I don't know what to do...

[Disarray]

Well as most of you know, I was planning on getting a gravid Jacksons from Petco. I have been doing some more thinking and I would feel more comfortable getting my first cham from a breeder. Flchams will be at the show in Atl in July so I have emailed them asking what they will have available then. I feel really bad about abandoning "Kiwi" though...I know her babies will die if she has them at Petco. What would you guys do??

 

[jannb]

I think that the chameleon at Petco could really use a good home.

 

[Julirs]

You do what everyone else would do...you get the one at Petco now and then you get one from the show.

 

[littlevillage]

You do what everyone else would do...you get the one at Petco now and then you get one from the show.

Two is always better than one!

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

I have to confess- I would get the one at Petco, and get one at the show. My husband and I have purchased (for a good amount of $$, too) several local chams (mostly from private owners) to save them from an uncertain fate. But you know your own personal situation better than we do. Follow your heart, but watch your pocketbook, too.

Where in the country are you located?

 

[Trace]

I can't say that I'm not disappointed in your decision to pass on Kiwi, particularly after all the good questions you asked and research you did. That said, only you know what you are capable of and that, to me, is a great sign of maturity in a possible new keeper. I've seen far too many people jump into chameleons (and reptiles in general) over the years because "reptiles are cool". Those animals end up suffering. I have little to no respect for those kinds of keepers as well.

Perhaps you can work out a deal with your boss about caring for Kiwi in a private back room, off limits from customers and most staff. She will need a lot of privacy in the next little bit for her to be comfortable giving birth.

And contrary to what people are saying; don't get two chameleons right off the bat. No matter how much reading and preparations you do about chameleons, there is still a massive learning curve you need to do once you bring the animal home. Two animals just compounds the difficulties if you are a new owner.

Captive Bred chameleons are far easier to deal with for a new owner - Kiwi may not be one.

Good luck with your decision.
Trace

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Thank you, Trace, for being the voice of sanity and reason.

__________________
Addiction takes us further than we'd ever meant to go

 

[chamlover]

Boy you are in between a rock and a hard place aren't you? I agree with Trace but i agree with everyone else too. I don't know if it was me if i could leave a gravid female at Petco, the chances of her and her offspring making it aren't too good.

But you do need to follow yur heart and pocketbook. Not only would you be dealing with a w/c gravid female but then who knows how many babies. That is alot of work and money. Are you really up for that kind of challenge. I have my hands filled with 30 baby veileds. Boy can they eat!!! It is a decision only you can make.

If you could work it out where you could help with her in the back room while she delivers and afterwards that would be the best thing. Then you can get a c/b from a breeder and you might be saving yourself a big headache and maybe a heartache as well. Remember many females don't make it through the pregnancy Just my opinion. Good luck with no matter what decision you make just remember you can only do so much...

Debby

 

[mczoo]

Unfortunately if you buy the wild caught chameleon from petco they will likely just replace it with a new chameleon without having learned their lesson and you may end up being the lesson learner. i have been sadly in the same position many times since my obssession with reptiles began some 20 years ago. every time i purchased i regreted and they just replaced it with another

don't help them. as Spock would say "the needs of the many outwiegh the needs of the few or the one"

i know its very sad

Sean

 

[Disarray]

Wow, I got a lot of good advice. I'm still torn...if I were going to be working at this Petco I wouldn't worry as much, but I am going back to school four hours away in August. The only people I trust to take care of her are quitting as well. I know Petco will just replace her with something else, but at the same time she is gravid and its not just one life. I don't know. I'm worried that I will do something wrong because I have never had chameleons before, let alone neonates. I'm also worried that I won't be able to find homes for all the babies. I still have some time to think about it while I get things ready, I just needed some opinions from more experienced keepers.

If I do bring Kiwi home and her babies survive would anyone on here be interested in them?

 

[Brad Ramsey]

If, if, if ...

Jackson neonates are not the easiest babies to raise even if everything goes well with her delivery, there will be big challenges.
It seems to me like your heart is in the right place, but you will be setting yourself up for some big heartbreaking possibilities.
Moving her and the babies to school would be very stressful.
or
Moving her pregnant to school will be very stressful.
Finding the time in your schedule to take proper care of the neonates will be very stressful.
Having babies die in your care (and some probably will) will be stressful.
This is an advanced chameleon keeper project. It will take a tremendous amount of time, money and attention.
I think (for a minute) you need to stop thinking about her, and think about yourself.
You could have a very different first time experience with a chameleon that would be much easier and rewarding.
I stumbled upon the exact same situation over a year ago at a Petsmart.
As hard as it was to walk away from it, I did and I have to say that I'm glad I made that decision.

-Brad

 

[Disarray]

Brad, I think you are right. I didn't even think about the car trip she would have to endure. As much as I hate to say it, a gravid cham is too much for me to take on right now. I just wish there was more I could do for her. So I will wait for the show in July and hopefully I will find one there. I will still probably go with a Jacksons cham, since I've been doing so much research on them and they don't require a huge enclosure. Just so I have options though, are there any other chams that you would recommend for me that stay fairly small? I really wish I could get a Panther cham. I love the blue ones, but I think I should get some chameleon experience before I pay $300+ for one.

 

[dodolah]

in the meantime, we got a gravid chameleon that are not going to be taken care of well (and probably will die in the process).
Can you do something about it?
talk to your boss? find somebody knowledgeable that will be able to care for her?
etc..

 

[Disarray]

I'm going to do my best making a baby set up in the back room, but I don't know what else to do. Nobody there knows much about chameleons, I probably know the most because of all the reading I've been doing so I will try to educate my co-workers if they will listen. If you have any ideas let me know.

 

[wendysjungle]

I'm going to do my best making a baby set up in the back room, but I don't know what else to do. Nobody there knows much about chameleons, I probably know the most because of all the reading I've been doing so I will try to educate my co-workers if they will listen. If you have any ideas let me know.

Disarray I think you are doing everything you can, considering your situation. Brad made some great points about needing to look realistically at YOUR life right now, and what you can reasonably take on. That you are trying to help her within her present location is a great thing, and don't beat yourself up if that is the most you can reasonably do at this point in your life!

 

[Brad Ramsey]

in the meantime, we got a gravid chameleon that are not going to be taken care of well (and probably will die in the process).
Can you do something about it?
talk to your boss? find somebody knowledgeable that will be able to care for her?
etc..

I have said this before and I will say it again:

There are thousands of chameleons in horrible situations of captivity right now.
Rescuing them all would be a full time job with lots of overtime for every member on the forum ... and it doesn't pay well.
This starts to send me on my rant about how chameleons shouldn't be pets at all ... but then I feel the hypocrisy (having chameleons in my own home).
They certainly shouldn't be offered up at pet stores to whoever has a passing fancy and enough cash to purchase one.
I could find 10 chameleons right now within 10 miles of my home that need rescuing. Does this mean I should go get them?
I could quit working, buy a different home ... with a heated barn, hire a grant writer, file a request to become a non profit, hire a communications coordinator and a web designer and open the Colorado Chameleon Rescue and Rehabilitation Sanctuary.
But even that wouldn't make much difference in the end.
I really could go on and on ...i won't ....
Please don't put the responsibility of the fate of this chameleon on the person who discovered her situation.

-Brad

 

[littlevillage]

I hate to admit it, but Brad is right, you can't rescue them all. I, like you, am also one of those softies who want to take them all home because you feel sorry for them. Heck, I just brought one home last night that's in really bad shape. It's going to cost me a small fortune in vet bills, but I knew that before hand. The difference is, your situation, being new to chams (I'm still fairly new too), moving, going to school, & then putting babies into the mix. Are you going to have time to take care of all those babies? At this point, you have to do what's best for yourself & adding the stress of trying to keep neonates alive isn't what's best. Your first cham should be a joyful thing not a stressful one. Good luck with whatever you decide.

 

[dodolah]

I have said this before and I will say it again:

There are thousands of chameleons in horrible situations of captivity right now.
Rescuing them all would be a full time job with lots of overtime for every member on the forum ... and it doesn't pay well.
This starts to send me on my rant about how chameleons shouldn't be pets at all ... but then I feel the hypocrisy (having chameleons in my own home).
They certainly shouldn't be offered up at pet stores to whoever has a passing fancy and enough cash to purchase one.
I could find 10 chameleons right now within 10 miles of my home that need rescuing. Does this mean I should go get them?
I could quit working, buy a different home ... with a heated barn, hire a grant writer, file a request to become a non profit, hire a communications coordinator and a web designer and open the Colorado Chameleon Rescue and Rehabilitation Sanctuary.
But even that wouldn't make much difference in the end.
I really could go on and on ...i won't ....
Please don't put the responsibility of the fate of this chameleon on the person who discovered her situation.

-Brad

yes i understand, but just because it is a seemingly hopeless situation, it doesn't mean that we should no try to make things better.
If you see a starving children on the street, would you help the boy in someway or another or would you ignore him thinking that saving one would not solve the problem of world hunger?

I realize that this person might not be able to care and take the chameleon into his care, but it doesn't mean that he should just deliberately look away.
What he can do is (like what he is trying now) educating his coworker about this chameleon care.

What i am suggesting is to try his best to better the situation.. but that;s about it. I'm not telling him to literally save the chameleon and bring her home.
Call me naive but nothing in this world ever get better with an apathetic approach. Things get better when someone try. That's all.

 

[dodolah]

I'm going to do my best making a baby set up in the back room, but I don't know what else to do. Nobody there knows much about chameleons, I probably know the most because of all the reading I've been doing so I will try to educate my co-workers if they will listen. If you have any ideas let me know.

that's good enough to me. Better than nothing.

 

[Nicodemayo]

I work at Petco in Marietta and i know for a fact that if we had a gravid jacksons give birth in the store, theres no way we'd be able to provide the proper care for the neonates with the resources available to us in the store. Ive pushed to get Petco here in the area to stop carrying chameleons. We carry everything they need except for a screened enclosure any after numerous requests, they still refuse to carry them. Petco is in the process of right sizing (getting rid of the animals that wont sell) and i know when the chameleons in my store sell, we wont be receiving any more. They arent big sellers. We have 2 female veileds in the store right now that we received when they looked less than 3 weeks old. When i fed them in the morning, i had to dig through the small cricket bins to pick out the smallest ones i could find. Petco knows that chameleons dont sell and in other stores, 75% of them or more die. Basically, not to rain on your parade, but i highly highly doubt they'd let you set up baby enclosures in the back.