Deadly Chameleon Myth series

[PetNcs]

@PetNcs said…”THEY ARE VENOMOUS AND HAVE FORMIC ACID AND ARE BLACK (whichbis a food color often omitted) SOMEONE NEED TO STUDY IT, I AM A BIT SKEPTICAL”…regarding Formic acid…

Here’s a bit of information about insects that contain formic acid…
https://www.chameleonforums.com/threads/insects-and-formic-acid….195372/

interesting perspective indeed… I guess it is a bit different perspective to contain it in the bodies and being subject of digestion (even in bees, the stings are very rare and cause no to little or temporary reactions) and being proactively used for defence over distance while spraying it into the air…
The exposure to
mouth and esophagous tissues can be iritating and damaging, the stilomach can handle it and itnis metabolised in the liver bfoken down to
carbon dioxide and water
small concentrations are harmless higher concentrations would cuase problems
in the lerspecticemof chameleons, I have rarely seen them targetting ants…

 

[kinyonga]

I was never curious about the formic acid, even though I knew it was found in ants, until today…and your mention of it made me wonder what other insects might have formic acid in them.

There’s always something new to learn about!

I’ve never seen a chameleon target an ant either…but I only have dealt with a few species of chameleons and only in captivity…so they didn’t see ants as a rule.

 

[PetNcs]

BSF are great when I manage to have any.
I admit, I just have a curse. Absolute rotten luck with keeping BSFL. I'll order 200, but get major die offs within the week of receiving them. I feed them, try to keep the container damp via spraying with a mist bottle, but they still end up dying. I haven't stumbled upon anything particularly helpful for their care either.
It is a joy getting to put a fly into my chameleon's enclosure, though. Doesn't happen much
Thank you for your insight and response.

they are usually quite hardy. be careful to
make their environment damp, rhey tend not to like it while in moist substrate they actually thrive. there are good sources in www to find the way how to keep them and a hint: better buy eggs than the worms

 

[PetNcs]

@javadi you mentioned that you did not observe chams near flowers
Did you see flowers anywhere? I have never been there so I can’t quite imagine what it actually looks like from pictures
There are several endemic Madagascar flowers that I pay for at my local nursery, plant in pots outside, and intend for them to die here that are survivable year round in Madagascar

My initial impression is flowers would be rare in forested areas due to lack of light penetration to the forest floor
But I would imagine they aren’t far for a flying insect from where you found Chams, but again, I am just making assumptions

Those insects have other reasons to go somewhere beyond the flowers themselves, so isn’t it possible some of their diet is exposed to pollen in more open areas and captured where the Chams live?

the vast majority of chameleonsnin Madagascar do not live in dense jungle like forst. they need auav and thiugh they di nit bask too often, rhey always need a biotope witb some exposure to sun. An there is comes. I have seen solitary flocers that have IMHO no significance for chameleons to get to them. but ai have seen palms and zizipha (not indigenous) and mango blooming and xhameleons sitting next to them and luring on the polinatirs to come and feed on them. It is just damn hard to ohotograph this in the filed. Once yih are close, rhey notice yiu and oay attention to yiu not the feeders

 

[MissSkittles]

I understand what you say
it is pittiful you have so much understanding for all the others but accuse me always from being the one being destructive.
frankly, I came back here to be available for some discussion on the topics of chameleons not to open unhealed and painful old wounds. If this will continue I am gone as it has no sense. You do not want to treat me with respect and claim I am a bad boy and I was slept into my face on this forum so many times that I lost all interest to engage. And all
is my fault. After years I have not been here, you do not say welcome Petr we hope for great input from you but you again comment on our
misunderstandings from the past and make everyone clear I am a bad boy and you feel it friedly and proper. It is a textbook example
of double moral.
I am here just for chameleons,
not for drama.
I also come from a completely different culture and speak english as my fifth language and not mothers tongue. I understand that the usually one-language-only approach in the territory you are predominantly focusing on is not opening you for understanding how hard it is to target thing from the perspective on a non native speaker.
Please let us stop this not about chameleon discussion.
I was very enthusiastic to help CF and I was excommunicated and not even thanked, I was accused from bad will, which is opposite of what was my intention.
I do not want to be unwlecome again. I will better leave you alone. Your
members will find me if they are interested in my opinion.

As you wish.

 

[PetNcs]

I was never curious about the formic acid, even though I knew it was found in ants, until today…and your mention of it made me wonder what other insects might have formic acid in them.

There’s always something new to learn about!

I’ve never seen a chameleon target an ant either…but I only have dealt with a few species of chameleons and only in captivity…so they didn’t see ants as a rule.

there is always something to learn, I love your approach! I will paybattention to it in the fitire but diagnosing ants in the decal
samplesnis extremelybrare though once there, their heads are easy to se, as rhey are undigestable


therefore, I ssre to think ants are nit a significant food even if available except for their breeding season when swarns of the mating winged ones fly all over on the wedding- nuptial flight, but then they do not look as. regular ants but as flies… they are fat and big…

 

[PetNcs]

As you wish.

I would be pleased to see you unzipped when asking questions and saying something nice, questions are more important

 

[PetNcs]

@nightanole said…”Welp guess ill start breeding Madagascar bees or something”…bet importing bees from Madagascar isn’t allowed….so you will need to substitute something biologically inappropriate. We’re off to a good start.

Petr said…”In captivity, chameleons are often fed what is available, not what is biologically appropriate. Wild diets are diverse, seasonal, and behaviorally integrated—yet we offer waxworms, mealworms, or oversized roaches devoid of micronutrient balance. Worse, we omit critical prey types they evolved to consume”…we cannot feed them the exact species of insects that they eat in the wild because we cannot buy them here or import them…so it seems the only alternative at the moment is to use the insects that are available and try to balance the micronutrients, etc through supplements and gut loading and feeding the insects what is needed to give the chameleons the balance. We can’t import many of the types of vegetation and grow them here…so again, we have to come up with a good solution.

So…what can we do to make it a natural diet/habitat when there are so many obstacles? Petr?

There are many many options… BSF, other flies, butteflies and moths. Inhave posted lots of dietary charts, they can be raised commercially and easiky to breed even at home or at least letting them finalize their reproductive cycle…. The area is dark and not ideal but there is light in the tunnel and it is a bright one. if you want, I can repost my feeding and supplementation and food dose charts…

 

[jamest0o0]

I don’t have time to read all of this now, but I want to say I regret making assumptions about you @PetNcs and while I’m still skeptical of some things I’d like to take things in a friendly turn. I have no intention of making anyone feel bad.