Lethargic Yemen Chameleon

[sofiluan13]

Hi everyone.

I have a Yemen Chameleon and he is around 4 years old.

The last few weeks he has been very lethargic, lying on his side, hanging on his side, hanging upside down, not eating, not drinking and not using his tongue.

We took him to the vets for a full work up on blood tests.
Everything came back great, kidneys, liver and calcium are perfect!

Now ourselves and the vets are at a slump at what to do for him and where to go now.

We are giving him critical care syringed in his mouth and putting food in his mouth hoping he eats it, as well as the obvious misting etc.

The set up is a Bioactive Vivarium, T5 24w uvb, and 60w heat bulb that gets not hotter than 33 degrees. This has been the same since he was little.

If anyone has any ideas I am so grateful! We just want to help him the best way we can…


I’ve attached a photo of how we tend to find him.

Thanks
Sofi

 

[kinyonga]

Welcome to the forum!

Please post some photos of him from both sides.

 

[MissSkittles]

Poor guy. From the info you’ve given, all I can say is his temp is a bit too warm. It should be kept a bit lower at 29c. I’ve got some questions to maybe try and help figure out what could be going on, besides old age. Have you had him for all of his life? Wondering what supplements you use and how often they’re given. Has his uvb bulb been changed within the last year? What brand bulb and what strength do you use? What is the distance between basking area and lights? Has he had a good poo lately? If not, did your vet take any x rays? Has he ever been checked for parasites?

 

[sofiluan13]

Poor guy. From the info you’ve given, all I can say is his temp is a bit too warm. It should be kept a bit lower at 29c. I’ve got some questions to maybe try and help figure out what could be going on, besides old age. Have you had him for all of his life? Wondering what supplements you use and how often they’re given. Has his uvb bulb been changed within the last year? What brand bulb and what strength do you use? What is the distance between basking area and lights? Has he had a good poo lately? If not, did your vet take any x rays? Has he ever been checked for parasites?

Thank you for replying quickly!

So the heat is on a micro climate to cut off at 33 but I will definitely lower it tomorrow for him.

So we bought him when he was 6 weeks old! He was sold to us as older but he definitely wasn’t, so we basically hand raised him until he could eat properly himself.

Supplement we use.

Calcium 2/3 times a week
D3 once every 2 weeks
Earth pro multivitamin once every 2 weeks
Water conditioner in his water (we have hard water)


When he started getting bad we changed all the bulbs and everything to rule anything out. We use the reptile system zone 3 t5 24w bulb. It used to be the Arcadia 12%.
Again reptile system heat bulb 60w
Distance is around 30-40cm.


Honestly I don’t think I have seen any urine or poo for a couple of weeks. We do have a bioactive vivarium also so it’s hard to find them as we have little bugs that eat it quickly (they are chameleon friendly)

and x-rays the vet said not to do any as it is expensive and she thinks it will not show anything as his legs and back etc all seem to be aligned and fine.

 

[sofiluan13]

Welcome to the forum!

Please post some photos of him from both sides.

Hi!

Here he is. We noticed a black mark on his casque around the same time he started getting poorly. Vets said not to worry. At first I thought maybe a burn? But there’s no way he can burn himself were the basking area is. And as he’s so weak he isn’t climbing high enough to do that damage.

 

[MissSkittles]

Thank you for replying quickly!

So the heat is on a micro climate to cut off at 33 but I will definitely lower it tomorrow for him.

So we bought him when he was 6 weeks old! He was sold to us as older but he definitely wasn’t, so we basically hand raised him until he could eat properly himself.

Supplement we use.

Calcium 2/3 times a week
D3 once every 2 weeks
Earth pro multivitamin once every 2 weeks
Water conditioner in his water (we have hard water)


When he started getting bad we changed all the bulbs and everything to rule anything out. We use the reptile system zone 3 t5 24w bulb. It used to be the Arcadia 12%.
Again reptile system heat bulb 60w
Distance is around 30-40cm.


Honestly I don’t think I have seen any urine or poo for a couple of weeks. We do have a bioactive vivarium also so it’s hard to find them as we have little bugs that eat it quickly (they are chameleon friendly)

and x-rays the vet said not to do any as it is expensive and she thinks it will not show anything as his legs and back etc all seem to be aligned and fine.

Supplements looks good, but calcium should be lightly dusted every feeding…unless you are feeding him 2-3 times a week. He is holding a bit of fat in his casque and cheeks, but not really bad - just a tad overweight.
Speaking of his casque, that black spot on the tip does look like a burn or some other type wound. I would be asking my vet for some silver sulfadiazine cream to apply to that area daily. Is it possible that something bit him there, like maybe a spider? Could he have rubbed it or gotten poked by anything? Some of the artificial plants are scratchy and poky.
Do you have or know someone who has a solarmeter 6.5 to double check the uvb output? At about 31cm, the reading should be somewhere around 3-4 with your strength bulb.
Yes, I am very familiar with the challenge of finding poo in bioactive setups. lol The reason I asked about poos is because I do see some artificial plants in his enclosure. Many or most veileds will at least nibble their plants and have been known to eat the fake ones which then can cause a bowel obstruction.
I wish there was an obvious cause, but aside for concern about the black wound on his casque and his age, I don’t see anything. Perhaps @kinyonga or another member has more input for you.

 

[kinyonga]

Can you post one of the back right leg please. I need to see the chameleon more from the side….more like this…
https://www.shutterstock.com/image-photo/portrait-side-view-veiled-chameleon-chamaeleo-2348184837

 

[sofiluan13]

Supplements looks good, but calcium should be lightly dusted every feeding…unless you are feeding him 2-3 times a week. He is holding a bit of fat in his casque and cheeks, but not really bad - just a tad overweight.
Speaking of his casque, that black spot on the tip does look like a burn or some other type wound. I would be asking my vet for some silver sulfadiazine cream to apply to that area daily. Is it possible that something bit him there, like maybe a spider? Could he have rubbed it or gotten poked by anything? Some of the artificial plants are scratchy and poky.
Do you have or know someone who has a solarmeter 6.5 to double check the uvb output? At about 31cm, the reading should be somewhere around 3-4 with your strength bulb.
Yes, I am very familiar with the challenge of finding poo in bioactive setups. lol The reason I asked about poos is because I do see some artificial plants in his enclosure. Many or most veileds will at least nibble their plants and have been known to eat the fake ones which then can cause a bowel obstruction.
I wish there was an obvious cause, but aside for concern about the black wound on his casque and his age, I don’t see anything. Perhaps @kinyonga or another member has more input for you.

Hi!

Thank you for replying again….
He only used to eat 2/3 times a week, he never wanted to eat anymore. Now we’re lucky if he eats once a weeks

He’s never eaten the plants but I’ll be having a look today to see if I can see any.

I’ve gone to him this morning and he has lost a couple of spiky horns under his chin, not sure how, maybe as he has fallen or rubbed them while he is on his side.

Definitely a vet call this morning!

 

[sofiluan13]

Can you post one of the back right leg please. I need to see the chameleon more from the side….more like this…
https://www.shutterstock.com/image-photo/portrait-side-view-veiled-chameleon-chamaeleo-2348184837

Hi this is the best I could this morning before work. The lights haven’t come on just yet.

I’ve gone to him and he looks to have lost a couple of spikes under his chin, which is heartbreaking for him, I presumed he may have fallen as I picked him up dangling upside down.


His coloured isn’t normally like that, that’s his evening colour I call it! The colour perks up when he basks

 

[MissSkittles]

You might want to put him in a hospital bin to keep him safe from injury. It’s basically a plastic bin that you can set up a plant and a stable branch or two or a vine for him to have something to grip. Lights on top at a correct distance so as not to blast him with heat or uvb and if needed, a screen top to keep other animals out (if you have any) and him in.

 

[sofiluan13]

That was my thought to stop him hurting himself.
Not sure how to do the lights for him though

I really appreciate the help

 

[MissSkittles]

In the past for different creatures I used a bendable /gooseneck type table lamp and just bent it over where I needed. Any metal mesh or screen over the top of the bin will do and then you can set your lights on it or whatever you’ll be using to elevate them if needed. If you have a screened enclosure, you could remove the door or a side panel. If not that, maybe you can borrow one of the screen from a window or storm door. You may have to get creative with what you have or go out and buy a screen aquarium top. Think like MacGuyver.

 

[sofiluan13]

In the past for different creatures I used a bendable /gooseneck type table lamp and just bent it over where I needed. Any metal mesh or screen over the top of the bin will do and then you can set your lights on it or whatever you’ll be using to elevate them if needed. If you have a screened enclosure, you could remove the door or a side panel. If not that, maybe you can borrow one of the screen from a window or storm door. You may have to get creative with what you have or go out and buy a screen aquarium top. Think like MacGuyver.

Thank you!


I had a call from the vet.
He has high enzymes in his muscles so he is on an anti inflammatory to help his stiffness and to make him mobile. We during e it in his mouth but he is spitting it out.

Any tips to make sure he swallows it?

 

[MissSkittles]

Thank you!


I had a call from the vet.
He has high enzymes in his muscles so he is on an anti inflammatory to help his stiffness and to make him mobile. We during e it in his mouth but he is spitting it out.

Any tips to make sure he swallows it?

I was wondering how your guy was doing today. You want to aim towards the very back of his throat (blue arrow). Holding him so that his head is pointing upwards for gravity may help. The airway (red arrow) is in the front of the mouth, so be careful. It’s easiest with two people, but I’m alone and can tell you it’s not impossible for one person to manage. Give him a bunched up towel to hold on to and maybe do this on or over a table.

 

[sofiluan13]

That’s definitely helped thank you! This is him now. We have moved him to the floor as he keeps falling. Don’t know what else to do or how to help him now

 

[MissSkittles]

That’s definitely helped thank you! This is him now. We have moved him to the floor as he keeps falling. Don’t know what else to do or how to help him now

From all you say and have done, I think you’re doing all you can do. I suspect much of what’s going on is his age. At 4 years old, he’s basically an old man. While veileds can live to be 6-7, the equivalent of that is that humans can live to their 90’s and 100’s. I wish I had better solutions for you.