my lil set up pics :P

[mr and mrs]

I am also in the UK and I don't use any substrate at all. I have selaed an offcut of vinyl flooring into the bottom of both my vivs using aquarium sealant. It looks really good and is easy to clean! There is always a risk of the cham shooting his/her food and accidentally eating part of the substrate, and this may cause impaction if the piece is large enough to cause a blockage.

i was going to ask if kitchen flooring lilo as we call it would be suitable as i said to my wife it would be easy to clean i guess you have just answered my thoughts

thank you ladys and gents you are all so helpfull why are pet store staff so stupid ( no offensive to any whom are its just the ones i have encountered)

 

[mr and mrs]

First off, I want to say how I think its hilarious that people (mostly Americans) act like the UK and Europe in general is on a different planet when it comes to chameleon keeping.

Second, I don't see why you couldn't keep a veiled in there for a good first bit of the time. I know people who raise their veileds in tubs (not much vertical space) until they are a good 5 or 6 months old.(with 5-10 siblings in tubs no wider or taller than the enclosure you plan for ONE animal.)

Lets get this out there too. YOU CAN USE GLASS ENCLOSURES!! Someone mentioned earlier in this post that you could keep a baby in a glass enclosure, but an adult needs a screen cage. I would like to know why that is. Do chameleons start hating glass at the age of 4 months? Or do they not need good ventilation till they are 4-5 months old?

Yes, glass enclosures can have ventilation issues, BUT so can a screen cage. Hell if you don't get fresh air into your room to start off with then you have failed with your screen cages. I think some people need to get over themselves and start fixing their own problems with their husbandry before they decide to contribute.

To sum this all up I just want to say I think you are doing a good job. I would remove the substrate myself and use paper towels, or I would plant the bottom of the enclosure but that is a whole other bag of worms. One other thing to be careful of is temps, just monitor them closely, if it gets too hot lower your wattage of bulb and/or move it further away from your basking spot.

See ya,

Todd

Ps. If I have learned one thing from about chameleon forums it is that you need to be careful of what advise you listen to. There are a lot of people that continuously repeat misinformation. Stick with what successful keepers tell you.

first of all thank you. i have also read god knows how many times glass is fine substrate is being removed ! as everyone seems to have the same advise on that . this is a temp tank taller one is coming as from reading all over the web hight is a must ! i have been testing temps last day or so even when everyone else is sleeping and its cooler i have been getting up testing temps so far average temps are - day basking 81 - mid 77 - cooler part- 74 - night time ranging from 70-72 , humidity 50% - 80-88% after misting.

 

[mr and mrs]

I know where Surrey is. I went to UK for training in Chertsey.

I think I passed Surrey on the train to Waterloo...

Sorry for the hijack...

chertsey is in surrey !!! google mapped it its not to far from us 33 miles ish (surrey is a county btw)

 

[Mr Wilson]

The only thing bad I've heard about glass enclosures are that the reflection in the glass can cause stress (thinking there is another cham in the enclosure) and that because the only ventilation is up top it allows bacteria to grow more. That's just what I've heard

We used a glass enclosure for our first cham who passed away. We don't know if maybe it did create some sort of bacteria in there or if it was the cause of her not surviving, but after she died we switched to an all screen enclosure just to be safe.

 

[canzoman]

chertsey is in surrey !!! google mapped it its not to far from us 33 miles ish (surrey is a county btw)

oh lol sorry bout that. Good to know. thanks.

 

[mr and mrs]

oh lol sorry bout that. Good to know. thanks.

no need to be sorry lol easy mistake what was the training for ? where you from ??

 

[mr and mrs]

The only thing bad I've heard about glass enclosures are that the reflection in the glass can cause stress (thinking there is another cham in the enclosure) and that because the only ventilation is up top it allows bacteria to grow more. That's just what I've heard

We used a glass enclosure for our first cham who passed away. We don't know if maybe it did create some sort of bacteria in there or if it was the cause of her not surviving, but after she died we switched to an all screen enclosure just to be safe.

perfect place for bacteria to breed i guess ! if it was cleaned regularly (not saying you didnt) then should be ok ??? as for the refection my wife came up with a good idea we could use bamboo screening to block the reflection we still then get the help from the glass to keep our temps etc up but this way the cham cant see him/her self ??

 

[canzoman]

no need to be sorry lol easy mistake what was the training for ? where you from ??

I am from NJ. Training was for work. I work for ADP payroll....I had to train them on new security Hand scanners. fun stuff lol....

 

[Julirs]

If I lived where it was cold I am sure I would be keeping in glass, but here in Florida and especially since I keep a few species outside glass is not practical. One still needs to consider other conditions before saying a particular cage will or won't work. My personal fear of even keeping montanes in glass here is if the air went out it would be disastrous on a 90 degree day.

 

[Brad Ramsey]

as for the refection my wife came up with a good idea we could use bamboo screening to block the reflection we still then get the help from the glass to keep our temps etc up but this way the cham cant see him/her self ??

Don't worry about the reflection "myth"
It's fine the way it is.

-Brad

 

[mr and mrs]

thank you one and all, i got some fresh bamboo last night massive lengths some 20ft lengths lol going to build a climbing frame for him when i get time this week


my wife has just gone to rescue a little leopard gecko ! poor thing doesnt have correct heating etc so looks like back off to the pet centre

 

[SpinyFranky]

thank you one and all, i got some fresh bamboo last night massive lengths some 20ft lengths lol going to build a climbing frame for him when i get time this week


my wife has just gone to rescue a little leopard gecko ! poor thing doesnt have correct heating etc so looks like back off to the pet centre

As Stated, the "glass reflection" theory is a total myth that has no evidence to be proven anything else. I would suggest however, keeping the cage away from any mirrors in the room, there eye sight is incredible for a creature so small.

Also as stated, people should read a little more before being so quick to speak. That glass enclosure will be fine for a while at least, you could in fact keep him in a glass enclosure his entire life, and he would be quite the happy little mate. I would go ahead and say that 24 inches will be a sufficient height until the animal gets to be around 4-5 months. At this point a 36 inch cage becomes appropriate, with a final 48 inch cage at 10 months and beyond. Note that females can spend their entire lives in a 36 inch cage ( due to gender differences in size ) and have more room than they would know what to do with.

Corrections:

Remove the substrate, replace it either with substrate so large it could never fit in his mouth (pebbles/stones) or use tiling, or even leave it plain.

I see the thermometer read 81F, that is a little cold. Shoot for an 85F basking spot, when the animal matures it might be even best to raise basking to 90F. However I would not do that until the animal was at least 10 months of age.

80% humidity is too high for a veiled, and can likely lead to a respiratory infection. Aim to keep the humidity a constant 45%-50%. Though I am sure a Pardalis or Montane would love you for that 80% humidity alone.

Be sure to disinfect anything that you collect from outside, even from the pet stores - bacteria amongst reptiles can become a serious issue if left untreated.

Baking your bamboo, or drenching it in a bleach solution followed by either a good hot water hose down, or steam clean will not only kill any bacteria or parasites that could potentially be lurking on it, but should also harden it enough to make it a favorite climbing material for your little friend.

What UVB are you planning on using?

I see the supplements were already mentioned, Repcal is a great brand and very inexpensive for something so important.

S.F

 

[mr and mrs]

im using a 5.0 reti glo linear for uvb

substrate been thrown out !!!!!

the temp at that time was lower as it was a cold point during the day when i took the pics, the basking spot is 83-84 on average through out the day i have read not to have it too high for a lil one

the humidity is normally 50% but after i mist it it went up 2 the 80% ! (is this bad ?) it dropped back to 50% after about 30 mins....

thanks for the advise

 

[Miss Lily]

The humidity sounds fine - you may need to wipe excess water up from the cage bottom, but that is easily done. My first female lived in my Exo Terra her whole life and I never once saw any signs that she could see her reflection. My latest female also lives in that viv and she also shows no signs of being able to see herself. Tommy has glass doors on the front of his wooden viv and despite him being male and reacting to his own reflection in a mirror, he can't see his own reflection at all, or he would be showing off all day long, lol!

I would agree that their eyesight is very good though - we had a new stainless steel light fitting put up in the kitcehn and I stood under it the other day with Tommy on my shoulder. The little monster could see himself in that and he instantly started displaying at his reflection! You will know if the glass is a problem by your chams behaviour.

 

[Nixehface]

I'm in Surrey too - Guildford!
Where abouts are you?

Also with my viv.. I just custom built a wooden one with a mesh top and bottom half and tiled the floor so it's super easy to keep clean!
I also drilled holes in the bottom and installed a drainage tray for when the mister is going off

EDIT: Also, I know loads of people who keep their veileds in exo terra's and they are all fine, I think they have bigger ones though.
Looks good anyway

 

[SpinyFranky]

im using a 5.0 reti glo linear for uvb

substrate been thrown out !!!!!

the temp at that time was lower as it was a cold point during the day when i took the pics, the basking spot is 83-84 on average through out the day i have read not to have it too high for a lil one

the humidity is normally 50% but after i mist it it went up 2 the 80% ! (is this bad ?) it dropped back to 50% after about 30 mins....

thanks for the advise

what you mention about the temp is a slight problem indicator....

preferably you want the temperature to be a Constant 85F with a one or two degree variable. If its sinking to 81F during the day or getting passed 88F (with the animal being young), then that it called a temperature swing and is not the greatest thing for your pets well being.

Temperature is a direct influence on its metabolism (which will determine how often he sheds/grow/eats/e.t.c e.t.c) and immune system, as well as the fact that they use heat to keep the food contents in their stomachs from rotting.

a slight swing during the day ( a degree or two ) is not bad at all, but more than that can become an issue.

80% humidity after spraying is fine, after spraying, that will always happen when using your glass enclosure. Just be sure that the cage has a good amount of time to dry out properly, or as stated dry the bottom before misting.

Never let the chameleon go to sleep with water in the cage, especially puddles, as these can be the biggest source of a respiratory infection.

 

[mr and mrs]

I'm in Surrey too - Guildford!
Where abouts are you?

Also with my viv.. I just custom built a wooden one with a mesh top and bottom half and tiled the floor so it's super easy to keep clean!
I also drilled holes in the bottom and installed a drainage tray for when the mister is going off

EDIT: Also, I know loads of people who keep their veileds in exo terra's and they are all fine, I think they have bigger ones though.
Looks good anyway

the one i have have is bigger than the one there using the pet centre so it will do till i have made my new large enclosure its going to be in there 3 weeks 4 weeks max ! then will be moved to his permanent home !!!

i live in in lingfield ! about 20 or so mins away from guildford

 

[mr and mrs]

what you mention about the temp is a slight problem indicator....

preferably you want the temperature to be a Constant 85F with a one or two degree variable. If its sinking to 81F during the day or getting passed 88F (with the animal being young), then that it called a temperature swing and is not the greatest thing for your pets well being.

Temperature is a direct influence on its metabolism (which will determine how often he sheds/grow/eats/e.t.c e.t.c) and immune system, as well as the fact that they use heat to keep the food contents in their stomachs from rotting.

a slight swing during the day ( a degree or two ) is not bad at all, but more than that can become an issue.

80% humidity after spraying is fine, after spraying, that will always happen when using your glass enclosure. Just be sure that the cage has a good amount of time to dry out properly, or as stated dry the bottom before misting.

Never let the chameleon go to sleep with water in the cage, especially puddles, as these can be the biggest source of a respiratory infection.

i moved the bulb a few mm closer its now at 85 and hasnt changed much been monitoring it last day+ been pretty consistent.

thanks for the advise on not leaving water in the viv over night