How can I stop her cutting her face on the screen?

[Amanda S]

Like it says. My chams split her lip and under her right eye is all white (not shedding, definitely, but from like rubbing it on the screen). Her eyes are fine, she is eating fine, and perfectly active. What can I do? There are no other chameleons and animals near her, she is alone all day in my room, and she has 4 plants and lots of vines and sticks. I have a feeling she is drinking water from the screen at the top of the cage and that is what happened to her nose. I have a hibiscus, spider plant, plast plant, pothos, and a bigger hibiscus. I never see her drink. What if her nose and eye get worse? Should she not have a screen cage?

Also. Do you give your chameleons night lights?
I feel like she falls during the night and/or gets lost in the cage.

 

[Ryan Jarosek]

A Chameleon will sleep at night the should not be moving. . No need for a light. To answer your other questions we really need to know some detail.

Two questions that will help alot are. What type of Chameleon and what size is the enclosure?

 

[Amanda S]

Carpet chameleon. Wild caught. Juvenile. 18x18x36 screen cage. She will soon be moving to a small cage when I go back to school. I haven't bought it yet though so let me know if you guys think I should get a paticular size & type.


I hear her at night falling. Its more like she is climbing the screen and slips and slides all the way down. Poor baby. I think she might be gravid but not ready to lay yet. She digs in her bin but I can't see or feel any eggs. Her colors have black lines though like the pictures show for being gravid. I was thinking...is it possible she would only have a couple eggs and I couldn't feel them? I have had her a month almost and she has definitely grown and had just arrived WC.

I am obviously inexperienced so any thoughts are greatly appreciated.

 

[Ryan Jarosek]

I was thinking the cage might be to small. Would you mind answering the items below.

Here is some recommended information to include when asking for help in the health clinic forum. By providing this information, you will receive more accurate and beneficial responses. It might not be necessary to answer all these questions, but the more you provide the better. Please remember that even the most knowledgeable person can only guess at what your problem may be. Only an experienced reptile veterinarian who can directly examine your animal can give a true diagnosis of your chameleon's health.


Cage Info:
Cage Type - Describe your cage construction (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
Lighting - What brand, model, and type of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
Location - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.
Current Problem - The current problem that you are concerned about.

Pictures are helpful

 

[FOREVER ENDEAVOR]

some chams are screen clingers,so in that regard some people line thier cages with poultry fencing

 

[opihiman]

also how long has the behavior been occurring?

I think Ryan might be right and your cage might be too small.

OPI

 

[Tygerr]

Ok, if she is falling at night - then she is probably having some serious health problems. They usually remain perfectly still whilst sleeping at night.

Or is she just falling directly after her lights go off? Maybe the lights going off are catching her by surprise, and she hasn't had enough time to find a perch (particularly if she finds herself stuck on the screen of the cage). You should provide cues to her that nighttime is approaching. An easy way is to turn off her heat bulbs about 30mins before you turn off the UV lamp. This will warn her to start finding a night time sleeping spot, but will give her enough light to find one before the lights go out completely (don't use any nightlights).

It certainly sounds like she might be in a gravid state - the rostral rubbing, trying to escape the cage, and her starting to dig, are all ways to show she is trying to find a suitable laying site. But if she is digging without laying, she is clearly dissatisfied with the laying bin you have provided, or she may be disturbed before being able to lay successfully.

What size laying bin have you got in there? As Ryan said, pictures would help immensely.

 

[Amanda S]

I did have the wrong laying bin for her but this morning I replaced it with a small trashcan that it around a foot deep. She is very small, only a few inches from snout to vent. I also replaced the substrate with coconut fiber mixed with sand. It is moist and good for digging now.

I don't think she falls, I hear her slide down the screen, it sounds a little horrible but I don't want to run over and turns the lights on and check and mess with her more. I don't know if she would sleep on the screen and slip? You can hear dragging down it.

She has been acting this way for about 5 days. The nose and eye thing were visible 3 days ago but have gotten a little worse everyday.

Could parasites have any influence? She is WC from FLchams but all chams can still have them right??

I will post pictures asap in the AM

 

[Amanda S]

Cage Info:
Cage Type -Aluminum screen cage, 18x18x36
Lighting - Reptisun 5.0 and 75 watt basking light. 9am – 9pm on a timer.
Temperature - Flukers hygrometer in the middle of the cage on the screen. Lowest overnight temp 74. Day gradient 85 basking area – 75. The constant house temperature is 75.
Humidity - 60% avg I have the cage lined on 2 sides with cut up shower curtain and attached with twist ties. I have 4 plants as well that contribute. I have a Habbamist that does not mist obviously but drips every hour for a minute. I mist her at least 4 times a day.
Plants - 2 Hibiscus (a tree and one hanging), A spider plant, and a pothos that goes in and out.
Location - In my bedroom, very low traffic, opposite the wall from an air vent. It is positioned on top of a table and a dresser is blocking it from the door. I have been keeping all 4 sides covered to give her privacy. The shower curtain is green.

Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care? furcifer lateralis – carpet chameleon. Females. Est 10 months old. 3 weeks in my care, recently WC.
Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon? Every other day before feeding for 10min. She is very restless as she is WC but we are progressing.
Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders? She is a pig! Give or take 10 crickets a day in the morning around 10am, several days a week I give her 7 or so phoenix worms also. I made that adcham gutload and have fluckers calcium gel/water, I also give them fresh veggies like carrot, apple, escarole/kale
Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule? Herptivite, repcal w/ d3. I purchased yesterday repcal w/o d3. When I first got her I made the mistake of supplementing her too much but for the last week I have not. I WAS giving her crickets dusted with mixed repcal and herptivite 5 days a week. Lightly dusted though. Sometimes just calcium because I read it was better, I didn’t realize how potent the multivitamin was. In the last 7+ days I have given her repcal w/ d3 twice. No vitamins. I did buy repcal w/o d3 though and used it today to feed her. How does this schedule sound: Multivitamin once a month, Repcal w/ d3 twice a month, and repcal w/3 d3 every other feeding. Could this have hurt her????
Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking? I have a habbamist (it drips) every 1 hour/1min. I mist her at least 4 times a day, every few hours, for 3-5minutes. She does not like it at all. No, I do not see her drinks. Droplets build up on the screen ceiling and she shows interest in them. She really is not used to humans yet so I try and leave her alone.
Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites? Mike from FLchams said she was but no, not by me, I have had her 3 weeks. She goes daily and routinely always at night sometime, it looks normal? White and brown and…moist? Ha, I don’t know the correct terminology. No bugs or anything bad, I have been looking.
History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you. The first couple weeks she was brown a lot but slowly began to turn more green as she adapted. When held she turns bright yellow. The last 5 days she has been light-dark brown with lines and moss green on top, literally. When she turns yellow now it is streaked with brown.
Current Problem – a) Under her right eye it is all white. She shed a week ago within two hours, perfectly. Her nose looks split and her lips and slightly parted at the tip. I think she is rubbing her face on the screen?
b) I am concerned she is gravid but I missed it. She was digging more 4 days ago but is now less interested. I had a bad laying spot but as of today it is good. I can’t see or feel anything in her belly. Could she have only a couple eggs and impacted?
Just let me know how to help her! She seemed like she was adjusting really well but the last few days has been brown. She is active and climbs all over and eats healthy.
I will post pictures first thing in the am of her, the cage, and her fecal…woo

 

[Ryan Jarosek]

I think you could start with what Tygerr was saying about the lights. Have the heat lamp turn off first then a few minutes later the UV bulb.

You also stated that your light schedule is 9am – 9pm on a timer. I would set that to match the natural light cycle. She should start to find her sleeping spot before the lights go out. I would try to modify your light schedule to 7AM - 7 PM . My chams start to get up about 7 am and find their spot at about 7PM. I have their lights on from 8AM - 8PM. The are always up with the sun

She may be grabbing the screen to sleep in a spot to avoid the lights. Then when they shutoff she is startled.

 

[ChameleonsTree]

Just another thought....she could be rubbing her eye because she has debris in it she cant get out and she needs to be misted more so she can clean her eyes.

 

[Amanda S]

You can see the white spot below her eye and if you look carefully you can tell her lip is all split looking. In the photo of her cage she is in the upper left corner. She is real small. I actually was thinking the cage was too big but since she is wild maybe she needs even bigger...?

 

[Ryan Jarosek]

I think you could start with what Tygerr was saying about the lights. Have the heat lamp turn off first then a few minutes later the UV bulb.

You also stated that your light schedule is 9am – 9pm on a timer. I would set that to match the natural light cycle. She should start to find her sleeping spot before the lights go out. I would try to modify your light schedule to 7AM - 7 PM . My chams start to get up about 7 am and find their spot at about 7PM. I have their lights on from 8AM - 8PM. The are always up with the sun

She may be grabbing the screen to sleep in a spot to avoid the lights. Then when they shutoff she is startled.

Along with the suggestions made above about the lighting , I would also recommend adding more coverage in the cage. Possibly a ficus at the bottom to fill in some of the gaps. She may be trying to get out and explore. More hiding places and other area to explore may keep her busy. Your setup looks good but I would even suggest some more vine. At the pet stores you can buy baby Bio vine that is perfect for a Chameleon that size. I would rap it so she had lots of exploring area. I think they have it in 6 ft increments. I actually buy it by the 50 ft roll. I love the stuff.

Do you have a dripper? If she is trying to drink off the screen you may want to avoid spraying there for a little while to break that habit. A dripper would be a good way to direct her drinking to a new location.

I see you have a feeding cup. Do you free range your food at all? Maybe just crickets? Free ranging some feeders may also provide some activity for her so she is not trying to escape.

as Tygerr said : She may not be happy with her laying bin as well and wants to get out to find another spot.

Edit I saw the answer above nevermind : How big is your bin? and how deep?

Lastly a trip to the vet should be concidered if her face starts to look too much worse or does not stop. There is always the risk of infection. She is WC and almost definetly has parasites if she has not been treated. She should be treated soon.

 

[lbesok]

Amanda, IMHO I would not consider downsizing when you go off to school. This cage would be as small as I'd recommend for her. You could consider getting a travel cage, and collapsing the larger cage during transit....
She needs some sort of topical antibiotic to help her current wounds heal.
Also as already suggested, it would be GREATLY beneficial to her, if you could line the inside of the cage with plastic poultry fencing. What I do is cut it in three rectangles (that fit the three sides of the cage), then I Zip tie the two sides to the back, and secure it in the cage with zip ties. I'm assuming that you would be replacing the shower curtain with this? Maybe you could affix the curtain to the outside instead?
Here is the poultry fence:
http://http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100384026
Also here are some examples of a few of my cages lined with it:
My sweet Honey RIP ;(

Big man Vega's, this past week!

Most importantly, you should see about getting some sort of topical antibiotic, so that her wounds can start healing..... You can get Zymox from KV vet: http://http://www.kvvet.com/KVVet/productr.asp?pf%5Fid=50331&gift=False&HSLB=False&mscssid=981E0CD0C5D44C8489DCCFAFED8C7DA2 IDK if something like silvadene creme would be available OTC?!?! Does anyone else have suggestions, of what she could use to treat the wounds with?!?!

 

[Amanda S]

Thank you for your responses. I am going to go right out and get some plastic chicken fencing. I will also take you up Ryan on some extra vine and a plant. I won a $50 gift card Lowes.

She has a Habbamist that drips, you can see the nozzle in the one picture. I was going to return it but I think she does drink from that and it goes off hourly so that is good. And I mostly feed her free range. All her crickets are. I just have the cup for phoenix worms. When I went in today she was real colorful and had her nose pressed up to the screen staring out the window that is 4ft away. I guess that might be the problem!? I feel bad if I was antagonizing her.

Would you suggest I get an even bigger cage? I have to come home every now and again so I was going to leave this cage here all together. What kind are you using Ibesok?

Also, anyone, what would you recommend for the topical treatment? I am going to order the Zymox I think unless there is something better???

Thank you guys so much. I have been really worried about her. I thought I over supplemented her and was really concerned I couldn’t fix this. I am going to do all this stuff now. BTW, your cages look great Ibesok, I am going to do the chicken fencing just like that, thanks again.

 

[Ryan Jarosek]

I would think a 24X24X36 cage would be great. I find the best prices on cages are from LLLreptile

http://lllreptile.com/store/catalog/reptile-supplies/reptile-cages-glass-and-screen/

The 24x24x48 cage is a little cheaper but I am not too sure that won't be too big. Hopefully someone else will chime in and provide some input. Carpets are a little smaller than my panthers.

My Chams love to look out the window but seem to be happy in their home. She will be more content in a fuller/larger cage. My oldest Panther loves to explore and find different places to hide.

I am not familiar with the topical treatments so I will leave that for someone else.

 

[lbesok]

Would you suggest I get an even bigger cage? I have to come home every now and again so I was going to leave this cage here all together. What kind are you using Ibesok?

Ok, no problem. My standard growing female panther cage runs 16*16*30, then when they reach full size they upgrade a little to around 20*16*30. Male panthers on the other hand are provided with something much larger... Since carpets are somewhat smaller IMHO 18*18*36 should be plenty fine for now. I think it would cause more stress than anything now to upgrade.

 

[Roni013]

Mike from Fl said 18x18x36 was plenty big enough even for an adult carpet. Maybe she needs some time in the sun? I was thinking of getting some fake trees outside and having 'play time' for any future chams. Anyhoo, just thought I'd chime in