Brown loose "pee"

[chamlover]

That is exactly what it looks like my new melleri is doing. This is the second time it has happened. I know i should have taken a pic but didn't think of it at the time. He pooped, which was very loose and wet, with a couple of funky looking urates that were off-white then quite a bit of ,what for a better term , looked like brown pee. Considering he is the one we are rehabbing and is in pretty bad shape, i'm not surprised, but i have no clue as to what this would be an indication of. Any ideas? His main diet has consisted of crickets until 2 days ago when i got my hornworms in. Then i added 1 a day in with his crickets. He won't touch the butterworms.

Another question. When do you think he would be well enough to treat for parasites? I know he has them because he is w/c and his poop stinnnkkkks!! Already sent the sample in, have to call the vet for the results, but like i said before last week, even the dealer said he was too bad to try to treat for parasites and said not to give it to him cause he thought it would kill him. But now i don't know when to start. He is up to 128 gr, so he has gained 8 gr in a week. My other melleri weighs in at 498 gr.

Debby

 

[chamlover]

I thought i would add a pic of him that i took yesterday. There are more photos under "General Photography" with the heading "Meet Samson"

Debby

I know he doesn't look very good, but he looks 100% better than he did a week ago. And besides it's what's inside tht counts and he seems to have a heart of gold.

 

[opihiman]

Could the brown urates indicate some kind of kidney or upper GI bleeding...is small coffee ground looking?

OPI

 

[chamlover]

Do you mean as in the consistency? It just a plain brown and all liquid. Not thick or chunky lilke usual urates. Like pee but brown. Would there be any other symptoms i could look for that might indicate that? I know if i take him to the vets he's just going to look at him and say " Yep he needs to put on some weight". I don't know if he is even strong enough to go through a vet's visit right now. Now i'm really worried!!

The vet called and said his fecal was clean which i know can't be right. So i will be taking another fecal in tomorrow or the next day.

Debby

 

[lbesok]

Debby, about how old/long is this guy, compared to your other Melleri?
Do you think that maybe he's not fully digesting the horn worm and it's the brown gewie insides? Or would you say it's more like diarrhea?
When we first got our WC Melleri, he was a little smaller ~8in and ~140g now he is ~8.5in and ~215g. The bigger deceased one was in rougher shape went from 350g-420g and was ~15in. I would use your judgment, and when you think it is stabilized begin the panacur treatment. I think 8g in a week is good progress, a good balance b/c you don't want him gaining too much either. I'm really rooting for this guy!

 

[chamlover]

That was kinda what i thought of when if first saw it but it happened once before i even got the worms. Also he has only had maybe 2 worms, big ones though, and the " pee" was really quite a large amount. It was complete liquid, like water, only brown. My hubby and i are convinced that he has probably not eaten anything or next to nothing in over 2 mos. Do you think it could just be his body getting use to eating again? And getting rid of yickkies? I haven't wanted to bother him to measure, but i'm thinking he is almost full grown. He has got to be at least 15" long. The only thing that makes me think he might not be is his head is a little smaller than my other one, but he just might be a smaller one too, so i don't know. Tomorrow when i shower him, i will measure him. Do you think i should try to take him into the vets for bloodwork? Maybe his intestines are having difficulty digesting the food? When you look at his poop it does look like everything has been well digested though except for this brown liquid. If it happens again i will take pic. I'm just starting to get so worried about him. I thought he was doing so well when he started eating and drinking on his own and now i'm concerned that maybe i shouldn't have tried to feed him so soon.




Debby

 

[lbesok]

He looks pretty good. He's big too! I know from experience that parasite loads can be responsible for some really icky stinky poos, with not very much consistency, but have never had experience with as much liquid as you are describing, except for when it unfortunately involved blood.
Did you ever look into the pro-biotics? Those would prob be helpful when you decide to start the Panacur, and depending on the fecal result you may be prescribed Flagyl or some other parasite treatment. Our Melleri required a round of Flagyl as well.
IMO blood work may be too stressful right now, unless he indicates to you that he REALLY needs it. Oftentimes it is hard for the most experienced reptile vet to locate the vein below the hemipenal bulge, an experience that is oftentimes taxing on the animal. He knows his body best and I assume wouldn't be eating if he weren't comfortable handling it or had some major underlying problem. How much have you been feeding him lately again? The nice sour apple green color is also a good sign. Keep up the good work with Samson Debby, I hope to see him to continue improving with you.

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Hercules did messy, wet, chunky poop when we first got him. With a lot of tan and brown mucus, and sloppy wet stuff. And STIIIINK! He had pinworms. We treated him with Panacur. Then, some time after that, we treated him with Flagyl, just to be on the safe side because his poo still was so wet. (this was before Megana came) The stench improved a great deal, and the consistency.

Altho his poo improved, it did not become normal until we got Megana. Then, a week or 2 after she arrived he started producing normal solid well formed poop just like her. It was the strangest thing.

I wonder if stress has something to do with it.

 

[chamlover]

I'm sure it does. The poor thing has been in captivity , well around here, for about 2 mos. Who knows what happened before he got here, then i'm assuming wasn't fed or watered properly, if at all. Then displayed at different shows and then packed away again in between shows, then packed away again until he came here. I have noticed in the last couple of days he is alot more concious of where he is. Before when i walked in the room or offered him food, he didn't make any notice of me. Now, he tries to hide when he sees me, which is a good sign, i think. I've tried to leave him alone as much as possible because of that. I did post a thread on the melleri forum about pro-biotics and never really got a response. I was wondering if i should pick some up.

I kinda thought that bringing him to the vets right now wasn't a good idea, i think he needs to get comfortable with me first and put on some more weight.

That is really strange that he didn't have good poop until you put him with a female. Figure that out! It makes me feel better though, that yours kinda had the same thing. It doesn't look like blood, although i suppose it could be. I'm so confused and worried for him right now.

And thanks, I am working really hard for him. I'm glad the guy gave him up. I think he knew he wasn't going to last more than a few more days.

Debby

 

[Chameleons Northwest]

Pro-biotics are to replace good bacteria that is destroyed when a cham is treated with an antibiotic. It replaces the bacteria and also boosts the appetite. Doesn't seem like that would apply to your guy.