He wont eat =[

[sandrachameleon]

It takes a few days for a chameleon to settle into its new home. They often dont eat for a couple days.
I wonder about the quality of your temperature gauge. The typical tank kind are not reliable or acurate. You could be cooking him. Licking the sand (which you dont need) could be his way of looking for more water.

 

[Jonas]

I agree, I have seen really dehydrated lizards eating potting soil etc, for the moisture.

 

[Sang]

i am pretty sure a majority of the UK based keepers *at least on the forums* keep their animals in a glass style enclosure.

i havn't read about many UK keepers keeping their animals in a mesh style enclosure, as i don't live in teh UK, i can only base my opinions on the numerous articles, threads and posters that have shown how they keep their animals.

 

[Jonas]

I think I will start a thread about it, to see how many people have actually used a glass terrarium and how many are just spreading something they heard in a forum - something that is far too common.

 

[veiledfan]

The chameleon could just be really stressed out. I would also add a live pathos plant in the enclosure. The like to eat them and it also increases humidity. Glass cage has to go. Chameleons like a lot of air flow so a mess cage is the best choice. You might want to try a different food source. You do not know what was in the pet store's cricket diet. What were they gut loading them with? My husband raised crickets and roaches because they give them hormones to increase growth at most places and it can affect some animals. I would really look into what you are feeding them. Some animals are picky. What you feed your feeders affects how they smell to the chameleon? Stick to a fresh food diet.

 

[Jonas]

Glass cage has to go. Chameleons like a lot of air flow so a mess cage is the best choice.

Its like talking to a brick wall sometimes...

 

[WelshOneEmma]

Its like talking to a brick wall sometimes...

I'm sure the OP said that the cage has the mesh top, which gives ventilation!! Some people just don't read the whole thread and just jump in at the end.

I do like your idea of the thread regarding the type of enclosures, and people's successes. I am based in the UK also, and my cage is wood, with glass doors, but there are ventilation holes in the wood. Even with this, and a 60w bulb, we still struggle to keep the temps up, so a screen enclosure would be a nightmare for me. Our breeder had mesh enclosures, but all his chams were in one room that was roasting to keep the temps up. That's just not realistic when you have one cham in your living room!

 

[sandrachameleon]

The glass vs screen vs everything else enclosure debate has taken place in many previous threads. You may be interested in reviewing this links in this blog entry, where I keep those that have the most stimulating discussion on the topic (as well as other enclosure related info):
https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/sandrachameleon/82-enclosures-housing.html

For the record, the construction of the enclosure (glass, screen or whatever) is far less important than maintaining the correct environment within it. Whatever type of construction one chooses, there are trade-offs that need to be considered. heat and humidy escape very easily from a screen cage (screen can also damage toes). heat and humidty escape very slowly/poorly from solid walled enclosures, or you could say heat and humidity are retained well. Something in-between is probably the best for most people. But alot depends on where you live, and the typical ambient temp and relative humidty you have there. People in southern states often have temperatures and humidity that are within the ranges accepted by their chameleons, possibly even too warm - a screen cage is a good choice here. In cold, dry northern climates, an enclosure that retains humidity and allows heat to escape in a slower manner is probably the way to go.

 

[Crazy Pet Lady]

Its like talking to a brick wall sometimes...

I'm just jumping in here....from what I understand, the reason for NOT glass is 1) not enough ventilation, 2) they don't like seeing their own reflection in the glass [thinking it's another cham] & 3) if "shooting" insects off the glass, it can injure their tongue. Tongue injury doesn't seem to be an issue with plastic feeding containers, etc. This info comes from the book: Chameleons:their care and breeding, by Linda J. Davidson. Just throwin' that out there. Peace.

 

[OldSkoolxReasons]

The first chameleon i ever bought was a 3mo. veiled that i kept in a 55gallon glass aquarium. He very much did not like his reflection and whenever he was close to the glass he fired up at it. Also if you don't clean the glass every day or every other day bacteria tends to build up. He died of a bacterial infection in his lungs. The vet said it was from bad ventilation/bacteria everywhere on the glass. So from my experiences i don't like them. However 4 of the 5 european breeders i know use them and have had none of these problems and have an easier time keeping humidity up. If its done right it is jsut as good as the mesh ones i suppose.

 

[tkilgour]

I'm just jumping in here....from what I understand, the reason for NOT glass is 1) not enough ventilation, 2) they don't like seeing their own reflection in the glass [thinking it's another cham] & 3) if "shooting" insects off the glass, it can injure their tongue. Tongue injury doesn't seem to be an issue with plastic feeding containers, etc. This info comes from the book: Chameleons:their care and breeding, by Linda J. Davidson. Just throwin' that out there. Peace.

Nice post!!! Nice thread here...I like that you guys had a debate on this. As mentioned above, I know that in many states here in the U.S, like Florida and Georgia where the temps are higher and the humidity is high the glass would get too hot for a panther cham. However, I like how crazy pet lady blasts out sources to back up the screen. Nice work!

 

[OldSkoolxReasons]

I do not nkow what they are called or if they ahve them in europe but they do make these black metal wired attachents for aquariums that are the exact size of your aquarium but just clip on top to provide double the space. I use them for my brevs so they can have more climbing room up in the aquarium. They would be ideal for the top of an aquarium, keep humidity/heat in semi-well and provide a well ventilated area for teh aquarium. I wonder if they come in the size that your aquarium it. If i can find the box I'll post the brand and what it is actually called. Good luck.

 

[kinyonga]

Unless the temperatures fall below 65F I don't recommend any heat at night and a chameleon definitely needs no light at night. They sleep in the dark just like we do.

IMHO your temperatures don't need to be so high...especially at night.

IMHO non-toxic real plants are better to use than artificial ones since they can add to the humidity....and veiled/yemen chameleons have been known to try to eat artificial ones which could very easily cause an impaction.

I never use mealworms because I have heard that they can cause impaction although I don't think it would happen if you used them in a "mixed diet" as a small part of it.

What do you gutload (specifically) the insects with?

You said he's..."not eatin his food, just the sand in the base"...this could be because he's lacking nutrients since you are not supplementing. Supplementing is important. Since many of the feeder insects we use have a poor ratio of calcium to phos. its important to dust with a phos.-free calcium powder at most feedings.

I also dust twice a month lightly with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder to ensure that the chameleon gets enough D3 without overdoing it. Exposure to the UVB (which should not pass through glass or plastic) should provide the rest. D3 FROM SUPPLEMENTS can build up in the system, so don't overdo it.

I dust twice a month with a vitamin powder that has a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A. Beta carotene is converted as needed and won't result in an overdose. However, its not proven that all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene to vitamin A. At least this way the owner is in control of the prEformed vitamin A which can build up in the system. Excess prEformed vitamin A can interfere with the D3 and push the chameleon towards MBD.

Appropriate temperatures assist in digestion and thus indirectly play a part in nutrient absorption too.

Phos., calcium, D3 and vitamin A are all important players in bone health and need to be in balance. You need to look at the gutloading/what you feed to the insects, the supplementing, and what you feed to the chameleon when trying to balance them.

I would also recommend that you use a dripper in addition to the mistings. I have found that panther chameleons in particular will drink readily from a dripper. (However, that being said...I don't use drippers for very young/small chameleons because there is a possibility of them aspirating water.)

You said your chameleon was eating the wood chips...is it pooping?

Jonas said..."I still dont get how the glass terrarium is ok in the UK but so bad in the US. Is it something in the air?"...I have discussed this many times on this forum.

In Canada, the UK, parts of Europe, the northern States and any other cold/cool area, there is no reason not to use glass cages that have screen lids. In these areas its hard to keep screen cages warm enough for chameleons. In California, Florida, South Africa, Hawaii and other warm/hot areas its not a good idea IMHO for the obvious reason that they will likely be hard to keep cool...unless you have air conditioning.

Sandrachameleon said it very well when she said..."For the record, the construction of the enclosure (glass, screen or whatever) is far less important than maintaining the correct environment within it. Whatever type of construction one chooses, there are trade-offs that need to be considered".

Jonas said..."thats up with saying he NEEDS those 3 supplements? Why?"...I explained why I use the supplements I do above.

Jonas said..."Its one thing to say "I use these...", but if you are going to be absolute in your answers ("You NEED these"), it would be nice to know why"...and..."Remove the sand, use newspaper if you want"...so the reason for your absolute statement about the sand is? Personally, it gets very tedious having to constantly explain every little detail of why certain things should be done although it hopefully does help.

So...munki...there could be a few reasons why your chameleon isn't eating....I wish I could give you a definite answer. I can say though, that if you can't figure it out soon, I would recommend you take it to a vet.

 

[Jonas]

What people dont understand is this:

There is NO ventilation in screen cages. There IS ventilation in glass terrariums. Sounds crazy?

Screen cages have no ventilation if you use the word correctly. There is no controlled airflow driven by thermic or any other directonal flow. Screen cages have a free airflow through the mesh, a random exchange of air.

A glass terrarium has strategically placed ventilaton. A all mesh top can work, but is not the best solution. Using spotlights etc. you get a nice slow circular airmovement in the terrarium, at the same time exchanging air through the ventilation. Heat definatly helps pushing air around.

I would go so far as to say that its far easier to get a STABLE environment in a traditional terrarium, as well as a desirable humidity.


Look at your average home. Where is the ventilation? How big is the opening? Airflow?

 

[Crazy Pet Lady]

I do not nkow what they are called or if they ahve them in europe but they do make these black metal wired attachents for aquariums that are the exact size of your aquarium but just clip on top to provide double the space. I use them for my brevs so they can have more climbing room up in the aquarium. They would be ideal for the top of an aquarium, keep humidity/heat in semi-well and provide a well ventilated area for teh aquarium. I wonder if they come in the size that your aquarium it. If i can find the box I'll post the brand and what it is actually called. Good luck.

I started out with one for my veiled. It was by Zilla called Fresh Air Terrarium Topper. Here's a link. Hope this helps.
http://pet-supplies.drsfostersmith....thod=and&ts=results&rt=template_switch_search

 

[kinyonga]

You said..."all mesh top can work, but is not the best solution"...so what is the best solution then??

I've been keeping chameleons for over 20 years and other lizards for even longer and I have mostly used glass cages with either screened lids or with screened lids and doors.

Right now all my chameleons are in glass cages with only screened lids. Some of the other lizards are in this type of cage and some are in the ones with the screen lids and doors. I have a prehensile-tailed anole that was a LTC when I got him and he's been with me for 9+ years. I have several coneheads that have been with me for over 9 years...leos that have been here 17+ years...cordylus that have been here for 8+ years, Bibron's geckos here for over 10 years, etc. etc. My last three veileds (all females) to die here were all over 6 years old.

 

[Brad Ramsey]

What people dont understand is this:

There is NO ventilation in screen cages. There IS ventilation in glass terrariums.

I use several different types of enclosures: glass, 1/2 glass, ventilated terrariums, all screen.
The above quote from Jonas is 50% true: There is ventilation in glass terrariums.
It is also 50% false.
I have SUPERIOR ventilation in my all screen enclosures.

-Brad

 

[Jonas]

You said..."all mesh top can work, but is not the best solution"...so what is the best solution then??

I have used it as well, with great success too.
The reason all top-net terrariums are not the best solution is that you get a "chimney effect" where all the heat and humidity have a tendency to go straight out "the chimney". For species like calyptratus this can be quite good, you just use a slightly stronger spot for the temperature gradient and things are peachy.

For the best ventilation effect, one should have the ventilation openings on the two side walls around 3/4 of the way up.

As i an usually making larger terrariums these days, I have become quite fond of wooden terrariums. I like how I can make changes in the cage because it is wood and not glass.

 

[Jonas]

I use several different types of enclosures: glass, 1/2 glass, ventilated terrariums, all screen.
The above quote from Jonas is 50% true: There is ventilation in glass terrariums.
It is also 50% false.
I have SUPERIOR ventilation in my all screen enclosures.

-Brad

Slightly misguiding quote there, dont you think. Look the word up. I still say that you dont have ventilation in the screen cages - its free airflow, its the same as having the animal in the room without the screen cage. "The walls" do nothing so to speak.

Its interesting though how we accept this ventilation for ourselves. I dont know about you, but I cant even see the ventilation in my apartment. Nomatter what cage we choose, it will never be better than the air in the room.

 

[WelshOneEmma]

I'm just jumping in here....from what I understand, the reason for NOT glass is 1) not enough ventilation, 2) they don't like seeing their own reflection in the glass [thinking it's another cham] & 3) if "shooting" insects off the glass, it can injure their tongue. Tongue injury doesn't seem to be an issue with plastic feeding containers, etc. This info comes from the book: Chameleons:their care and breeding, by Linda J. Davidson. Just throwin' that out there. Peace.

I think that Jonas' point is that there is a tendancy to just jump on the mere mention of a glass cage, without considering all the factors. If it was an all glass cage, I can understand the ventilation comment, but they already stated it had a mesh lid to enable ventilation. Some people instantly see the word glass and don't read the rest of the thread or responses. Personally, to me it was obvious that he was in the UK as he stated that he uses locusts (am I correct in thinking that these are not allowed in the US as a feeder?).

There are quite a few people on this forum who use glass or 1/2 glass cages due to their climate, and successfully, yet some people tend to forget this. I have noticed a huge improvement though in the advice since I joined a year ago (it was always NO glass, regardless of where you are).

For the record, I don't have any problems with the ventilation in my enclosure, there are no issues with reflection (he often sits by the glass and watches the world go by) and as the feeders don't climb on the glass, there are no tongue issues (touch wood!). By having this type of enclosure, I am also able to maintain the temperatures, something I wouldn't be able to do with screen. You can guarantee if he changed to an all screen enclosure, he would be posting to figure out why his cham may not be eating and everyone would jump on him for not having the correct temps! It's just a case of being aware of the requirements of the posters based on where they live.