp is around 90F in the basking spot and in the 70's eslewhere. He had only passed 1 or 2 small normal looking stools in the past few weeks and then today had a mustard colored extremely liquid stool. I'm assuming this has something to do with the change in diet ( normally he would be getting a mixed diet of hornworms, super worms, butter worms and crickets) and the ensure that i gave him. I guess my question is, is that how a chameleon ages out? Less drinking and eating and decline in function? Or do you think something else is going on? I have not brought him to the vet because I had 2 very bad experiences with the reptile vet in my area with a leopard toprt and my female chameleon. Both died withim a few hrs of treatment by him. Please give me some guidance....

 

[Zen Reptiles]

Everything sounds right except you didn't mention your supplementation regime. Sounds like over-supplementation to me. How often are you dusting with

1) multi vitamins and/or minerals
2) calcium
3) calcium with d3
4) what brands, and how old are they?
5) do you ever combine them, or do you dust each supplement individually.

The Ensure is probably what caused the change in stool consistency. It sounds like he is lacking something in his diet, maybe some minerals. If he is spending lots of time on the ground, it MIGHT be an indication that he needs some more mineral intake (in nature they would eat small amounts of dirt/soil to compensate for this, which is why he may be spending more time on the ground). Sticky Tongue Farms makes Miner-All and should be supplemented once or twice a month.

 

[Becca G]

I don't think it's over supplementation. I used to use the repcal calcium with d3 and herptivite and that mineral-o. Then I used Rock Solid herpetocultures advanced nutrition support lowland shade chameleon dust formula. That is supposwd to be an all in one formula. Then more recently I would supplement less and try to focus on sufficient gut loading. I have not used the mineral supplement in a long time though. Do you think by adding the minerals back in he could turn around from this? Is the ensure OK to give him for now in small amounts since he is not eatinh much?

 

[Eric Adrignola]

A hornworm every other day is quite a bit of food - my big melleri doesn't eat that much. How much was he normally eating? Overfed chameleons tend to slow down and lose their appetite. How much and how often was he eating before?

 

[Becca G]

He would typically eat maybe 4 or 5 superworms or 2-3 hornworms... but not everyday. Sometimes he would have a big meal and then not eat for a few days... I haven't been giving him crickets lately because he doesny strike accurately anymore and seems to miss more than not. Is 4 and 1/2 considered an aging cham?

 

[sandrachameleon]

Is 4 and 1/2 considered an aging cham?

No, that is not old age. That is middle age.

Has he been checked for parasites?

 

[Becca G]

no, I was actually considering that today when he passed a large very liquidy mustard yellow stool. And I thought I saw something that appeared to be a little bit of bloody mucous at the end- but I'm not sure about that. It had no smell. I thoguht it cld be from the change in diet and ensure.... where could he have picked up parasites? Feeder items? The vet I have previously used for my herps was terrible, but through the link on this site Ive found some more in my area. I'm going to take him on Monday.

 

[sandrachameleon]

Hope you find out something helpful from the new vet

I had 2 of then 6 chameleons get pinworms, and I dont know how or from where, but Im guessing wild caught grasshoppers. Why the others, who ate the same stuff, escaped the issue is beyond me

 

[Zen Reptiles]

Crickets can and often do have pinworms, which take hold of your chameleon when there may not be enough heat for him/her to thermoregulate, or the immune system is supressed. Most reptiles can deal with parasite loads if given enough heat and option to thermoregulate for their immune/biological functions to perform at full capacity.

Panacur is a good idea to use once every several months even if you think your cham is healthy, as Panacur is safe and effective. Do not use Panacur if you think there are worms in the blood system though! That requires a vet.

 

[Becca G]

Well I'm going to bring him in tomorrow. His condition is still not improving. On the weekends I have the time to stand over his cage for hours to coax him to eat or drink, but not during the week. Something's gotta give! Thanks for the advice. This is really depressing... I want my strong chameleon back.