New member fresh cage setup

[cyberlocc]

@cyberlocc The bulb is 8 1/2" from his basking spot it's a Flukers basking bulb the new bulbs I got are regular incandescent bulbs from the hardware store.

Ya go with the 50w, but first find out how old that guy is really. I suspect he is a month old I am not even sure I would provide a basking bulb at all for that cham.

This is a pic of a 3 month old,

Yours is no where near 4. 4 weeks maybe lol.

Have him walk on a ruler to get an idea, at 10 weeks right now my cham is 2.5 inches from nose to vent. Mine is a Ambilobe panther.

 

[Turtlecham]

So I don't know where the miscommunication started between me and the dealer but you are completely correct he is 2 months old. I was ready for a 4 month old thank you for pointing that out.
So I will be taking his basking stick out so there isn't possibilities of burns. I haven't bought feeders yet because I wanted to discuss with the dealer what he has him eating and what size. Is there anything else I should start preparing before I bring the baby home I wasn't nervous before but now I don't know

 

[cyberlocc]

So I don't know where the miscommunication started between me and the dealer but you are completely correct he is 2 months old. I was ready for a 4 month old thank you for pointing that out.
So I will be taking his basking stick out so there isn't possibilities of burns. I haven't bought feeders yet because I wanted to discuss with the dealer what he has him eating and what size. Is there anything else I should start preparing before I bring the baby home I wasn't nervous before but now I don't know

A 2 month old can have basking light up to 80-85 (tops try for 83 tops). So go with the 50w that should be good .

 

[The_Cham_Kid4]

Hey @Turtlecham
I like your cage just wondering what type of perching branches are those i like that moss on the top. Do you know where i could get some of those?

 

[Turtlecham]

@The_Cham_Kid4 thank you and of course i found them on Amazon. 6 18" sticks for 10 bucks. They are called Galapagos mossy terrarium sticks, they also have them at 24" and 36" I believe lol.

 

[mrk13p]

i bought a sambava from the same breeder. hes beautiful at a year old now. I was also from the valley. Try going to Scales n tails in burbank for feeders. Im not sure if they still carry silkworms but they regularly stock hornworms and dubias. I usually just drove to rainbow mealworms. it was about 45 mins from the valley but well worth it. or just order from them online, its local to you.

 

[Turtlecham]

@mrk13p That's great to hear I got him today he's very active and was stomping around his cage immedialty. Apparently underground chams is out he's done breeding after his next batch of eggs hatches.
I live in Burbank my buddy I are at scales and tails frequently they have not had silk worms in a while. I found decent priced ones online that i will be getting soon. I'm about to receive small Phoenix worms tomorrow sense the breeder was feeding him those and I also have dubia nymphs on the way. I have crickets right now I'm going to see if I can get him to eat some calcium dusted ones tomorrow.

 

[Rodney Trotter]

Regarding basking temperatures.... You mentioned lights, thermometers, temps etc (some are high enough to cause damage), but you don't mention how you plan to control the basking temp. As most keepers can't possibly be on hand to monitor temps constantly it is advisable to invest in a dimming thermostat to control the basking light. These have a probe positioned at the basking area. You can set the max desired temp and when reached the thermostat will dim the light accordingly to prevent burning. I personally use a Microclimate B1 Digital Dimming Thermostat (not cheap but works well). You can also get a simpler (cheaper) on / off type but these can shorten bulb life and you can't give such a constant, consistently accurate temp, but either will (if set correctly) prevent serious burns.

Good luck with your chameleon, hope this is useful.

 

[Turtlecham]

@Rodney Trotter youre correct I have nothing at the moment to dim. Through the months and months of me flooding this forum I have yet to see anyone talk about dimmers for there temps I was curious about this and haven't gotten around to ask. My friend has two green tree pythons and some ball pythons and he told me the first thing he saw on the forums were people saying to get the dimmer. He asked me if that was a necessity much like they are with green tree housing and I didn't have a correct answer for him besides I haven't seen anyone mention anything about that. The thing I've been told the most to invest in is a mister. I am a freelance lighting electrician so this last month I have not had work and I have nothing lined up so far so for the time being im a stay at home dad for this Cham. But the mister and a dimmer sound like a good investment when I start working 10+ hour days again.
I have been monitoring the temps of the cage periodically though out the day this last week before I picked up my Cham. The temps were fine until a couple of days ago the temps were almost as high as 100. So I switched out my bulb and raised it a little he can't reach anything over 80 now. I love his sleeping spot from last night

 

[cyberlocc]

@Rodney Trotter youre correct I have nothing at the moment to dim. Through the months and months of me flooding this forum I have yet to see anyone talk about dimmers for there temps I was curious about this and haven't gotten around to ask. My friend has two green tree pythons and some ball pythons and he told me the first thing he saw on the forums were people saying to get the dimmer. He asked me if that was a necessity much like they are with green tree housing and I didn't have a correct answer for him besides I haven't seen anyone mention anything about that. The thing I've been told the most to invest in is a mister. I am a freelance lighting electrician so this last month I have not had work and I have nothing lined up so far so for the time being im a stay at home dad for this Cham. But the mister and a dimmer sound like a good investment when I start working 10+ hour days again.
I have been monitoring the temps of the cage periodically though out the day this last week before I picked up my Cham. The temps were fine until a couple of days ago the temps were almost as high as 100. So I switched out my bulb and raised it a little he can't reach anything over 80 now. I love his sleeping spot from last night

I asked this very question and the answer made sense. The answer was no, Chameleons thermoregulate. Of course so do snakes, however normally snakes use belly heat from heat tape or mats. Those heat mats get too hot, and usually you are suppose to place the probe on the mat/tape. You are not really controlling the cage temp with the dimmer, but the tape temp to prevent a fire.

Also snakes are mostly terrestrial, so they need a more exact temp as they only have access to the heat or not heat. A chameleon has access to an entire cage full of temp gradients (which they need gradients). If they get too hot at the top they will move down, they know what they want and can scale the tall cage to get it.

So no, Get your room as hot as it will likely ever be (or close to it) and get a bulb that puts out that heat. You could also mount the light on a chain or something so really hot days you can raise it some. You could and people do use dimmers for basking lights, but it isnt really needed.

You could use a dimmer, (like a regular dimmer knob) instead of raising the bulb, however this will alter the lights color, and wont be the greatest IMO. However I assumed you meant a proportional thermostat. Big difference between changing a snakes heat pad temps by dimming, then changes a chameleons light source, as dimming will effect the latter in negative ways.

 

[Turtlecham]

Thank you @cyberlocc for the extra information you have been a big help through this.

 

[trickedoutbiker]

You could use a dimmer, (like a regular dimmer knob) instead of raising the bulb, however this will alter the lights color, and wont be the greatest IMO. However I assumed you meant a proportional thermostat. Big difference between changing a snakes heat pad temps by dimming, then changes a chameleons light source, as dimming will effect the latter in negative ways.

That's why on my dual heat bulbs, I only use a dimmer switch on one of them. The other one is always on full blast and puts out good light to attract him towards the heat. My full-blast 60 watt gets my basking temps close to where I want it. I have a second heat bulb, 100 watts, that is on a dimmer switch, and I use it to make the combined temp of the two heat bulbs at 90 °F +/- 2. Sure the 100 watt dims a bit when you turn it down.... But it's still a light, and there is another 60 watt bulb right beside it on full blast that is nice and bright. He never has a problem going over there, as he chills in his basking spot quite a bit in the mornings and evenings.


As far as a proportional thermostat goes....

The only problem you could have using a proportional thermostat, is putting bulbs/heating units on it that are too strong. If you have something that is automated like that, then you want to set it up to where, if something malfunctions and everything turns on full blast, it won't cook your chameleon. With a proportional thermostat, you have to also factor in your cage misting. In order for the thermostat to work, you have to have the probe under the spot you want to monitor. BUT.... when your cage gets sprayed with water, the ambient temps inside the cage drop. That is going to make the thermostat turn up the heat because that probe thinks the cage is colder now. And if water actually gets ON the probe.... then that probe temp is REALLY gonna drop, and therefore, the thermostat is going to turn everything on full blast to get the temps back up and make that probe hot again. This could be bad news if the thermostat decided to heat everything up a lot when the cham is sitting right under the heat units. That's why you would want to make absolutely sure that the cham could not get burned if everything was to somehow go on full blast. You would also want to place the probe in the cage in a way to where the chameleon could never sit on top of it, as that would block heat to the probe, and in turn, turn up the thermostat heating devices when they don't need to be turned up. I mean, it's possible to have a proportional thermostat and if setup right, would work great. But you would have to be very careful about how you go about it as to avoid burns.

 

[cyberlocc]

That's why on my dual heat bulbs, I only use a dimmer switch on one of them. The other one is always on full blast and puts out good light to attract him towards the heat. My full-blast 60 watt gets my basking temps close to where I want it. I have a second heat bulb, 100 watts, that is on a dimmer switch, and I use it to make the combined temp of the two heat bulbs at 90 °F +/- 2. Sure the 100 watt dims a bit when you turn it down.... But it's still a light, and there is another 60 watt bulb right beside it on full blast that is nice and bright. He never has a problem going over there, as he chills in his basking spot quite a bit in the mornings and evenings.


As far as a proportional thermostat goes....

The only problem you could have using a proportional thermostat, is putting bulbs/heating units on it that are too strong. If you have something that is automated like that, then you want to set it up to where, if something malfunctions and everything turns on full blast, it won't cook your chameleon. With a proportional thermostat, you have to also factor in your cage misting. In order for the thermostat to work, you have to have the probe under the spot you want to monitor. BUT.... when your cage gets sprayed with water, the ambient temps inside the cage drop. That is going to make the thermostat turn up the heat because that probe thinks the cage is colder now. And if water actually gets ON the probe.... then that probe temp is REALLY gonna drop, and therefore, the thermostat is going to turn everything on full blast to get the temps back up and make that probe hot again. This could be bad news if the thermostat decided to heat everything up a lot when the cham is sitting right under the heat units. That's why you would want to make absolutely sure that the cham could not get burned if everything was to somehow go on full blast. You would also want to place the probe in the cage in a way to where the chameleon could never sit on top of it, as that would block heat to the probe, and in turn, turn up the thermostat heating devices when they don't need to be turned up. I mean, it's possible to have a proportional thermostat and if setup right, would work great. But you would have to be very careful about how you go about it as to avoid burns.

I agree the only way I would use one is if, it could only get to the highest temp you would ever want. Really at that point though why the spend the 150 for a stat lol .

For bugs and snakes ya I would use a stat for chameleons I wouldn't bother, your going to need plenty of money spent on them for bugs .

I was planning my bug room earlier, its going to cost me about 700 in stats, why do that with my chams as well, waste of money.

 

[trickedoutbiker]

its going to cost me about 700 in stats

Holy sh........ cow.... You gonna supply a zoo with feeders? What all you gonna have? Just find a way to regulate the room temp so it hardly fluctuates.... then put heat units on all your feeders that makes it a perfect temp, and you won't ever really have to adjust anything. Be easy to control room temp with a space heater or something if the room isn't too large. I for one, would never purchase $700 worth of thermostats unless I was planning on getting into the hobby of selling off insects. $700 is just way too pricey IMO to be spending if you are only feeding your own reptiles..... but hey, if you have the money, then go for it. And send some $$ my way.

 

[cyberlocc]

Holy sh........ cow.... You gonna supply a zoo with feeders? What all you gonna have? Just find a way to regulate the room temp so it hardly fluctuates.... then put heat units on all your feeders that makes it a perfect temp, and you won't ever really have to adjust anything. Be easy to control room temp with a space heater or something if the room isn't too large. I for one, would never purchase $700 worth of thermostats unless I was planning on getting into the hobby of selling off insects. $700 is just way too pricey IMO to be spending if you are only feeding your own reptiles..... but hey, if you have the money, then go for it. And send some $$ my way.

Lol I am planning quite a few actually. Its actually quite the opposite of selling bugs that is why I am doing it. The room is connected to the cham room, so it will be semi heat monitored. However to provide night drops for the chams I need to keep the bugs heated.

I am considering ways to reduce it, but its hard lol. So sorry to derail but I will answer why I need that many.

So the plan is to have a 6 foot wire shelf rack, in which I will build cubbys. A cubby for each species .

So the bottom 2 shelves will house roaches (and crickets if I ever decide to do them). There will be 4 bins per shelf as they need large bins, 4 kinds of roaches. Each roach needs to be on its own heat mat with its own stat, this is to prevent excessive breeding. If I have way more than enough dubias, I can turn the stat down so they will breed slower almost stop, if I need to ramp production I can raise it to 95. I can keep the heat mats on 24/7 to ensure 70 degrees for night drops (or whatever base temp that roach needs).

I will only have 4 species of roach from my current plan, so each gets 2 cubbys. However I wan the temp per cubby to be different. I dont want the baby roaches in the second cubby to grow quickly, as these will be my feeders and I want them to grow slow and fat (plus for babie chams that need babies to stay babies longer). So these cubbys will be set to 70 most of the time, however if I am getting not fast enough growth for a time I need to be able to ramp heat and with it growth.

So this accounts for needing 2 Herpstat 4s, 1 for breeders, 1 for feeders. This way all roaches are controllable 1 at a time, as my needs change.

Next shelves above. Dont need to be as tall, so these will be split into 6 sections (3 shelves, 2 cubbys per shelf). These will be for worms/beetles/isopods/other. Now do to similar heat requirements I can bundle a few species of Ispods in 1 cubby, These can be kept at 75 degrees, I can put my silkworms in 1 cubby, (this is another temp changer) superworms in another cubby, beetles share a cubby for a few species, flys share a cubby for a few species, and other (I am hoping stick bugs, but IDK yet) have a cubby.

This will require 1 Herpstat 6, I could likely run this from a Herp stat 2, as they really dont need as fine temp controls(each shelf can be controlled to 75, a herpstat 1 wouldn't work as the higher shelf will be hotter) and I may do that I am not sure.

Then on the side of the wire shelf, will be 2 wine chillers, 1 will be Compressor based and used at 39 degrees, for storing silkworm eggs and Butterworms, the other will be a cheap thermometric for storing horn worms, and slowing bugs down. (this is another 700 dollars lol). Then I will make an DIY incubator for silks, and place this on here as well.

So the price for the stats, If I go with 2 4s and a 2, that would be 339+339+195, so actually 900. If I go with 2 6s it would be 439+439 so almost 900, if I go with a 6 and a 4 it would 439+339 so 800 (cheapest option)

From a convenience standpoint and to better organize a 4+4+6 or 4+4+2 would be best. A 4+4 is also a possibility, assuming that each shelf has its own temp ranges (aside from breeding dubia) this is the least ideal IMO, as I can not change the roach nymphs temp individually, however that may not matter if I meet in the middle, so like 80 throughout the roaches, 90 for breeders (adjustable) and 75 for the top 3 shelves.

If I used a 4 and a 2, then I would have to figure where to place the probes, I could set the roach shelf to 80, but where do I measure the second? If I measure the shelf above the roach feeders the temp between that and the top shelf will alter by a bit, but how much? I could likely figure the difference and alter placement to suit it, but wouldn't it be easier to just spend the extra few dollars?