Dark coloured, lethargic, please help.

Robyn.lux

Member
Chameleon Info:

◦ Your Chameleon - Masoala panther chameleon, 6 months old, had him around 6 weeks.

◦ Handling - next to never, unless he willingly crawls onto me.

◦ Feeding - Guloaded feeders; Dubia and locusts (he refuses crickets) cup feed dubia and free feed locusts. Gut loaded with a superload (brand escapes me I'm currently out), dandelion leaves, fruit veggies etc.
Calci worms.
He gets fed everyday at 9.30 anything left gets removed before lights out.
5 locusts, 5 dubia and 5 calci worms.

◦ Supplements - Exo terra, calcium w/o d3 every day. With d3 every other week. Vitamin without d3 every other week when it's not d3.

◦ Watering - I hand mist, twice daily, morning for around 2 minutes and evening for a minute. Dripper all morning. He is shy so I leave him alone in a morning, I assume he drinks then.

◦ Fecal Description - White chalky/clear urate, solid but slick blackish brown poop. He has been tested for parasite but I plan to have another done. He poops around 3 times a week.

◦ History - No previous though last time he was due to shed, he did go really dark in colour, he was stressed when I first got him but once he got settled he's been fine.


Cage Info:

◦ Cage Type - Exo terra, glass, 90x45x90, bioactive bottom.

◦ Lighting - exo terra t8 30w UVB, exo terra ceramic 150w for basking.

◦ Temperature - 85-89f basking. 75-64f for ambient. Night never drops below 60f. X3 temp probs in viv at various levels.

◦ Humidity - Once misted, 80% humidity which drops to around 60% once dried out. Never goes below 60%. Two exo terra hygrometers, one bottom, one mid level. Live plants and naturalistic bottom along with dripper to keep maintained. I am also home all day so throw an extra misting session if needed.

◦ Plants - 3 pothos plants.

◦ Placement - Cage in my living room, low traffic as I live alone and rarely have guests, around 3ft off of the floor (not ssuper high but I approach the viv on my knees). Near no windows, vents, fans etc.

◦ Location - East coast England.


Current Problem - He was throwing a lot of dark colours last week and seemed stressed but he perked up over the weekend. He's not been eating properly for a few days. I woke him up today and his colouring was dark. I did the usual morning misting and set the dripper. I went away and came back around 45 minutes later to feed. He still hadn't moved. I put his dubia and calci worms in a cup and released a few locusts into his vivarium. It got to around 11.30 and he still hadn't moved. Since he looked stressed I put his night time viv covers over in case I was stressing him.
He moved around a fair bit in the afternoon but he never once went to his basking spot. He curled up in his sleeping spot around 2 hours earlier than he normally would and stayed there until lights off.
I am getting him to a specialist vet on Tuesday, it was the soonest they could see him. I also phoned a local vet but they have no experience with chams or any reptile so I don't want to take him. He doesn't look dehydrated. He could be due a shed but I'm not that's what could be causing this. Can anyone spot anything in my husbandry that could be an issue? He's usually active, hunting etc. Any advise would be appreciated. I don't have photos as I didn't want to stress him more with sticking my phone in his face. Other than his dark colours and general lethargy he looks fine, his skin looks a little wrinkly though.

Sorry for the length of the post. I just wanted to be thorough.
 

Robyn.lux

Member
Is he sleeping during the day?

Not that I saw. He's been covered to help with his stress. When I had a peak around 5.30pm he looked as if he could've been asleep or he could've just have been looking in a different direction. He has been in his sleep spot since around 5pm. I'll keep a closer eye on him tomorrow. Is it anything in particular that can cause day sleeping?
 

Robyn.lux

Member
...only everything if it goes on long enough...

Is there anything you could advise me to try.?
I'm going to call the vets tomorrow to see if the specialist is at a different branch, if he is, I'll call that branch and try to get him in there, if not, there is his appointment on Tuesday. I'm worried sick. He really perked up and then yesterday he only ate a few calci worms and today, nothing. Back to dark colours, really lethargic and his skin looks, I don't know how to describe it really. Just, baggy. I saw him drink from a leaf this morning so I don't think he's dehydrated.
 

Robyn.lux

Member
Nothing is jumping out at me, post pics of him and his viv.

Here are the photos. I've struggled to get the ones of him because he doesn't want to be seen.
I've added a normal house lamp on top of his viv for the time being. I'm wondering if his tank is not getting enough heat and again for the winter I am thinking of getting a second ceramic at 50watt because my flat gets so cold and his vivarium is so big. Just use it in a morning to get his vivarium up to a temp where he warms up a bit faster. He seems awake and alert, I'm sure he's just been drinking from one of the leafs. Excuse the plastic container on the bottom, it's just there to catch the excess water from the dripper. It'll be removed before I release his locusts. Going to give him an extra hour to warm up today so feeding will be around 10.30 instead.
 

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Robyn.lux

Member
I'm also trying to find some suitable branches for more horizontal walk ways near the top. Or I may just get another exo terra moss vine and zip tie it across.
 

Robyn.lux

Member
Boost. Anyone? He's not moved at all today. His colours aren't as dark but he's not once moved, eaten, nothing. His eyes have been open and alert all day. Do I need to worry?
 

Brodybreaux25

Chameleon Enthusiast
No one is answering you because we see nothing wrong in what you have provided. There is only so much we can do over the internet.

As chams mature they do eat less. As long as he isn’t sleeping during they day I wouldn’t panic.

If your still concerned then just keep a close eye on him til Tuesday.
 

Robyn.lux

Member
No one is answering you because we see nothing wrong in what you have provided. There is only so much we can do over the internet.

As chams mature they do eat less. As long as he isn’t sleeping during they day I wouldn’t panic.

If your still concerned then just keep a close eye on him til Tuesday.


Had some further development today. He's passed some faeces and it has a couple of undigested Phoenix/calci worms in it. His urate was good. His faeces also smelt a little bad.
Shall I lay off of the worms for a while? He also seemed to have a stuck sperm plug. I carefully wiped at it with a Q tip and some came out, but I don't think the whole thing came out. He was patrolling his viv like a crazy cham until lights out. He seemed really uncomfortable. Cause for concern or just me being over protective?
Sorry to bother you, you just seem to have the best advice. Either way, he's booked into the vets.
I've saved a sample of his faeces because I don't think he'll do another before Tuesday. Do you think it'll be okay for like, 48 hours or so? I placed it in plastic wrap in a box in my fridge. One day, I hope I will stop worrying about the little guy and trust nature can do it's job but I am little concerned. I can still hear him scuttling around even though his lights are off and his viv is covered.
 

Brodybreaux25

Chameleon Enthusiast
If he isn’t basking as much then it makes sense that some of the food he had wasn’t fully digested. I don’t feed worms so I don’t know the effect on their digestive tract, some feeders are harder on them than others.

Never apologize for speaking advice, it’s what we’re here for.

As long as he is awake, eating, and drinking I don’t think you have anything to worry about.

Don’t know if the fecal will hold for 48 hours but I would keep it anyway. Trust me, it’s no fun collecting one manually.
 

Robyn.lux

Member
If he isn’t basking as much then it makes sense that some of the food he had wasn’t fully digested. I don’t feed worms so I don’t know the effect on their digestive tract, some feeders are harder on them than others.

Never apologize for speaking advice, it’s what we’re here for.

As long as he is awake, eating, and drinking I don’t think you have anything to worry about.

Don’t know if the fecal will hold for 48 hours but I would keep it anyway. Trust me, it’s no fun collecting one manually.

I didn't even know it was possible to get one manually. Sounds like it would be stressful for them.
I figured something is better than nothing.
He didn't bask at all yesterday so that makes sense. I didn't really think about it. Thank you for the reassurance. He did seem a bit better today. I was worried he was getting a bit dehydrated so it was good to see his white urate today.
I just can't wait for Tuesday to roll around so I can get some peace of mind if he's ill or not.
If he's not I need to figure out what's stressing him out. Complicated little bugger. Keeping me on my toes for sure.
 
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