eating behavior

hollycham

hollycham

New Member
Hello, I am new to the site and a new cham owner. I have had Holly for about two months and she was eating very well. She would eat crickets and meal worms every day. All of a sudden about a week ago she stopped eating completely. I tried leaving some worms ( thats her fav ) in a feeder cup but they sat there for four days and she did not even eat one of them. So as i read as a recommendation on one of the discussions here I took all her food away for two day. Tonight I offered her food again and she ran to the top of her cage and would not eat. She is still drinking fluids from her dripper though. I took her out of the cage and pushed her food up against her mouth and she acted like it was not even there.... she is still active and moves throughout the her home but I'm getting very worried as it has been 7 days now since she has ate anything and I also notice she is starting to be really shaky! It does not appear that she has lost any body mass though. Does anyone have any helpful suggestions or comments? Anything would be appreciated greatly. Thanks Carrie
 
https://www.chameleonforums.com/how-ask-help-66/ It is possible if she is indeed a female that she has eggs as females can lay infertile clutches of eggs without being bred. Do not know if you are aware of this. It is just a possibility as loss of appetite is one of the symptoms. Please fill out the form and post pics of your chameleon and set up if possible.
 
Chameleon Info:
Your Chameleon - Veiled cham, approx im guessing around 5 months old and she is a female and i have had her for two months

Handling - couple times a week, she gets a little hissy when getting her out but she will get on our hand and once she is out of her cage she is fine and rolls her tail out and walks all over us ( loves to be on top of our heads ) she likes to try and jump though lol

Feeding - I feed her twice a day morning and evening, she eats crickets and meal worms. She eats crickets in the morning and worms in the evening. She eats her evening meal right out of the palm of my hand. calcium dust on the crickets in a feeder cup in her cage

Supplements - What brand and type of calcium and vitamin products are you dusting your feeders with and what is the schedule?

Watering - she had a dripper at top of her cage that drips approx every 20 seconds and i mist her cage twice a day sometimes three and yes she is drinking.

Fecal Description - there is brown and white from what i have seen

History - She was eatin quit a bit every day but is very active and climbs all over the place she has shed twice since i had her and before she shed the first time she climbed around on the bottom and dug around a little

Cage Info:
Cage Type - she is in a combo tank right now. screening on the top and not sure what the demensions are right now my fiancee is sleeping at this time which is where she is located. I know it is either a 12x12x12 or 18x18x18 ( store recommended it for now ) planning on building a 6 ft all screened in cage after we move in about a month just bought a house and dont want to move her cages now and then move her again afraid it might have stressed her out to much.

Lighting - The rep at store told me to buy 75 watt basking and a different one for night ( incadascent i believe ) i do not have the boxes the bulbs came in anymore so im not exactly sure what brand they are. I keep the reg light in from approx 7 am to 9 pm and the red one from 9 pm to 7 am

Temperature - Her cage is never below 70 and goes up to 95 in hottest basking spot. I have a temp gage the store told me to buy attached to back of the tank.


Humidity - levels maintain between 50 and 65 percent i have dripper and i spray the cage twice daily and i have a humidity gage in the tank on the side

Plants - Not yet, going to put in live hibiscus when we build her permanant cage.

Placement - In my master bedroom, not near any vents or fans but is by slider door, top of cage is at approx 5 foot. Is not a high traffic area is in back corner of my room.

Location - Modesto Ca

Current Problem - She was eating a lot every day and then all of a sudden quit eating completely. She has not eaten in about 7 days now and is a little shaky it looks like in her feet. She is still active and moving around though and still drinking water. I took her out tonight and put her worm right up to her mouth and pushed and she wanted nothing to do with it like it wasnt even there. She doesnt look like she has lost much or any body mass though. Sometimes it looks as though i can see her rib bones but i think that is just when she is like sucking in or something. I will try and post pictures tmw as i am unable to take any tonight
 
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how would i know if she laid infertile eggs? should i empty and clean her cage out? or how would i tell if she is going to?
 
well she would look quite fat and you can sometimes see the outline of the eggs. Her coloring will change and she may quit eating. They will go to the bottom of the cage and start looking for a place to dig. You need to put a laying bin in the cage. I will attach a blog for you on what you need and how to do so in a minute. Do you have a UVB light? If not, that is critical that you get one ASAP. Your basking temp is way too high, especially for a female. High temps and overfeeding can cause egg production Her basking temp should be in the low 80's, ideally. Change out the 75 watt for like a 40 and try to get that temp down. The preferred uvb light is a 5.0 reptisun tube light. She may be getting shaky if she is developing Metabolic Bone disease which is due to her not having exposure to UVB lighting. She needs No light at night. You need to have the cage dark and cool at night. We really need to see some pictures of her and her limbs to make sure she does not have the start of bone disease. Need to know what particular brand of calcium you are using-with or without d3? You need both. Plain calcium every feeding, calcium with d3 twice monthly and a multivitamin twice monthly also. I will get that blog for you about laying bin now.
 
looking back at your info I see you are following the directions of a pet store on the lighting and unfortunately they have given you incorrect information. It happens all too often. So the UVB light is absolutely critical for the survival of your chameleon. Here is the info on the laying bin. Even if she does not have eggs to lay now, she can produce them in the future and you must have one of these in the cage at all times. Unfortunately, your cage is quite small(i know you are building another) so you may have to get a trash canand use that as the laying bin and remove her from the cage to try and get her to lay. If she cannot lay the eggs, she will become eggbound and if that is the case, she will need to get to a vet or she will die. here is the blog . https://www.chameleonforums.com/blogs/jannb/345-egg-laying-laying-bin.html First we need to determine if she is indeed gravid(with eggs) or there is another problem underlying from the lack of UVB. Get the pictures up as soon as you can. I see you live in California? Get your cham out into the sun if you cannot get the UVB light immediately.
 
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Its possible that she needs to lay eggs and its also possible she has MBD if you have not been supplementing, gutloading/feeding the insects properly or providing her with UVB light that does not pass through glass or plastic. You didn't say what supplements specifically you used, so I don't know if its right or not...and you don't say what specifically the lights are or if you gutload/feed the insects properly. The chameleon doesn't need light for sure at night and doesn't need heat at night unless the temps drop below the mid 60's F.

Has she been roaming the cage as if looking for a place to dig to lay eggs? Has she been drinking more than usual? Has she increased in girth in the back half of her body? Does she display dark background colors?

Can you post a recent photo of her please?

Mealworms are not the best option IMHO for feeding her. In addition to the crickets, you can use superworms, hornworms, roaches, once in a while waxworms, etc.

Here's some information I hope will help you ....
Appropriate cage temperatures aid in digestion and thus play a part indirectly in nutrient absorption.

Exposure to UVB from either direct sunlight or a proper UVB light allows the chameleon to produce D3 so that it can use the calcium in its system to make/keep the bones strong and be used in other systems in the chameleon as well. The UVB should not pass through glass or plastic no matter whether its from the sun or the UVB light. The most often recommended UVB light is the long linear fluorescent Repti-sun 5.0 tube light. Some of the compacts, spirals and tube lights have caused health issues, but so far there have been no bad reports against this one.

A wide variety of insects that have been well fed and gutloaded should be fed to it.

Since many of the feeder insects we use in captivity have a poor ratio of calcium to phosphorus in them, its important to dust the insects just before you feed them to the chameleon at most feedings with a phos.-free calcium powder to help make up for it. (I use Rep-cal phosphorus-free calcium).

If you also dust twice a month with a phos.-free calcium/D3 powder it will ensure that your chameleon gets some D3 without overdoing it. It leaves the chameleon to produce the rest of what it needs through its exposure to the UVB light. D3 from supplements can build up in the system but D3 produced from exposure to UVB shouldn't as long as the chameleon can move in and out of it. (I use Rep-cal phos.-free calcium/D3).

Dusting twice a month as well with a vitamin powder that contains a beta carotene (prOformed) source of vitamin A will ensure that the chameleon gets some vitamins without the danger of overdosing the vitamin A. PrEformed sources of vitamin A can build up in the system and may prevent the D3 from doing its job and push the chameleon towards MBD. However, there is controversy as to whether all/any chameleons can convert the beta carotene and so some people give some prEformed vitamin A once in a while. (I use herptivite which has beta carotene.)

Gutloading/feeding the insects well helps to provide what the chameleon needs. I gutload crickets, roaches, locusts, superworms, etc. with an assortment of greens (dandelions, kale, collards, endive, escarole, mustard greens, etc.) and veggies (carrots, squash, sweet potato, sweet red pepper, zucchini, etc.)

Calcium, phos., D3 and vitamin A are important players in bone health and other systems in the chameleon (muscles, etc.) and they need to be in balance. When trying to balance them, you need to look at the supplements, what you feed the insects and what you feed the chameleon.
Please note that various supplements have various amounts of D3 and vitamin A and so some can be given more often than others. The idea still is not to overdo the fat soluble vitamins like D3 and prEformed vitamin A.

Here are some good sites for you to read too...
http://chameleonnews.com/07FebWheelock.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200605020...Vitamin.A.html
http://web.archive.org/web/200406080...d.Calcium.html
http://www.uvguide.co.uk/
http://web.archive.org/web/200601140...ww.adcham.com/
If you can't access the sites above that have the word "archive" in you can do it through the WayBackMachine.
 
A lot of the things I've read on these forums say UVB light can affect your chameleons appetite! So it could be that simple, but I would do everything more experienced people say. They know what they are talking about!
 
ok so i am using flukers calcium with vitamin d3 phspherus free to dust crickets with.

I found the package to one bulb i use during the day it is neodymium basking bulb 75 watt provides radiant heat and uva that retiles need ( is what it says on the box )

i feed the crickets flukers cricket orange cubes ( says provides food and water to the crickets and vitamins )

I will be purchasing one of the bulbs above that was recommended for the uvb instead asap

Her color changes depending on what she is doing when she is mad when we first are sticking our hands in the cage she gets dark brown and black and green however while she is sleeping is a very bright gree and once she she gets out and about on us she turns to a brighter green and unrolls her tail and is very active loving to climb up to the top of our heads and actually trys to jump from our hands. I unfortuantely do not know how to upload photos on here i tried to figure it out and it is not working. I will have to have my oldest daughter hopefully show me if she knows how when she gets home today.

she does not look like she has gotten any larger in the back end , not that i can notice anyways and she is not digging at the bottom of her cage she is just still active and climbs and all over and hangs from the top and she actually likes climbing up on the temp and humditity gages and sleeping there
 
To post a picture from your computer: do not use the convenient "quick reply" box at the bottom of the thread. Instead, click the POST REPLY button. This will open a new reply page with many more "icons" above the box. Click the "paperclip". Follow the prompts to find the file on your computer and upload it. You will not be able to see that you have uploaded a picture, but it will show up in your post (once you submit it) as a thumbnail which enlarges when clicked upon.
 
yes please get the uvb right away. If you cannot get it right away, get her outside inthe sun. You want to purchase a calcium without d3 and dust your feeders with that at every feeding. The one with the d3 you can use bi weekly and also get a multivitamin to use twice a month a well. You need to feed your crickets much better! Fresh fruits and vegetables. Look up our member sandrachameleon's page and check out her blogs for gutloading(feeding)your crickets. As far as the digging, if she has no where to dig , she will more than likely just venture to the bottom of the cage and return to the top. Please read that link I gave you for the egg laying bin from one of our other members atleast if you don't end up needing it right now, but for the future.
 
great thank you for all the information and help. I will go and try to take some more pictures now and try and upload them. I will try putting her in a box and taking her outside for some sunlight as if i carry her she likes to jump off im afraid she might get away from me :(
I will be getting some different calcium and multivitamin for her. Also i think maybe i was over feeding her? How much should she actually eat each day?
 
your cage looks very pretty but it needs more function for your chameleon. There should be a variety of smaller branches and vines, sized so your chameleon can wrap her feet around them and move about the cage. The driftwood or whatever that is looks nice and can stay but you need to add some others climbing areas. Also, I notice you have substrate(looks like mulch) in the bottom. I would suggest moving that and leaving the cage floor bare. Once again, does not looks as pleasing to the eyes but there are a few reasons why we suggest no substrate. First of all it is going to get wet and breed bacteria. Secondly, you chameleon may injest it intentionally or accidentally(by shooting for prey) If swallowed could lead to an impaction. I know you are going to be building a larger cage, and that is great cause that one is really too small as I know you are aware. So the vines and branches may not work for this enclosure because of the amount of room you have. She does not look pregnant to me. Her limbs look good and are not curved so thank goodness she has no outward signs of MBD. Glad you came to the forum cause over time not having the UVB would have caused problems down the road for you. Again, this is just my opinion. But to me she does not look like she has eggs. Hopefully some others will chime in with their opinions also. I am just going by other females I have seen on here carrying eggs and I could be wrong.
 
Thank you so much for the information and help. I will remove the subtrate from the bottom of the tank, the only reason i even put it is was because when i bought her they said she needed to help build the humidity in her living area. Could you tell me what a good humidity level is?
 
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