Fat Under Chin and Black Spot??

caseywagz

Member
Hey everyone, quick questions: I read something recently that talk about a pocket of fat under the chin meant something related to my chams health, and am coming here for clarification. Also, I noticed a hard black spot under his chin; I tried to kinda pick it off but it almost seemed like a scab as it was hard like one, but it hasn't gone away. Are these problems for concern? Any feedback welcome, here are pictures for more clarity! (And yes, I 100% understand his cage needs more plants, I am working in it! These pics are from more than a month ago.)

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CasqueAbove

Chameleon Enthusiast
I believe you are referring to edema. This does not look like that. It does look like a small injury that is swollen. I would keep a close eye, but I would expect if he is healthy it will be fine. But do watch close.
 

kinyonga

Chameleon Enthusiast
If you're talking about the lump in the first photo that is right below where the upper and lower jaw bones join, that is normal in veiled chameleons.nhiwever there is w similar lump along the lower lip line that might be the beginning of a mouth rot issue...you need to look inside his mouth along the teeth, etc to see if it is inflamed or swollen there.
 

Beman

Chameleon Enthusiast
Your boy looks very thick based on those forearms... Also have you noticed the abnormal growth here... I would suggest a husbandry review and post picture of the cham face on and the entire body along with pics of the entire cage lighting down.


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caseywagz

Member
Man, now I feel like a bad parent. I love in Colorado and it'd been hard keeping his humidity up and plants alive :'( I don't wanna give him up to someone else but I also don't want him to die
 

Beman

Chameleon Enthusiast
Man, now I feel like a bad parent. I love in Colorado and it'd been hard keeping his humidity up and plants alive :'( I don't wanna give him up to someone else but I also don't want him to die
No one said anything about you rehoming him or killing him...

If you want to double check your husbandry so you know what needs to be corrected fill out the form below with detail. And post pics of the entire enclosure including your lights and the entire cham including a picture of his face straight on so we can see his casque thickness better.

Chameleon Info:

  • Your Chameleon - The species, sex, and age of your chameleon. How long has it been in your care?
  • Handling - How often do you handle your chameleon?
  • Feeding - What are you feeding your cham? What amount? What is the schedule? How are you gut-loading your feeders?
  • Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?
  • Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking?
  • Fecal Description - Briefly note colors and consistency from recent droppings. Has this chameleon ever been tested for parasites?
  • History - Any previous information about your cham that might be useful to others when trying to help you.

Cage Info:

  • Cage Type - Describe your cage (Glass, Screen, Combo?) What are the dimensions?
  • Lighting - What brand, model, and types of lighting are you using? What is your daily lighting schedule?
  • Temperature - What temp range have you created (cage floor to basking spot)? Lowest overnight temp? How do you measure these temps?
  • Humidity - What are your humidity levels? How are you creating and maintaining these levels? What do you use to measure humidity?
  • Plants - Are you using live plants? If so, what kind?
  • Placement - Where is your cage located? Is it near any fans, air vents, or high traffic areas? At what height is the top of the cage relative to your room floor?
  • Location - Where are you geographically located?

Current Problem - The current problem you are concerned about.

--------------

Please Note:

  1. The more details you provide the better and more accurate help you will receive.
  2. Photos can be very helpful.
 

CasqueAbove

Chameleon Enthusiast
With some adjustments you will be fine. It is not hard, you just have too care. Knowing what you need is the first step. The next is learning the tricks that work for you. For example, many cover, partially, the cage. Making it more hybrid. It is all doable, these are little and you are on it early. You are in the right place.
 

caseywagz

Member
Thank you everyone for your input, below I have filled out the chameleon info that was given to me prior to this message:

  • Your Chameleon - Male veiled chameleon, 1.5 years (I think) and I have been caring for him for almost a year.
  • Handling - I recently haven't handled him much at all due to work and school, but he does enjoy coming out and climbing up my curtains
  • Feeding - He will sometimes get horn worms when the store is out of crickets. But I feed him crickets, horn worms on occasion, butter lettuce once a week, and some fruits and veggies throughout the week as well (blueberries, strawberries and bananas) and I also gut load the crickets with the same fruits and veggies and carrots as well.
  • Supplements - I have the basic ZooMed without and with D3 powder, and dust the crickets without D3 every day and with D3 every other week ( about)
  • Watering - This is a problem for me; he has the ZooMed Reptirain for his misting schedule, which goes off every hour for15 seconds, throughout the day. The problem is, it dries up so quickly due to the heat lamp and I cannot keep it humid in there whatsoever. It also doesn't help that I live in Colorado where there is basically no humidity. I rarely see him drink, which is why I give him butter lettuce as it has a lot of water in it, and he really enjoys it.
  • Fecal Description - His poops are perfectly fine, white and maybe a hint of yellow and the normal brown poop that comes after. He has not ever been tested for parasites.
  • History - Before I took him into my hands, my ex had kept him in a glass tank with another female, who bullied Harold when he was just a few months old. He has been living in his own screen cage for almost a year now and has improved since being in the tank.

Cage Info:

  • Cage Type - I would say it's a combo. I got the big 2x2x4 all screen cage and had my dad help me put plexiglass around 3 of the 4 inside walls to help maintain humidity since it's so dry where I live.
  • Lighting - About a week ago, I had finally bought him (what I think) is the proper UVB lighting light. It's the ZooMed Reptisun Terrarium Hood T5 HO High Output light, and the moment I first put it in there he was basking under it for a good hour. For his basking lamp, I just use a standard house 60 watt light, it is NOT LED.
  • Temperature - The temperature range goes from about 77 degrees up to 89 degrees on hotter days. The coldest it gets in my room at night is 66 degrees.
  • Humidity - I don't know that my humidity levels are, but I know they aren't good enough. I need a hygrometer but haven't found a decent one yet.
  • Plants - Harold used to have a jungle of a cage with all live plants, but apparently I don't know how to take care of plants and they literally all died. This past August I got him one big Umbrella Tree which filled the entire cage, and when you see the picture below, you'll see how sad of a tree it is now.
  • Placement - The cage is in the corer of my room on a nightstand that sits 3 feet above the ground. It's by a vent but I leave the vent closed so no air can reach him. I usually have my ceiling fan on medium to help get some air circulation in his cage as well and keep it not too hot in his cage.
  • Location - I live in Northern Colorado.

Current Problem - He sheds quit often, and not full body sheds just little parts of his body here and there. I am worried about his hydration. His weight, literally everything. He seems happy but that doesn't mean he's healthy.

Here are some photos:

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caseywagz

Member
I also got a picture of the inside of his mouth, it looks clean to me. And this is a strawberry in his mouth if anyone is wondering.

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Beman

Chameleon Enthusiast
Thank you everyone for your input, below I have filled out the chameleon info that was given to me prior to this message:

  • Your Chameleon - Male veiled chameleon, 1.5 years (I think) and I have been caring for him for almost a year.
  • Handling - I recently haven't handled him much at all due to work and school, but he does enjoy coming out and climbing up my curtains
  • Feeding - He will sometimes get horn worms when the store is out of crickets. But I feed him crickets, horn worms on occasion, butter lettuce once a week, and some fruits and veggies throughout the week as well (blueberries, strawberries and bananas) and I also gut load the crickets with the same fruits and veggies and carrots as well.
  • Supplements - I have the basic ZooMed without and with D3 powder, and dust the crickets without D3 every day and with D3 every other week ( about)
  • Watering - This is a problem for me; he has the ZooMed Reptirain for his misting schedule, which goes off every hour for15 seconds, throughout the day. The problem is, it dries up so quickly due to the heat lamp and I cannot keep it humid in there whatsoever. It also doesn't help that I live in Colorado where there is basically no humidity. I rarely see him drink, which is why I give him butter lettuce as it has a lot of water in it, and he really enjoys it.
  • Fecal Description - His poops are perfectly fine, white and maybe a hint of yellow and the normal brown poop that comes after. He has not ever been tested for parasites.
  • History - Before I took him into my hands, my ex had kept him in a glass tank with another female, who bullied Harold when he was just a few months old. He has been living in his own screen cage for almost a year now and has improved since being in the tank.

Cage Info:

  • Cage Type - I would say it's a combo. I got the big 2x2x4 all screen cage and had my dad help me put plexiglass around 3 of the 4 inside walls to help maintain humidity since it's so dry where I live.
  • Lighting - About a week ago, I had finally bought him (what I think) is the proper UVB lighting light. It's the ZooMed Reptisun Terrarium Hood T5 HO High Output light, and the moment I first put it in there he was basking under it for a good hour. For his basking lamp, I just use a standard house 60 watt light, it is NOT LED.
  • Temperature - The temperature range goes from about 77 degrees up to 89 degrees on hotter days. The coldest it gets in my room at night is 66 degrees.
  • Humidity - I don't know that my humidity levels are, but I know they aren't good enough. I need a hygrometer but haven't found a decent one yet.
  • Plants - Harold used to have a jungle of a cage with all live plants, but apparently I don't know how to take care of plants and they literally all died. This past August I got him one big Umbrella Tree which filled the entire cage, and when you see the picture below, you'll see how sad of a tree it is now.
  • Placement - The cage is in the corer of my room on a nightstand that sits 3 feet above the ground. It's by a vent but I leave the vent closed so no air can reach him. I usually have my ceiling fan on medium to help get some air circulation in his cage as well and keep it not too hot in his cage.
  • Location - I live in Northern Colorado.

Current Problem - He sheds quit often, and not full body sheds just little parts of his body here and there. I am worried about his hydration. His weight, literally everything. He seems happy but that doesn't mean he's healthy.

Here are some photos:

View attachment 292111 View attachment 292112View attachment 292113View attachment 292114
I will go through this when I get back home. For now start reading through this husbandry program https://chameleonacademy.com/chameleon-husbandry-program-getting-started-with-chameleons/
 

ERKleRose

Chameleon Enthusiast
My feedback and any questions will be in red. I’ll also attach helpful care images and links at the end!
  • Your Chameleon - Male veiled chameleon, 1.5 years (I think) and I have been caring for him for almost a year.
  • Handling - I recently haven't handled him much at all due to work and school, but he does enjoy coming out and climbing up my curtains He might be wanting to come out if he’s uncomfortable in his cage.
  • Feeding - He will sometimes get horn worms when the store is out of crickets. But I feed him crickets, horn worms on occasion, butter lettuce once a week, and some fruits and veggies throughout the week as well (blueberries, strawberries and bananas) and I also gut load the crickets with the same fruits and veggies and carrots as well. He only needs to be fed bugs, so feed all of the fruits and veggies you have for him (that are safe) to the feeders in the proper amounts. Online bug stores (that are reputable) have cheaper, healthier insects and more variety. So check out a the site sponsors on here for food and Rainbow Mealworms, etc. for better but variety. Variety is key for different types of feeders and gutload ingredients! I’ve attached both gutload and feeder charts below! How often is he being fed? At his age, he needs 2-3 properly gutloaded and supplemented large crickets (or the equivalent of with different feeders) either every other day or three times a week.
  • Supplements - I have the basic ZooMed without and with D3 powder, and dust the crickets without D3 every day and with D3 every other week ( about) The calcium with D3 needs to be exactly once every two weeks. You also need a quality multivitamin without D3, and preferably with preformed Vitamin A, (like Zoo Med Reptivite without D3) to use once every two weeks, as well!
  • Watering - This is a problem for me; he has the ZooMed Reptirain for his misting schedule, which goes off every hour for15 seconds, throughout the day. The problem is, it dries up so quickly due to the heat lamp and I cannot keep it humid in there whatsoever. It also doesn't help that I live in Colorado where there is basically no humidity. I rarely see him drink, which is why I give him butter lettuce as it has a lot of water in it, and he really enjoys it. The Zoo Med ReptiRains suck. MistKing or Climist systems are the way to go, but you can make an Exo Terra Monsoon mister work as well if the other two are too expensive at the moment. Each misting session for during the day needs to be a minimum of 2-5+ minutes long or longer each time! Try to only mist in the morning and at night for your daytime mistings when the cage is cooler, if your humidity allows it. Longer misting sessions and live plants help with humidity, along with cool-mist foggers/humidifiers (at night only!). If you use a fogger, make sure it is during the middle of the night and below 68*F, and make sure to properly clean it, its tubes (if it comes with any), and any other accessories used thoroughly and often! If it has tubes, make sure to place the output tube at the top of his cage so the fog rolls down!
  • Fecal Description - His poops are perfectly fine, white and maybe a hint of yellow and the normal brown poop that comes after. He has not ever been tested for parasites. With his lack of any multivitamins, the bump on his mouth, the black things on him, and improper UVB until a week ago, I’d definitely take him to an experienced chameleon vet ASAP! Make sure to bring a fresh fecal sample with you to get it checked for parasites, and get bloodwork done to check his vitamin levels (he’s big enough to do it safely), as well as x-rays! Make sure to drop off at least 2 more fresh fecal samples afterwards to make sure no parasites were missed.
  • History - Before I took him into my hands, my ex had kept him in a glass tank with another female, who bullied Harold when he was just a few months old. He has been living in his own screen cage for almost a year now and has improved since being in the tank.

Cage Info:

  • Cage Type - I would say it's a combo. I got the big 2x2x4 all screen cage and had my dad help me put plexiglass around 3 of the 4 inside walls to help maintain humidity since it's so dry where I live. Remove the rope ASAP, he can get his nails caught in it! Remove the potty pad thing you have in the bottom of his cage as well, and make/buy a proper drainage system that goes on the outside and under his cage. Can he see his reflection in the plexiglass? He needs TONS more live plants, branches, and vines! I’ll go into more detail on it in the plant section on the form!
  • Lighting - About a week ago, I had finally bought him (what I think) is the proper UVB lighting light. It's the ZooMed Reptisun Terrarium Hood T5 HO High Output light, and the moment I first put it in there he was basking under it for a good hour. For his basking lamp, I just use a standard house 60 watt light, it is NOT LED. What brand and strength of linear UVB bulb did you get? How far away are his heat and UVB bulbs away from his basking branch?
  • Temperature - The temperature range goes from about 77 degrees up to 89 degrees on hotter days. The coldest it gets in my room at night is 66 degrees. His basking temp (measured with a digital thermometer with a probe, with the probe placed where his casque/top of his back is when he’s on his basking branch) needs to be between 80-85*F! Night temps are good! Getting the night temps lower would be even better, though! How do you measure the temps?
  • Humidity - I don't know that my humidity levels are, but I know they aren't good enough. I need a hygrometer but haven't found a decent one yet. Humidity levels are crucial to know! It should be between 30-50% during the day and up to 100% at night! Get 3 digital thermometer-hydrometer combos (with or without probes or just hygrometers) to measure ambient temps and humidity levels in his cage. Place one at the top near his basking branch, one in the middle of the cage, and one near the bottom.
  • Plants - Harold used to have a jungle of a cage with all live plants, but apparently I don't know how to take care of plants and they literally all died. This past August I got him one big Umbrella Tree which filled the entire cage, and when you see the picture below, you'll see how sad of a tree it is now. He needs TONS more cage furnishings! You need way more chameleon-safe and veiled-tested live plants, branches of multiple species and diameters (no branches from toxic or sap-producing trees and no dowels wrapped in moss), and more vines (preferably all real, but fake vines that aren’t moss or Exo Terra vines will work)! I’ve attached two great chameleon cage set-up links and two veiled tested plant charts below! Make sure all plants are properly cleaned off and have rocks to big for him to eat covering the soil in the pots!
  • Placement - The cage is in the corer of my room on a nightstand that sits 3 feet above the ground. It's by a vent but I leave the vent closed so no air can reach him. I usually have my ceiling fan on medium to help get some air circulation in his cage as well and keep it not too hot in his cage. How fast does the fan blow? Chams can’t have drafts or strong currents hitting them.
  • Location - I live in Northern Colorado.

Current Problem - He sheds quit often, and not full body sheds just little parts of his body here and there. I am worried about his hydration. His weight, literally everything. He seems happy but that doesn't mean he's healthy. He needs longer misting sessions so he has the chance to drink, needs to go to the vet, and parts of his husbandry changed.

Here’s the helpful links and images (make sure to read through every module and the veiled species profile, as well as listen to as many podcasts as possible, from The Chameleon Academy, as they have the most up-to-date and accurate info!):

ttps://www.chameleons.info/en/
http://www.muchadoaboutchameleons.com/
https://www.chameleonforums.com/care/external-resources/
https://chameleonacademy.com/chameleon-husbandry-program-getting-started-with-chameleons/
https://chameleonacademy.com/veiled-chameleon-care/
https://chameleonacademy.com/setting-up-a-chameleon-cage/
http://www.muchadoaboutchameleons.com/2012/04/how-to-set-up-proper-chameleon.html
 

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caseywagz

Member
Thanks for the info, I am trying to get him a whole jungle set up for him, but this shit ain't cheap. I'm trying to get at least $300 to redo his entire cage with new plants and branches. Takes time when you're a full time student and work full time !
 

ERKleRose

Chameleon Enthusiast
It was the ReptiSun T5 HO bulb, if that's what you mean.
Is the bulb a 5.0 or a 10.0. It should say what it is on the bulb itself. This is important because it’ll dictate how far away his basking branch will be from the UVB bulb.
 
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