How to manage feeders: housing and maintenance vs. gutloading

[Daesie11]

Your hornworms will grow quick. Leave them at 60-65* to slow down their growth. The phoenix worms or "BSFL" can also be stored at these temps. Hornworms eat hornworm food. Repashy "Superhorn" is what I use. Not sure if BSFL will gutload on bug burger or fresh veggies but I assume they would. My cham had no interest in BSFL. To small, but your baby will love them no doubt.

Thank you!

 

[Daesie11]

Your hornworms will grow quick. Leave them at 60-65* to slow down their growth. The phoenix worms or "BSFL" can also be stored at these temps. Hornworms eat hornworm food. Repashy "Superhorn" is what I use. Not sure if BSFL will gutload on bug burger or fresh veggies but I assume they would. My cham had no interest in BSFL. To small, but your baby will love them no doubt.

@Beman mentioned that you can pupate the BSFL, how do you go about that? Just seperate a few and keep them warmer?
I ordered the bran bedding for the super worms as well. Same temps to keep them small?

 

[Beman]

@Beman mentioned that you can pupate the BSFL, how do you go about that? Just seperate a few and keep them warmer?
I ordered the bran bedding for the super worms as well. Same temps to keep them small?

HEHE ok so you totally can but I have not had much luck so far.... I am keeping mine separate and warmer. We will see if this round works.

 

[Daesie11]

HEHE ok so you totally can but I have not had much luck so far.... I am keeping mine separate and warmer. We will see if this round works.

Keep me updated!

 

[jamest0o0]

I found that BSFL really like cubes of homemade then frozen gutload. Makes them really easy to do. They certainly seem to go for that much better than fresh veggies or bug burger etc.

If you sit and think about it, we are all quite mad with the lengths we go to with feeders. It shows we all want the best for our charges though.

Yup they love the cubes IME. Anything soft they'll dig through.

 

[cham_urchin]

I found that BSFL really like cubes of homemade then frozen gutload. Makes them really easy to do. They certainly seem to go for that much better than fresh veggies or bug burger etc.

If you sit and think about it, we are all quite mad with the lengths we go to with feeders. It shows we all want the best for our charges though.

hehe....YEP

 

[cham_urchin]

I don't have all the scientific names on hand so I'm going to be lazy and just list off most of them by their regular names.

Roaches:
Giant cave roach
Peppered roach
Dubia
Orangehead
Ivoryhead
B. fusca
Discoids
Craniifer(deaths head)
Gyna lurida(yellow porc)
Gyna caffrorum
Gyna centurio
Surinam
Green banana roach(panchlora nivea)
Giant green banana roach
Regular hissers
Halloween hissers

Isopods:
Giant canyon(p dilatatus)
Spanish orange (porcellio scaber)
Zebra (Armadillidium maculatum)
Dwarf white (Trichorhina tomentosa)
Dwarf purple (Isopoda sp)
Powdery blue (porcellionides pruinosis)
Powdery orange
Porcellio 'sevilla'

THANKS!! Thats an impressive list. Do you actually house each one separately (downstairs I mean)?

 

[jamest0o0]

THANKS!! Thats an impressive list. Do you actually house each one separately (downstairs I mean)?

Yup, other than my stickbugs which are in my cham room.

 

[CamoChameleonsHuman]

@Beman mentioned that you can pupate the BSFL, how do you go about that? Just seperate a few and keep them warmer?
I ordered the bran bedding for the super worms as well. Same temps to keep them small?

Superworms need to be kept at room temp 70-75* they love bug burger!

 

[SharpShooter]

Yup, other than my stickbugs which are in my cham room.

@jamest0o0 only has a cham as an excuse to his wife for all the bugs he has in the house!

 

[jamest0o0]

@jamest0o0 only has a cham as an excuse to his wife for all the bugs he has in the house!

Lol and can you believe it... I had 0 bugs before I had a cham. Now they're half the hobby for me. I enjoy good nutrition even for myself, so I got into it a lot with my chams. Mixing gutloads, feeders, supplements, and trying different things with it all is part of the fun.

PLUS the bug room is the best way to escape the wife!

 

[snitz427]

PLUS the bug room is the best way to escape the wife!

So THAT'S why John's always messing with the crickets!!!

 

[jamest0o0]

So THAT'S why John's always messing with the crickets!!!

 

[alphakenc]

 

[Daesie11]

I just read Oviposts blog on keeping crickets and it says not to feed them anything with mango. Considering I literally just prepared my frozen gut load mixture which of course included mangos, I would really like to know if anyone has any more information on this no mangos for crickets thing????

 

[SharpShooter]

I just read Oviposts blog on keeping crickets and it says not to feed them anything with mango. Considering I literally just prepared my frozen gut load mixture which of course included mangos, I would really like to know if anyone has any more information on this no mangos for crickets thing????

I haven't seen it I'm afraid but I do use mango as part of my frozen mixes and fresh offerings. Like everything though, its a case of rotation and not just using the same thing. I wouldn't offer a single item over and over. If its an ingredient in your mix, personally I wouldn't worry but I'm interested in the reason mentioned in the blog?

Edit.

Just read it. It seems opposite to what I've read. For example it reccomends dog and cat food along with chicken feed, which I've always seen listed as no no's. Again though, I wouldn't worry too much if the crickets had dog food as an ingredient in well rounded and varied diet.

 

[Rst_Cham]

Seeing as you seem to be the one to go to about bugs, I just ordered the bug sample pack from rainbowmealworms, I was just wondering if there is anything specific I need to know about keeping the various feeders alive and well? I know dubia and crickets are pretty straight forward, but wasnt sure if any of the others have specific needs apart from gut loading?

Well, there's lots of more knowledgeable people on here than me!

I heat my cricket and Roach bins with ceramic heat elements because they and gut load better, so I recommend that for sure.

For BSF, they can take a while to emerge so I just wait them out. The BSFL are easy to gut load, they seem to love oranges and pears, carrots, bee pollen,and bug burger. I make a dry gut load with ground alfalfa, pumpkin seeds, coconut, Sesame seeds, kelp, spiralina, hibiscus, and dried tropical fruit and they love it, disappears right away. I do keep these guys warm as well, with a small heat mat under their bin.

I've made screen tops for all of my bins, I think good air flow and ventilation helps keep them healthy, die off to a minimum, and keeps the smells down.

I clean cricket bins out completely once a week or so (2 weeks max), i use an empty five gallon bucket to transfer all live crickets to. I then dump the bins out, wipe them down with paper towels and soapy water, rinse, then spray down with Star sanitizer solution, let sit for five minutes, and wipe dry before adding crickets and gut loads back in.

I think season two, episode 65 of the chameleon breeder podcast covers Gutloading with John Courtney Smith, lots of good info:
https://www.chameleonbreeder.com/podcast/gutloading-chameleon-feeders/

 

[jamest0o0]

I haven't seen it I'm afraid but I do use mango as part of my frozen mixes and fresh offerings. Like everything though, its a case of rotation and not just using the same thing. I wouldn't offer a single item over and over. If its an ingredient in your mix, personally I wouldn't worry but I'm interested in the reason mentioned in the blog?

Edit.

Just read it. It seems opposite to what I've read. For example it reccomends dog and cat food along with chicken feed, which I've always seen listed as no no's. Again though, I wouldn't worry too much if the crickets had dog food as an ingredient in well rounded and varied diet.

I probably wouldn't feed off crickets that were fed dog food, idk if it'd cause any problems, but I just see that as ridiculous and unnecessary. Then with roaches that are fed excess protein, whether it's vegan or animal, can build up uric acid to the point it creates a gout risk.

 

[SharpShooter]

I probably wouldn't feed off crickets that were fed dog food, idk if it'd cause any problems, but I just see that as ridiculous and unnecessary. Then with roaches that are fed excess protein, whether it's vegan or animal, can build up uric acid to the point it creates a gout risk.

That was the main point, the blog referred to is completely contrary to what most of us see as standard practice.

 

[jamest0o0]

That was the main point, the blog referred to is completely contrary to what most of us see as standard practice.

I was agreeing with you, just adding my thoughts to it.