Chameleon Egg bound/aspiriation

[RogueTheChameleon]

Hi, i have a roughly 1 year old chameleon, and since i knew she was getting to the time where she could lay eggs i put in a laying bin, for the past week shes been digging in it a lot, but i never saw any eggs... Recently I saw her eyes were sunken and she was very weak and hasnt been eating much the past few days, She feel into her laying bin earlier so i picked her up and took her out, she looked very dehydrated and opened her mouth a few times, so i put my mister on the lowest mode where it would lightly give a line of water, i gave her water from the side and was drinking a little bit and got a little bit more green, but when i was doing that she looked towards me a little bit and I think she may of got a straight shot... I tried putting her back in her cage but she will not grip onto anything... It is late at night and i have no reptile vet near me... What should i do? Was the weakness from being egg bound and thats why she wasn't eating/drinking?... I also pressed down on the top of its head a little bit and a giant water bubble came out of her nose

 

[RogueTheChameleon]

I assume someone will ask for this

Cage Info:

* Cage Type - Reptibreeze 18x18x36
* Lighting - 60w heat bulb since its summer, and 5.0 reptisun compact uvb bulb, on from about 10am to 10pm
* Temperature - temps are 80 in basking area, 75 around cage, and falls to about 70 at night.
Humidity - 50-60%, I have a mister and reptifogger
* Plants - none
* Location - Next to my computer setup but I have a blanket I put on the left of the screen so it blocks my monitor lights at night. I have a fan in my room but it does not blow directly on the chameleon


Chameleon Info:

* Your Chameleon - Veiled Chameleon around 1 year old
* Feeding - I feed it Crickets as the stable and superworms on occasion, I feed it about 15 crickets a day
* Supplements - Calcium once a day, d3 twice a month, and multivitamin twice a month
* Watering - I mist daily, and have a reptidripper I see it drink from often.
* Fecal Description - dark brown

 

[jamest0o0]

You dont want her to see you while shes digging or she wont lay. If you kept checking on her theres a chance she chose not to lay and became eggbound

 

[RogueTheChameleon]

Update: She passed away not to long ago, but for anyone reading this thread, I've owned 2 chameleons, my first one lived to about the same age as this one, but got a eye infection early on and I took it to the vet but they were not able to do much, and with this one I assume it was a mix of the egg bound and water issue, recapping on what james said, whenever she was in the bin I avoided my room whenever i could, and if i was in my room I would cover up both sides of the cage where she could see me. Am I just unlucky or what could you guys recommend? I love chameleons but I do not know if I should get anymore with the issues i've had...

 

[jannb]

I am very sorry for your loss.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

Sorry for your loss. Please read my entire post.

No you should NOT get another Cham until you fully understand how to provide the proper husbandry for the type of Cham you have. You might not like what I have to say but I’m going to say it anyway in the hopes that you understand and fix these issues so one day you can get another Cham and have it live a full, healthy life.

Since you asked and based on the limited information you provided I do not think you are unlucky. Being unlucky may have played a bigger role in the death of your first cham but I don’t think it played a significant role here. I think this death is a result of three mistakes in your husbandry. I will go through them in the order in which I think they affected her.

The first issue is over feeding. 15 crickets a day is way too much. She should have been eating 5-7 crickets every other day. Over feeding causes them to have abnormally large clutch sizes. Apart from how taxing it is on her body to produce such a load, it also makes it a lot more difficult to actually lay the eggs. The result is eggbinding and without medical intervention, ultimately death. Open her up and count how many eggs she had, this would go along way to proving or disproving if over feeding was an factor.

Second issue is repeatedly disturbing her. I know you said that you tried to stay out of your room as much as possible and alway covered her with a blanket when you did enter the room but that is exactly the problem. Every time you covered her is a disturbance. When she began to show signs of wanting to lay, you should have covered her enclosure and left it in place until she finished laying. You should not be bothering her in any way except for occasionaly offering food or water.

Both reasons listed above will lead to eggbinding. No appetite, weak grip, and falling are all classic signs of a Cham dying from eggbinding. The other classic sign is dehydration, I think dehydration is the third factor that played an indirect role in her death. She was already weak from being dehydrated so as a good cham keeper your natural reaction is to attemp to “force” her to drink. I would have done the same. This is where I think luck played a small role in her death, the fact that she happens to turn her head and accidentally inhaled water. The fact that she had a “giant water bubble” come out of her nose tells me that she did choke on some water. After choking on top of her already weakened state it was just a matter of time.

I truly hope you have not taken offense to this post but have had it motivate you to learn all you can about these wonderful creatures before you buy another one! And please feel free to ask any question you have no matter how minor or silly, we are here to help you!

 

[RogueTheChameleon]

I do not take any offense to this post at all, this was exactly what I was looking for. thank you for clarification on feeding, If I ever feel prepared to get one again I will make sure to have it in another room where there are no disturbances or make sure there are 0 disturbances when it comes time for egg laying if it is in my room. Thank you for taking so much time to right out a detailed post for me, I will continue to do more research and hopefully the time will come when I can feel prepared to successfully own one without any husbandry mistakes and proper care.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

The fact that you actually took the advice without getting offended is a trait all competent cham keepers have! You wouldn’t believe how many people come here asking for help and then get mad when you point out what went wrong.

If I may make a suggestion, when you do decide to get another Cham, make it a male. They are a lot easier to care for!

 

[jamest0o0]

^couldn't agree more with that. We all make mistakes, it's how you humbly adapt and learn that separates the winners from the losers.

 

[Beelinn]

I do not take any offense to this post at all, this was exactly what I was looking for. thank you for clarification on feeding, If I ever feel prepared to get one again I will make sure to have it in another room where there are no disturbances or make sure there are 0 disturbances when it comes time for egg laying if it is in my room. Thank you for taking so much time to right out a detailed post for me, I will continue to do more research and hopefully the time will come when I can feel prepared to successfully own one without any husbandry mistakes and proper care.

This indeed hurts to hear. This is not my post, but I lost my female about two weeks ago to this same thing.
I knew enough to leave her alone, but since *I knew* she was too early to lay, I didn't give her enough privacy.
If I ever decide to do the breeding thing again, the female will just be off in a cage someplace, only disturbed enough to put new food in. I think you just can't have it both ways, a pet AND a breeder.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

This indeed hurts to hear. This is not my post, but I lost my female about two weeks ago to this same thing.
I knew enough to leave her alone, but since *I knew* she was too early to lay, I didn't give her enough privacy.
If I ever decide to do the breeding thing again, the female will just be off in a cage someplace, only disturbed enough to put new food in. I think you just can't have it both ways, a pet AND a breeder.

You can absolutely have it both ways, you just have to be vigilant. My chams are members of our family and are kept in our living room. But when she starts to show signs of wanting to lay I totally change the husbandry I’m applying to her. Knowing when and what type of husbandry to apply is key to keeping females healthy.

 

[JacksJill]

Keep in mind females have dramatically shorter life spans because of the strain reproduction puts on them. You may want to consider sticking to owning males. Males are a better pets for people still in the early learning stages.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

I do not take any offense to this post at all, this was exactly what I was looking for. thank you for clarification on feeding, If I ever feel prepared to get one again I will make sure to have it in another room where there are no disturbances or make sure there are 0 disturbances when it comes time for egg laying if it is in my room. Thank you for taking so much time to right out a detailed post for me, I will continue to do more research and hopefully the time will come when I can feel prepared to successfully own one without any husbandry mistakes and proper care.

Did you ever open her up to see how many eggs she had?

 

[RogueTheChameleon]

Did you ever open her up to see how many eggs she had?

no, by the time I saw the reply she was already buried, sorry.

 

[RogueTheChameleon]

Keep in mind females have dramatically shorter life spans because of the strain reproduction puts on them. You may want to consider sticking to owning males. Males are a better pets for people still in the early learning stages.

yeah, I was hoping for a male but I got her from petsmart (not a good place to buy reptiles from whatI heard) but I didn't know the one near me was a female only store and they only sell female reptiles. So if I feel prepared to buy another Im going to buy a male from a site like flchams.