Chameleon Emotion
- Thread starter LucasD
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mcleodschams
Established Member
i believe they can i have one male that just loves me for some reason he likes everyone but im his favorite over all 
DekuScrub
Avid Member
just my opinion buuuuut...... theyre kind of stupid. certainly loads of personality especially when you have many chams and can compare and contrast their behavioral differences. but as far as having any sort of complex emotion.... id have to say null and void. scared yeah, content sure, horny definitely much more fundamental than a mammal like a dog or cat. though im not much a fan of cattitude, stupid cuddly things need to learn some values from a dog.
then again i may be giving people and other mammals too much credit. most of the people i see floating around are on some sort of instinctual autopilot. completely unaware of any sense of self.
then again i may be giving people and other mammals too much credit. most of the people i see floating around are on some sort of instinctual autopilot. completely unaware of any sense of self.
mcleodschams
Established Member
maybe not emotion but they are definatly not stupid imo i think alot are just stubbern and have a leave me alone attitude
DekuScrub
Avid Member
depends on an individuals definition of intelligence.... is my beta fish smart because he floats up to the top when i sit down at my computer? no hes just conditioned to expect food. same reason certain friendly chams will climb on your arm or paw at the cage till you let them out. they recognize food and trips outside correlate to your presence. though i must admit when they lick you you kinda feel sorta special....
then again the argument of, people can appreciate your presence based on survival factors, devalues my point. such as providing food, security, reproduction. these are just innate, animal responses to beneficial circumstances. and weare all just animals.
i just wouldnt call these emotions any sort of complex. they would respond just to same to another individual treating them likewise, maybe not initially (because of unfamiliar visuals) but with a bit of conditioning. they wont miss you when youre gone. i dont think they think about you when youre gone but they can respond to the stimuli you provide in a beneficial way. so take it as you will
i still think theyre dumb
then again the argument of, people can appreciate your presence based on survival factors, devalues my point. such as providing food, security, reproduction. these are just innate, animal responses to beneficial circumstances. and weare all just animals.
i just wouldnt call these emotions any sort of complex. they would respond just to same to another individual treating them likewise, maybe not initially (because of unfamiliar visuals) but with a bit of conditioning. they wont miss you when youre gone. i dont think they think about you when youre gone but they can respond to the stimuli you provide in a beneficial way. so take it as you will
i still think theyre dumb
Carlton
Chameleon Enthusiast
I think you are confusing emotion with intelligence. They are not dependent on each other completely.
First, why don't we define the terms a little better:
Intelligence is different from instinct or fixed action patterns that are hard wired into an animal's behavior through accumulated evolutionary influences. The animal is not analyzing what is best to do in a situation, it just does what the hard wiring tells it to even if the response isn't totally correct. For example...put a female duck in an enclosure she can't see out of. Put a duckling of a different species nearby so she can hear it. When the duckling starts calling for "mom", the female duck would try to get out of the box to reach the duckling. Instinct is telling her to respond to a baby's distress call. But, when she sees that the duckling is not hers, she may chase it away or try to kill it. Instinct is telling her to chase off an intruder or a competitor.
Emotions are communication behaviors...they express what an individual is thinking about and help them choose the appropriate response to survive a threat, avoid fights and injuries, to breed and raise young successfully, and carry on their genetics. But emotion also requires two individuals to work...one to express something and the other to interpret it and modify its own behavior. I'd say that solitary animals use emotional responses a little less than social (herding) animals do. They still need them, but they can be less complex. A solitary cham still needs to respond to competitors, threats, and potential mates.
Can an animal that is not known to be very intelligent be emotional? Sure!
My motmots are not known for their smarts but they are very emotional. They show devotion to each other, fear, anger, which are socially important. Many birds (with exceptions like corvids and parrots) are not known to be very intelligent; in other words, they rely a lot on instinctual memory rather than analytical thought. The theory for this is that birds gave up a lot of brain space to keep the size of their head smaller and more in balance with their bodies for flight and to allow space for their very large eyes and acute vision. Instinct takes up less brain space than analytical ability.
Can an animal that is intelligent not show emotion? It would be hard, but probably. Animals that are highly intelligent tend to be socially sophisticated and they would need more finely developed emotions that allow them to interact with others. But, I'd say an intelligent animal can learn to lay aside emotion in order to make a very rational decision.
So, after all this blather, chams can be relatively unintelligent but be very emotional. Their emotional range includes fear, aggression, and excitement but probably does not include "love". Breeding pairs don't nuture each other and they don't care for babies which would require some sort of altruistic emotional bond that can override their attempts to stay alive. I'd say your chams accept you as something not to be feared or as a source of good things, but I'd really doubt they love their keepers. You, as a highly intelligent social creature, are interpreting your cham's acceptance as affection because you really WANT it to like you. You want it to like you because that is an important feeling humans have...to be needed and accepted or loved.
My melleri Mufindi was a lovely friendly cham. She was her own self, an individual, with her own personality. Did she love me? Probably not. She felt peaceful and safe around me which made me enjoy her presence even more. This was my social creature's response to her behavior not necessarily her response to mine. Did I love her less because she isn't able to love me? No...I just thought about her differently.
First, why don't we define the terms a little better:
Intelligence is different from instinct or fixed action patterns that are hard wired into an animal's behavior through accumulated evolutionary influences. The animal is not analyzing what is best to do in a situation, it just does what the hard wiring tells it to even if the response isn't totally correct. For example...put a female duck in an enclosure she can't see out of. Put a duckling of a different species nearby so she can hear it. When the duckling starts calling for "mom", the female duck would try to get out of the box to reach the duckling. Instinct is telling her to respond to a baby's distress call. But, when she sees that the duckling is not hers, she may chase it away or try to kill it. Instinct is telling her to chase off an intruder or a competitor.
Emotions are communication behaviors...they express what an individual is thinking about and help them choose the appropriate response to survive a threat, avoid fights and injuries, to breed and raise young successfully, and carry on their genetics. But emotion also requires two individuals to work...one to express something and the other to interpret it and modify its own behavior. I'd say that solitary animals use emotional responses a little less than social (herding) animals do. They still need them, but they can be less complex. A solitary cham still needs to respond to competitors, threats, and potential mates.
Can an animal that is not known to be very intelligent be emotional? Sure!
My motmots are not known for their smarts but they are very emotional. They show devotion to each other, fear, anger, which are socially important. Many birds (with exceptions like corvids and parrots) are not known to be very intelligent; in other words, they rely a lot on instinctual memory rather than analytical thought. The theory for this is that birds gave up a lot of brain space to keep the size of their head smaller and more in balance with their bodies for flight and to allow space for their very large eyes and acute vision. Instinct takes up less brain space than analytical ability.
Can an animal that is intelligent not show emotion? It would be hard, but probably. Animals that are highly intelligent tend to be socially sophisticated and they would need more finely developed emotions that allow them to interact with others. But, I'd say an intelligent animal can learn to lay aside emotion in order to make a very rational decision.
So, after all this blather, chams can be relatively unintelligent but be very emotional. Their emotional range includes fear, aggression, and excitement but probably does not include "love". Breeding pairs don't nuture each other and they don't care for babies which would require some sort of altruistic emotional bond that can override their attempts to stay alive. I'd say your chams accept you as something not to be feared or as a source of good things, but I'd really doubt they love their keepers. You, as a highly intelligent social creature, are interpreting your cham's acceptance as affection because you really WANT it to like you. You want it to like you because that is an important feeling humans have...to be needed and accepted or loved.
My melleri Mufindi was a lovely friendly cham. She was her own self, an individual, with her own personality. Did she love me? Probably not. She felt peaceful and safe around me which made me enjoy her presence even more. This was my social creature's response to her behavior not necessarily her response to mine. Did I love her less because she isn't able to love me? No...I just thought about her differently.
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ChameleonFan1989
New Member
I wouldn't say any animal is stupid, I think animals are more intelligent than humans and believe me I've met a handful of humans who I would consider stupid throughout my life and would have a animal anyday LMAO
I wouldn't compare them to a dog are a cat but I believe a chameleon can resconise a particular person as long as you associate yourself with free ranging time or feeding time and the general care etc my panther's feeding time is due he'll watch me getting the food ready and then make his way halfway down the cage so I can reach him to hand feed and does this everytime.
I wouldn't compare them to a dog are a cat but I believe a chameleon can resconise a particular person as long as you associate yourself with free ranging time or feeding time and the general care etc my panther's feeding time is due he'll watch me getting the food ready and then make his way halfway down the cage so I can reach him to hand feed and does this everytime.
