Need Help For Chamaeleo Africanus!!!!!!

[bertolocci]

Hi there friends..
i have a baby Chamaeleo africanus, about 6 month age (13 cm, female).
So there is the problem:
Her bones (legs and arms) looks wierd and twisted. i can clearly say she is not walking, she looks like she is crawling, she barely climbs...
i am using;
* exo-terra "electrolyte & vitamin D3", and for a few days ago i started to use exo-terra calcium (liquid supplement) in her drinking water.
* plus, i have exo-terra 25w Day Glo and exo-terra Repti Glo (2.0 UVB-13W)

So could you help me to diagnose the problem and what can i do to make her better???

 

[kinyonga]

Could you post a photo and fill in the questionnaire in the how to ask for help thread in the health forum please. Sounds like it could be MBD.

 

[szpond]

https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/

There you go, please fill this out so we can help with the knowledge!

What was your supplementing schedule on a day to day basis? How often did she get her feeders dusted?

Also when you say "drinking water" do you mean the water that you use in a dripper, or sitting water?

 

[ChamMan7]

Definitely sounds like MBD, but you should fill out the above questionnaire so we can get a better idea.

 

[bertolocci]

https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/

There you go, please fill this out so we can help with the knowledge!

What was your supplementing schedule on a day to day basis? How often did she get her feeders dusted?

Also when you say "drinking water" do you mean the water that you use in a dripper, or sitting water?

Chameleon Info:
Chameleon - Africanus, female, and 6 moth age. In my care for 4 months
Feeding - Grasshoppers and mealworms. mealworms; 2 days in a row and Grasshoppers; 4-5 days in a month
Supplements - one week: exo-terra "electrolyte & vitamin D3 (liquid supplement)
another week: exo-terra calcium (liquid supplement)
i put the supplements in to spraying water, and she drinks from the leaves.
Ps: i am not using "dusting feeders" and clearly i need help/advise about it
Watering - i am using spraying method to the cage directly 2 times in a day and she drinks from the leaves


Fecal Description -black and little white color droppings.



Cage Info:
Cage Type - Glass and wire combo, 25 cm high, 45 cm lenght
Lighting- i have exo-terra 25w Day Glo and exo-terra Repti Glo (2.0 UVB-13W) changing daily one another
Temperature - Lowest overnight 17-18 celsius, daily about 26 celsius,
Humidity - minimun about %60 (my city level) plus i am sprayin it 2 times in a day
Plants - i have 2 live plants, one is Bonsai and i dont know the others name
Placement - in sitting room, on a commode (not on the floor)
Location - Istanbul?

 

[ChamMan7]

quite a few things need addressing there. The supplements first off. You should be DUSTING with a high quality calcium supplement with NO D3 every day, and a vitamin supplement every two Weeks. You should dust with D3 and calcium around twice a month.

Second, she looks very pudgy... get her off the mealworms every day as those are very poor quality feeders. The crickets / grasshoppers should make up the bulk of her diet...

Third, that cage is wayyyy too small.. a greater influence should be placed on height vs. length. She needs more space and can definitley use the excercise...

She also could have some issues with gout, and that would come from the high protein/poor quality feeders she is getting...

Also, why are you changing your lights daily? She should have access to both a basking spot and a source of UV every day.

 

[bertolocci]

quite a few things need addressing there. The supplements first off. You should be DUSTING with a high quality calcium supplement with NO D3 every day, and a vitamin supplement every two Weeks. You should dust with D3 and calcium around twice a month.

Second, she looks very pudgy... get her off the mealworms every day as those are very poor quality feeders. The crickets / grasshoppers should make up the bulk of her diet...

Third, that cage is wayyyy too small.. a greater influence should be placed on height vs. length. She needs more space and can definitley use the excercise...

She also could have some issues with gout, and that would come from the high protein/poor quality feeders she is getting...

thank you very much.. these are very useful for me.
And should i put a "sitting water" in to the terrarium? or dusting is enough?

 

[ChamMan7]

No problem, I dont know if you saw the edit.. but she should be getting a basking spot AND UV access every day. Leave both on, because she really needs access to both, especially the UV at the moment..

That MBD is not reversible and she will always have the crooked limbs now, but she can gain back her strength. Also, you should take out the dirt. It would be a much better idea to keep her on paper towel or nothing at all, and if she is crawling around on the ground, it would be much more sanitary to remove the substrate.

 

[ChamMan7]

She wont drink from a sitting water source, so continue misting, for sure. You could keep putting the liquid calcium drops in the water though as she definitely needs the excess calcium at the moment.

A proper dusting schedule is usually sufficient, but in her case you should keep putting the calcium drops in her mistings also, especially while she is this unhealthy.

 

[bertolocci]

Also, why are you changing your lights daily? She should have access to both a basking spot and a source of UV every day.

the answer is; i think i have a small terrarium

and it will sound weird but i wanna ask this (i am an amateur please forgive)
should the lights stay open at nights? or 12 hours in a day is enough?

 

[ChamMan7]

No, dont leave the lights on at nights. She should have a 12 hour on, 12 hour off light cycle where BOTH lights are on at the same time.

And no worries, thats what the forum is for.. to ask questions!

 

[bertolocci]

No, dont leave the lights on at nights. She should have a 12 hour on, 12 hour off light cycle where BOTH lights are on at the same time.

And no worries, thats what the forum is for.. to ask questions!

Thanks my friend!

 

[kinyonga]

She appears to have MBD. The fastest way to correct this is to have a vet give her calcium injections and when the blood calcium levels are high enough a shot of calcitonin which rapidly draws the calcium back into the bones.

House hen need to maintain a balance in the nutrient levels to keep it from happening again.

Appropriate temperatures will allow for good digestion and thus play a part in the nutrient absorption. The basking temperature should be in the mid to high 80'sF for this species I think.

Exposure to UVB will allow the chameleon to produce D3 which will allow it to use the calcium in its system....so I would recommend leaving the UVB light on for about 12 hours a day.

Supplements and gutloading are also important.

Since most of the feeder insects have a poor ratio of calcium to phos its important to dust at most feedings with a phos - free calcium powder. To make up for it.

It is also recommended that you dust the insects just before feeding them to the chameleon twice a month wih a phos - free calcium / D3 powder to ensure that the chameleon gets some D3 without overdosing it and leaving it to produce the rest from its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system and lead to health issues so don't overdo it.

It's recommended that you dust with vitamins that have a beta carotene source of vitamin A twice a month too. Beta carotene (prOformed) will not build up in the system like prEformed vitamin A will so it will not be overdosed. This leaves you in charge of whether or not to give any prEformed.

You can feed/gutload crickets,superworms, locusts, roaches with an assortment of greens such as dandelions, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, kale, etc. And veggiessuch as carrots, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, squash, zucchini, etc.

Calcium, D3, phos, and vitamin A are all players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon and need to be in balance.

Hope this helps.