Jungle Dawn LED's

cloverthechameleon

Avid Member
Hello everybody, summer is over here in Vancouver and its time to take my Plants inside.
Ive been researching LED's lately and ive come to the conclusion that Jungle dawn Has some of the best on the market for our hobby.
After reading i have afew questions that come to mind.

I have afew plants that have been outside all summer, blooming and soaking up the sun.
Its getting far to cold and miserable outside for them now so i have to place them in my enclosures.

My questions are..

Are these lights bright enough to meet the needs of plants that require high light, ie hibiscus?

The 7" 13 watt light is the one i had my eye on but it is such an odd shape i was wondering how this bulb is suppose to fit a regular "clamp lamp" style light?
Not really concerned about this as i could easily make a fixture for it but i would like to hear peoples opinions on how they fixture these bulbs.

Also wondering how much heat these things give off especially the larger $70 "glow grow" bulb as im running arcadia HO 6% bulbs and 60 watt heat bulbs already and the temperatures in my Vivs are perfect.

Thank you, just wanted to hear peoples opinions on these bulbs before i start to drop some cash on them.
 

Decadancin

Moderatoris Americanus
Staff member
YES!!! :D Another lighting thread (y). This has been a great topic, especially lately. I know some have been experimenting with different options recently and I'm sure there will be some great replies. Just my two cents (that is all I can afford on a Moderator's salary :() You may not get blooms on a hibiscus after being outside all summer. Wait, do you get summer up there in Canada?
 

cloverthechameleon

Avid Member
Hahaha yes we get a surprisingly nice summer up here. Not expecting my hibiscus to bloom under these lights (all though that would be amazing) I just want to keep them alive, they just seem to slowly die off with the current light set up I have going on. Thank you for your 2 pennies !(Canadian word for a cent)
 

dshuld

Chameleon Enthusiast
Well, I can tell you arcadia 12%, arcadia freshwater pro led, finnex planted plus and two ecosmart 120w equivalent 5000k bulbs were enough for flowering when put together. However, all of that together doesn't have the punch for even a 30" tall enclosure to keep the lower level leafs from dropping.

I've been keeping @Decadancin up on my pool bulb "experiment" with hibiscus via pm. Part of the pm's I'm not ready to share publicly yet how ever. Currently I have 2 6500k bulbs and 1 3000k bulb along with the Arcadia freshwater pro led and Arcadia 12% on top of the cage. As I mentioned to decadancin earlier today I'll be adding another 3000k to the mix but I have more buds on the two plants under those lights then my 5 east facing bushes outside right now. Realistically, I wish they had the 4000k version available to try because it is close enough to the "m" the 6500k and 3000k create together to function on it's own I think. Here is the curve for the bulbs so that makes a little more sense lol.

Screenshot_2018-08-27-13-22-23-1.png
 

cyberlocc

Chameleon Enthusiast
The JD spots are good,

Depending on your budget, you could get much better though.

What is your cage size and budget? And what level of DIY are you comfortable with? As far as affordable, easy, good cage lighting JD spots are great.
 

Brodybreaux25

Chameleon Enthusiast
The JD spots are good,

Depending on your budget, you could get much better though.

What is your cage size and budget? And what level of DIY are you comfortable with? As far as affordable, easy, good cage lighting JD spots are great.
Each customer is different, generally speaking about 30-35% of each build goes toward lighting. I typically install 48” Quad fixtures, they are fine for most but lately everyone seems to want plants that require full sun.
 

nick barta

Chameleon Enthusiast
Site Sponsor
YES!!! :D Another lighting thread (y). This has been a great topic, especially lately. I know some have been experimenting with different options recently and I'm sure there will be some great replies. Just my two cents (that is all I can afford on a Moderator's salary :() You may not get blooms on a hibiscus after being outside all summer. Wait, do you get summer up there in Canada?
I will pay you 10 times what you got paid for being a Moderator this last year...10 X 0=SORRY.
 

cyberlocc

Chameleon Enthusiast
Each customer is different, generally speaking about 30-35% of each build goes toward lighting. I typically install 48” Quad fixtures, they are fine for most but lately everyone seems to want plants that require full sun.

I like the quads okay. They definitely have their postives, such as providing UVA which herps can see.

It's the PAR that gets me, but with a Quad or more the par shouldn't be that bad. Not full sun for the whole cage, but not that bad.
 

cloverthechameleon

Avid Member
The JD spots are good,

Depending on your budget, you could get much better though.

What is your cage size and budget? And what level of DIY are you comfortable with? As far as affordable, easy, good cage lighting JD spots are great.

The cage in which i have room to add the plants to is 44" long 44'' tall and 22'' deep, its divided into 2 enclosures with a divider in the middle. Not trying to spend hundreds and hundreds of dollars but im willing to spend abit to get the proper lighting for the plants to flourish. Open to a DIY project as i usually construct my own enclosures to the desired size i like. Want to use this enclosure as kind of a test, if all works well i would incorporate the new lighting to all enclosures in the future.
 

cyberlocc

Chameleon Enthusiast
The cage in which i have room to add the plants to is 44" long 44'' tall and 22'' deep, its divided into 2 enclosures with a divider in the middle. Not trying to spend hundreds and hundreds of dollars but im willing to spend abit to get the proper lighting for the plants to flourish. Open to a DIY project as i usually construct my own enclosures to the desired size i like. Want to use this enclosure as kind of a test, if all works well i would incorporate the new lighting to all enclosures in the future.

Okay, so cheap, bright and easy? Got you.

I am partial to these LEDs. 5600k, 92CRI, extremely good efficiency. If you run them at 50ws (1500ma, 37ish V) they are 160 L/W. Thats almost double the JDs.

http://www.futureelectronics.com/en...=CPCBuyNow&utm_campaign=Octopart_Ext_Referral


The Fresh Fishs, are pretty much the highest CRI LED we have access to with a affordable price. I been told they are 96 or so CRI, 6500k, good COBs, however not as efficient as the Veros. but still more efficient than JD spots.

https://www.mouser.com/ProductDetail/Lumileds/L2C5-FS001211E1900/?qs=COJyYuYQspuJsqhvp9YOZA==&gclid=Cj0KCQjw3KzdBRDWARIsAIJ8TMTixADxEzHpbOICqi1I8uoQA5vpzP5umufVsGzB8UVUPgrvZJftTrcaAl8FEALw_wcB


Now you have a few sink options, in this case, if your trying to stay cheap and easy, and just run a few COBs, Id go with these.
https://www.rapidled.com/140mm-pin-heatsink/

There is probably some other ways to hang them, but the easy and for them way is here, https://www.rapidled.com/48-canopy-rail/.

Then we would need to find you a PSU, but that will depend, on how many of these you would want, and if you want FF or Veros. Also there is reflector options. You could do, 2 stock (100degree) or you could do 2 90s, per cage. after that, you could add 1 40 in the center to push lower cage par, or just let it fall off naturally, depends what you have down there.

Let me know what ya think, and we can go from there.

Some quick details though, a 46 inch T5HO, puts out 5k lumens across it's lenght. One of those Veros, will put out almost 12k, at middle ground power (148L/W) however it you dial that back to 50ws, they will put out 8300 lumens, (160L/W).

If you want to go cheaper, without losing too much on Electric bill, then 2 Veros should do ya, at 80ws with more light than having a quad 24inch T5 Fixture over that cage (1 LED is eq to 4 24T5s).

If you go FF, you'll need to to compete, and really your doing it for CRI as Flo's are usually in the High 80s, FF I bleieve is 120L/W, not bad, better than a Flos 95, but not great.
 
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cyberlocc

Chameleon Enthusiast
very interesting, i see you can buy the canopies with the sinks already installed?

Idk, maybe? I think that's just the pic? Unless it's a kit, you probably don't want there LEDs if it's a kit.

The sinks just slide into grooves in the canopy though, it's really easy to do that part.

And the Veros do have solder less, adapters avaible for them, and those sinks have the hole patterns for Vero 29s, so should be fairly easy for anyone to buildup.

DIY LEDs are easier than they ever have been it's a golden age :).
 

cyberlocc

Chameleon Enthusiast
Can you slide the LEDs along the rail to a desired spot ? Im really liking how that canopy looks.

Yes you can.

I was looking at dimensions before as well, and I think you could get the home Depot standard light reflectors in there as well with some modding.

I was also, thinking it may be possible to add DIY T5 fixtures to that as well, with the clip on reflectors. I decided to go with their 20inch premium sink for my build though. But you could make that an all in one canopy, with the LEDs, Basking, and UVb all on it, in a nice sleek package, with some modding.
 
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cyberlocc

Chameleon Enthusiast
What kind of lighting is required for a hibiscus to bloom indoors?

About 14 DLI, preferably more reds, as they are more favored for blooming.

So shooting for 350 PAR, or so, at least a foot down from the top of the plant, assuming a 3ft plant.

Easier to measure, he needs about 25k LUX, more is better.

1 of the Veros I linked him earlier, directly above the hibiscus, should be enough for bloom, at 80ws.

Now 25k LUX pails in comparison to the sun, but the sun changes throughout the day, and not all of it's spectrums are good. So you beat that, by Time On, and Spectrum used. 12hours with a good spectrum, will get the DLI needed.

If you start getting into all the flashy dimming and such, the PAR needed increases, as DLI is just the Moles the plant received in a day, the PAR is what MMoles it could receive per second.

That's the problem with flos, they don't put out an insane amount of Red, which is why there CRI is so low. And what they do, doesn't carry far enough. There PAR is not very good, they can produce a good amount of light, they just can't push it far enough down.

You can of course still brute Force it. A plant 6 inches from a Flo, even a high light one will grow very well. And adding more, will also help. 8 24 inch T5s will grow a hibiscus.

Also keep in mind that good ole, Incans have the highest PAR of any artificial light source, it rivals the sun as far as Radiation. So your basking light, being right over the Hibiscus can also help, especially using something like 90 degree halogen flood. Sandwich a good flood like that, with 4 Flo's on either side, should be fairly effective at growing Hibiscuses.

Well, I can tell you arcadia 12%, arcadia freshwater pro led, finnex planted plus and two ecosmart 120w equivalent 5000k bulbs were enough for flowering when put together. However, all of that together doesn't have the punch for even a 30" tall enclosure to keep the lower level leafs from dropping.

I've been keeping @Decadancin up on my pool bulb "experiment" with hibiscus via pm. Part of the pm's I'm not ready to share publicly yet how ever. Currently I have 2 6500k bulbs and 1 3000k bulb along with the Arcadia freshwater pro led and Arcadia 12% on top of the cage. As I mentioned to decadancin earlier today I'll be adding another 3000k to the mix but I have more buds on the two plants under those lights then my 5 east facing bushes outside right now. Realistically, I wish they had the 4000k version available to try because it is close enough to the "m" the 6500k and 3000k create together to function on it's own I think. Here is the curve for the bulbs so that makes a little more sense lol.

View attachment 214423

With your current lighting, I would add another 3000k as a Flo not as a LED. You want to steer more towards a 33/66 ratio than a 1/1 for 3000k and 6500k.

Fall daylight, is about 5000k-7000k, spring is like 9-11k.

If you do want to go with 2 of the 3000, and 2 of the 6500k, you should do them season based. That is really the best option, but not alot of people do it as it's a pain.

So you want 2x 6500k orhighero then 1 3000k, for Spring/Summer,

Then go 2x 3000k and 1x 6500k for Fall/Winter.

That's what most the Flo using gardeners of the plants that shall not be talked about do. It gives you a healthy cycle of Grow/Bloom.
 
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dshuld

Chameleon Enthusiast
That bridglux one is interesting. To bad they don't have one with a bit more even "m" to the wave. A mix of 27h or 30h and the 56g would be great :D.
Screenshot_2018-09-26-14-16-19.png
 

dshuld

Chameleon Enthusiast
About 14 DLI, preferably more reds, as they are more favored for blooming.

So shooting for 350 PAR, or so, at least a foot down from the top of the plant, assuming a 3ft plant.

Easier to measure, he needs about 25k LUX, more is better.

1 of the Veros I linked him earlier, directly above the hibiscus, should be enough for bloom, at 80ws.

Now 25k LUX pails in comparison to the sun, but the sun changes throughout the day, and not all of it's spectrums are good. So you beat that, by Time On, and Spectrum used. 12hours with a good spectrum, will get the DLI needed.

If you start getting into all the flashy dimming and such, the PAR needed increases, as DLI is just the Moles the plant received in a day, the PAR is what MMoles it could receive per second.

That's the problem with flos, they don't put out an insane amount of Red, which is why there CRI is so low. And what they do, doesn't carry far enough. There PAR is not very good, they can produce a good amount of light, they just can't push it far enough down.

You can of course still brute Force it. A plant 6 inches from a Flo, even a high light one will grow very well. And adding more, will also help. 8 24 inch T5s will grow a hibiscus.

Also keep in mind that good ole, Incans have the highest PAR of any artificial light source, it rivals the sun as far as Radiation. So your basking light, being right over the Hibiscus can also help, especially using something like 90 degree halogen flood. Sandwich a good flood like that, with 4 Flo's on either side, should be fairly effective at growing Hibiscuses.



With your current lighting, I would add another 3000k as a Flo not as a LED. You want to steer more towards a 33/66 ratio than a 1/1 for 3000k and 6500k.

Fall daylight, is about 5000k-7000k, spring is like 9-11k.

If you do want to go with 2 of the 3000, and 2 of the 6500k, you should do them season based. That is really the best option, but not alot of people do it as it's a pain.

So you want 2x 6500k orhighero then 1 3000k, for Spring/Summer,

Then go 2x 3000k and 1x 6500k for Fall/Winter.

That's what most the Flo using gardeners of the plants that shall not be talked about do. It gives you a healthy cycle of Grow/Bloom.

Atm I do have a reason for sticking to those pool bulbs from Lola's thread. I did some what elude to it in the thread. I mentioned via pm to @Decadancin yesterday what is up there really is enough I feel with how the plants are responding. How ever I have another unexpected response I'm watching but as mentioned not ready to talk publicly about yet in full. The additional bulb is to further see how various things react to the addition/ rearranging of the bulbs.

How ever that bridgelux cob is an interesting one and would probably work great on one of my other cages as a 4 or 5 cob setup. What driver/s would you think on something like that?
 
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