A few unrelated concerning events...Help?

[Manda509]

Hello,
My 2yr old male veiled has been acting a little strange lately, there are 4 reoccurring things over the last week or week and a half, i am not sure if any of them are related.
1. Everytime cage door is open, like when im watering plants or putting a worm in he most of the time immediatly heads to escape, he is quick but i usually get the door closed before he gets there, but then he will try to climb the cage for a while afterwards, sometimes he loses the footing of his back legs and falls. I dont know if he is just not happy with the environment or what, but i have done alot to make it the optimum cham. set up.
2. Noticed today that he has a claw missing on one of the back feet, fell off? do they grow back? health reason?
3. He has not eaten in the last 5 or 6 days, usually he eats one superworm every other day.
4. 5 times now i have gone in to check on him and he is no where to be found, finally i spot him way down at the bottom of the cage under the plant stand where it is very cold and dark. Is he just temp regulating? when i pick him up he is very cold and goes back into his basking spot from my hand. What is going on with him?

Any help or suggestions on any of these issues would be great. Thanks.

 

[mychamtini112012]

Could you fill out the 'How to Ask for Help' form in the health section. Then we can better help you and see what's wrong. I'm sorry you are having troubles with him.

 

[Manda509]

Chameleon Info:

Your Chameleon - 2yr old male veiled cham. in my car for 2 months

Handling - Handling recently more, every other day, due to him trying to escape while maintaining cage. He really loves being handled though.

Feeding - Superworms right now, usually 1 every other day but hasnt eaten in 5 or 6 days. Gut-loading right now with collard greens but gut-load changes (apples, tomatoe, etc...)

Supplements - RepCal calcium w/out Phosphorous or D3 every feeding, Flukers calcium w/out phosphorous but w/ D3 every other week, multi-vitamin w/ beta-carotine every other week.

Watering - Dripper onto leaves 45 min increments 2-3 times a day & cage/cham. spray down 2-3 times a day. yes i see him drinking often.

Fecal Description - hasnt gone recently i assume to not eating recently. when he does it looks like normal cham. fecies (kinda like bird poop) I have no idea if he has been tested for parasites, i received him from a breeder so possibly?

History - He was kept in captivity strictly for breeding for his first 2 yrs of life, i dont think that they gave him a very good environment, due to the fact that he was very adverse and bad at climbing when i first got him, his nails are slightly flattened making it hard for him to grip things, i think this is due to keeping him on a flat surface with nothing to climb, but i am just speculating. Over the last 2 months he has improved greatly, we have been taking baby steps moving up the cage as to not fall far distances, he is now hardly ever having issues.

Cage Info:

Cage Type - All screen enclosure, 24X24X48

Lighting - Day: Sun Glow 100W, 16" UVB bulb & ceramic heat bulb/ Night: ceramic heat bulb & (due to winter chill) infra-red bulb for heat. 12hr/12hr lighting schedule

Temperature - Daytime temps stay between 70 and 75, basking spot at 80-85, night time 65-70 all measured with in cage thermometers

Humidity - 50-60% during day, allowing drying at night. Lowest reading first thing in morning after drying out at night 30%. Regulating humidity with spraying 3X day and drip system (also live plants) measured by hygrometer in cage

Plants - Live plants, pothos and Dracaena fragrans (corn plant) both of which are on the safe plant list on this site.

Placement - Cage is located in bedroom, not near any windows,fans, vents, etc. Top of cage right now is at 5.5ft from floor (planning on getting different base eventually)
Location - Ellensburg, WA

Current Problem - The current problem was listed in first post

 

[ataraxia]

can i see pics of his environment>?

Sounds to me one of three things.

1. If he is a skiddish as you say he is. He may be falling as a escape from you.
2. His calcium levels may be off causing the loss of motor skill. Does he show any signs of mbd? Does he shake while moving? Any limb deformities?
3. I would have to see pics...Maybe what he is given to climb on is to small, big or slick.

 

[Manda509]

can i see pics of his environment>?

Sounds to me one of three things.

1. If he is a skiddish as you say he is. He may be falling as a escape from you.
2. His calcium levels may be off causing the loss of motor skill. Does he show any signs of mbd? Does he shake while moving? Any limb deformities?
3. I would have to see pics...Maybe what he is given to climb on is to small, big or slick.

NO, he is not at all "skiddish", the times he falls i am not in the cage, it is when he is trying to climb the wall of the cage. when i am in the cage doing things he come towards me and grabs my arms, hair, scarf, anything he can, i know it sounds stupid but he really likes me.

keep in mind he is not falling alot at all, that is one of my least concerns, i am more concerned about the not eating and the weird going down to the coldest darkest part of the cage???

why do you think calcium levels are off, ive been told multiple times on this site my suppliment schedule is fine.

no he does not shake when moving or have any signs of mbd or limb diformities, i was scared of this when i first got him and he was not climbing very much and almost falling all the time, i know what mbd looks like and he doesnt have at least any visible signs of it.

 

[ataraxia]

1. Everytime cage door is open, like when im watering plants or putting a worm in he most of the time immediatly heads to escape, he is quick but i usually get the door closed before he gets there, but then he will try to climb the cage for a while afterwards, sometimes he loses the footing of his back legs and falls.

I guess i was confused

I cant see the chameleon in person to be able to give you the best judgement so i give a variety of recommendations/ideas to a particular issue. As far as calcium levels being off. Just because a supplement schedule is correct doesnt mean he is getting proper uvb. Properly functioning bulb to start and proper ways to be exposed to uvb rays. Improper/no uvb means the same for calcium intake. Have a uvb meter to test your light to be sure it is performing correctly?

Chameleons in general fall. I dont know why. Maybe practicing escape procedures in case they have to? Heck i dont know I hear mine fall from time to time. Completely normal imo.

Going to the coldest spot of the cage..You sure you have a male? You sure your temps are correct? Does he feel safe where he can bask? Im throwing ideas out.

Eating...Have you abused superworms? Meaning have you used them as a staple feeder? This will be the cause if so. If you choose to feed super worms you have to be on top of your gut load game..Read sandrachameleons or ferretsinmyshoes blogs for some great gut load tips.

Your feces description....Looks like bird poo? Is it runny?

 

[Manda509]

I guess i was confused

I cant see the chameleon in person to be able to give you the best judgement so i give a variety of recommendations to a particular issue. As far as calcium levels being off. Just because a supplement schedule is correct doesnt mean he is getting proper uvb. Properly functioning bulb to start and proper ways to be exposed to uvb rays. Improper/no uvb means the same for calcium intake. Have a uvb meter to test your light to be sure it is performing correctly?

Chameleons in general fall. I dont know why. Maybe practicing escape procedures in case they have to? Heck i dont know I hear mine fall from time to time. Completely normal imo.

Going to the coldest spot of the cage..You sure you have a male? You sure your temps are correct? Does he feel safe where he can bask? Im throwing ideas out.

Eating...Have you abused superworms? Meaning have you used them as a staple feeder? This will be the cause if so. If you choose to feed super worms you have to be on top of your gut load game..Read sandrachameleons or ferretsinmyshoes blogs for some great gut load tips.

Your feces description....Looks like bird poo? Is it runny?

I meant trying to escape the cage like coming towards me and wanting to be handled and out.

I didnt know you could test UVB levels, how would i go about doing this?
and yes i know cham. fall, he is not my first, and yes i am sure he is a male, like i said i got him from a breeder, he is 2 yrs old and gots some spurs on him.

the temps are as i said earlier, i was told this was good. how would i tell if he feels safe? he spends alot of time up there, i think both because thats the basking spot and its the highest point in the cage right now.

yeah its really wierd, he goes down to the bottom of the cage, mind you this is usually in the middle of the day, under the plant stand were it is cold and dark and sometimes he is sleeping down there, so i just pick him up and put him in his normal sleeping spot.

i suppose i have abused the superworms but it is hard to get any variety in a small town with one pet store.

 

[ataraxia]

yeah its really wierd, he goes down to the bottom of the cage, mind you this is usually in the middle of the day, under the plant stand were it is cold and dark and sometimes he is sleeping down there, so i just pick him up and put him in his normal sleeping spot.

i suppose i have abused the superworms but it is hard to get any variety in a small town with one pet store.

Sleeping during the day is typically not good sign. What brand of multivitamin? Can you describe his feces/urates better? I would love to see pics of this chameleon and cage....

We have a variety of feeder vendors that help sponsor this site. If you need any recommendations pm me.

Solar meter is a good uvb meter to test uvb. We also have a sponsor here that sells them.

 

[ataraxia]

how would i tell if he feels safe? he spends alot of time up there, i think both because thats the basking spot and its the highest point in the cage right now.

From that description. Id say he feels safe. What are his colors while basking?

 

[Manda509]

From that description. Id say he feels safe. What are his colors while basking?

usually different shades of green and his yellow spots, sometimes he goes dark but ive been told they do that alot in the morning to warm up fasting because dark colors absorb heat better. I am really worried about the not eating thing to.

 

[ataraxia]

What brand of multivitamin? Can you describe his feces/urates better?

Appetite loss from super worms can be very frustrating. Before the insect strike....if your chameleon is in good health. He can go a long time with little to no food. Make sure you he is staying hydrated and try offering a variety of other insects.

 

[laurie]

Hi, i am joining in late to the game, but here goes. If he has toe issues i would consider putting 1/4 grid plastic garden mesh inside the cage so he can get a better grip.
have you tried letting him come out of the cage for a while and sit on the sofa with you and crawl around? It might give you a better chance to observe what he is doing.
Sometimes even when we use the best supplements and in the right amounts, the cham just doesn't absorb the amount it needs. Only a blood test could tell you that.
last I would cover the area around the plant base where he hides. I agree with you that something about that sounds wrong.
We have a couple sponsors who will ship crickets to you pretty cheap, that might get him eating again.

I will keep thinking but that is all I have come up with so far.

 

[Manda509]

What brand of multivitamin? Can you describe his feces/urates better?

Appetite loss from super worms can be very frustrating. Before the insect strike....if your chameleon is in good health. He can go a long time with little to no food. Make sure you he is staying hydrated and try offering a variety of other insects.

I am not that worried yet, he seems to still be in good health and yes he drinks every day. today i actually went and got some crickets to just try even though when i first got him he didnt want anything to do with them but he ate 2 today so i think he is just sick of the super worms.

 

[Manda509]

Hi, i am joining in late to the game, but here goes. If he has toe issues i would consider putting 1/4 grid plastic garden mesh inside the cage so he can get a better grip.
have you tried letting him come out of the cage for a while and sit on the sofa with you and crawl around? It might give you a better chance to observe what he is doing.
Sometimes even when we use the best supplements and in the right amounts, the cham just doesn't absorb the amount it needs. Only a blood test could tell you that.
last I would cover the area around the plant base where he hides. I agree with you that something about that sounds wrong.
We have a couple sponsors who will ship crickets to you pretty cheap, that might get him eating again.

I will keep thinking but that is all I have come up with so far.

as far as the mesh goes i don't know if at this time i am comfortable with im being able to climb the walls and ceiling of the cage, it would be a long fall and the lights might burn his feet if he goes on the ceiling.
yes, i handle him everyother day, he loves coming out, goes right onto my hand, crawls around my bed and other plants in the window, supervised of course. Yeah i know he still might be absorbing what would be signs that i should start searching for a vet?
i think covering the area down below the plant stand would be a good idea to but it will add extra greef when cleaning out bottom of cage. I dunno what it is all about but i will definatly cover it.
and i actually got just 2 crickets from the petshop in town today to just see if him just being sick of the worms was the issue and sure enough he went straight for them so i gotta get more of those i guess.

**however, i just got a whole 50 cnt of superworms, if i just keep feeding them how long will they live?

 

[EvilLost]

are you feeding him exclusively superworms? you should be giving him a much more varied diet.


crickets or b.dubia roaches are recommended because of theri high nutrition content; superworms have great fat but are not overly nutritious as a primary diet

 

[Manda509]

are you feeding him exclusively superworms? you should be giving him a much more varied diet.


crickets or b.dubia roaches are recommended because of theri high nutrition content; superworms have great fat but are not overly nutritious as a primary diet

i know they need a varied diet, i have now added crickets and to his diet, and i will work on finding a site for other feeders, of course $ is always an issue