Xantho owners: YOU be the judge!

[JaxKiwiTiger]

I've had my girl Kiwi (Jackson) for exactly 4 months now. She may have been about 2 or 3 months when I first got her, but some might say it was a minor miracle that she's still alive since I really had no idea what I was doing! I basically bought her off the side of the road and with the help of the internet (as well as these forums), she's still alive and well. Thriving? Maybe not so much, but if you have any experience with Jacksons, please provide some feedback! Notice her slightly red gular area, as well as the base of her turrets and the sides of her belly. Some might say they're naturally that color, others might say it's reason to worry I will say this: I mist her multiple times a day (on top of her drip system), she has tons of room/shade in her cage, and she eats like a pig!

At any rate, here's a few pics I took of her yesterday, and like I said any and all feedback is more than welcome! Thanks!

 

[Tabooza]

Well I'm not expert bro but you seem to be doing good to me she looks healty, lets wait and see what the more experince member think Jax

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

Thanks Tab, tbh I feel like I spoil her, I mean on average I probably spend about an hour on her each day feeding her, misting her, re-filling the drip system, cleaning out her cage, etc. so obv. if anything ever happened to her I'd be pretty devastated

 

[raphael14]

She looks good to me.

 

[coldbloodedAL]

She looks great! Most xanths display this color when they are younger, and lose it as they get older. And some keep it as they get older(also known as red phase) although uncommon. My 9 month old male displayed the same reds until recently and is getting more and more green as time goes on. She looks very healthy to me. Jmo,
Alex

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

Wow, I didn't know that about Xanth's but definitely feeling better! I'm probably just overly paranoid, but I also have 2 male Xanth's that don't have that which led to my concern. Appreciate the feedback so far.

 

[coldbloodedAL]

Np. Xanthoman or jdog would probably be best to answer this or give a better explanation, once they see this thread you'll get an answer for sure.

 

[Tabooza]

Told you, you shouldnt have worried that much and 1hr a day that sounds about right for any pet..Good luck with her Jax

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

Yeah, Xantho and Jdog have been of great assistance so far on this thread! Just have to wait and see if they have any feedback for me

 

[Texas Panther Man]

i just sold a cb female that was about 6 mos old. She displayed alot of the dark maroons on her turrets and body. Totally normal, and in my opinion a really cool look. Yours looks great, eyes are nice and full and her limbs look straight and nice body condition not too skinny or too fat. Good job. Are you on Oahu or Maui? I friggin love hawaii, if it wasnt soo damn exp i'd love to live there.

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

Thanks for the nice feedback Texas. I'm on Oahu, and YES it's friggin' expensive! On the bright side, the weather is perfect for Jackson's, so we keep her in our backyard. Lots of sun, rain, and humidity to go around! Once in a great while I let her roam around our yard, which is how I took these pics

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

Bumping this up in case Xanthoman and/or JDog see it

 

[Solid Snake]

She looks good. Yes her colors look normal. I love how female xanths always look so happy!

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

She's definitely a lot happier out of the cage...her enclosure is 2x2x4 with a hibiscus and a pathos plant, yet she often is dark. Idk if she's stressed or what, but she lightens up when out in the open.

 

[xanthoman]

2nd time around

ok, i already gave my opinion on this on an earlier thread , but , ill give it again and try make it the condensed version.
glad to see that shes still alive, although a little troubling that she is still having the same issue, as a healthy thriving xanth wouldnt normally stay dark for extended periods.

1. i think part of this issue is that due to the fact of your location, and the circumstances she was purchased under, leading to (irregardless of what the seller claimed.) a reasonable assumption that she is either wc or from bloodlines that were wc within the last couple of generations. xanths that are wc, or from recently wc stock. sometimes have acclimation issues. they are not all the same, some deal with various issues better than others, including captivity.

2. given the likely hood of a wc history within the last generation or 2, and given the price that was paid, and given the fact that virtually all wc hawaiin chams have pathological infection, and given the fact that wc xanths are readily available for capture, by those who are for those who are so motivated, then its reasonable to assume that a fecal float should be given. heres the thing. chams dont deal well with stress, particularly over a long period. this is true of all chams, but i think maybe a little more so with xanths than some of the others.
you can probably get a fecal for <$50, if you still cant afford it try contacting the school of pathological or veterinary medicine at your local university to see if they can put you in touch with some students who might be able to help. you might also try craigslist, or see if you can find a local pathology or veterinary forum online. i know cash is tight for your situation, but, a fecal is still recommended, as you cant rule that out as part of the issue until that is performed. to be honest what she really needs is a full blood panel. ime, veterinary or pathology students have access to microscopes and supplies, and are often eager for samples obtained outside the classroom.

3. i believe in my previous post i made recommendations for denser, possibly even different cage furnishings, a better more diverse diet,
a reduction in the food given, and some changes in supplementation, yet there was no mention as to whether any of those changes were implemented (obviously at least one of them wasnt)? i dont think her condition will just change on its own, you will have to keep seeking/implementing improvements, if you want to see some improvement in her.

4. ive had xanths that would stay dark for a week or two, but the fact that she remains dark on a continuing basis is troubling, and imo, probably a warning sign of something eventually serious

5. eating like a pig is not good. particularly if its not the best diet to begin with. feeding captive xanths all they will eat, just because they will eat it, is a recipe for serious metabolic issues. jmo

ps you were looking for other feeders, cf member kami informs me that coastal silkworms has world wide shipping of silkworm eggs (read fine print before ordering) thanks kami

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

Thanks Xanth...I've actually been doing some research and found a place nearby that I could take her to. It's not so much that money's tight as it is the fact that it's likely I will need to end up spending a substantial amount on her with no guarentee that she will ultimately be 100% healthy.

But to address your suggestions, for one we've tried making her cage more dense. Her cage has definitely evolved over time, even within the most recent weeks. Her diet's become a little more diverse, but the silkworms is one thing we haven't tried yet that I intend to look into. Question though: we do have mealworms we'll feed her, but is there a big difference between those and silkworms? As far as her diet, I would say she won't overeat, but is basically a healthy eater. I'd say 4 - 6 medium sized crickets a day, a couple of mealworms, and maybe a snail here and there. It definitely seems like with more variety, she would eat even more.

I've also had a hard time finding sups, specifically the ones you suggested. Hawaii's pet shops seem somewhat limited and lacking, as most of what I found contained D3. I was able to find some multi-vites at Petco, which was almost $20.

Overall, my impression of her is that she's healthy (she moves around, fast at times, with a strong grip), and too smart for her own good (aware of the fact that she's not in her natural, free environment), which makes her vulnerable to illnesses and potentially shorten her life span.

At any rate, I'll be sure to keep you guys updated.

 

[jdog1027]

I raised a brood of xantholophus babies on tiny mealworms for the first 1-2 months and had no problems whatsoever. Some will tell you not to use mealworms as anything other than a treat which I think is wise because they aren't the most nutritionaly sound feeders, but I think the impaction thing is over stressed sometimes. In your pictures, she appears to be healthier than in the first posts you had awhile back. And on another note; I've always read that snails are a sure fire way to infect your chameleons with parasites. I personally am VERY reserved about using wildcaught anything. I know a lot of members here practice this religiously and I'm not bashing them in the least. It's just an OCD thing with me; I just don't like doing it. The only exception is my Black Soldier fly colonies, which to my understanding are unlikely to harbor parasites because of the fact that once Black Soldier flies establish themselves, they outcompete other organisms as well as the fact that they have antimicrobial/antibacterial properties about the secretions they produce. Indeed their colonies I have sustained have an odor similar to fresh cut hay despite the fact that you feed them decaying food matter. As far as the red coloration; it's normal, and it seems to be more or less a trait associated with females. I have yet to find a male xantholophus with any red that rivals that of females. They all tend to lose this unfortunately with age, becoming lighter green with time. I wish this female below would have maintained this coloration into her adulthood.

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

Thanks for posting those pics Jdog, I definitely feel a lot better now. I did some google'ing and read up a bit on "red phase" chameleons. Despite this, I will be relieved when the red coloration goes! Great to hear that it's normal, however I guess I just don't like it.

I haven't given her too many snails ever since I heard about the parasite thing. Just sucks because I want to give her variety, but the only way would be to go out and collect insects for her. It's hard to find feeders that can ship to Hawaii, so it seems inevitable.

 

[jdog1027]

Thanks for posting those pics Jdog, I definitely feel a lot better now. I did some google'ing and read up a bit on "red phase" chameleons. Despite this, I will be relieved when the red coloration goes! Great to hear that it's normal, however I guess I just don't like it.

I haven't given her too many snails ever since I heard about the parasite thing. Just sucks because I want to give her variety, but the only way would be to go out and collect insects for her. It's hard to find feeders that can ship to Hawaii, so it seems inevitable.

Well, something you may keep in mind is that chameleons in the wild harbor parasites inevitably; it's just nature. But at the same time, a parasite's goal is to live somewhat in balance with it's host. It wouldn't really make sense in nature's scheme of things for it to 'crush, kill and destroy' it's host from the get-go. They do live in balance. It becomes unbalanced when something occurs like an injury or stress, which will cause the immune system to be compromised. That's when parasites become a real danger to the host. Captivity is a stressing situation which can cause problems. Of course it's always best to have parasite free chameleons, but I understand your situation being on Hawaii it is difficult to find a variety of commercially raised insects. If you housed your Jacksons outside in Hawaii, and they have a good secure cage with plenty of foliage to feel secure so to speak, I don't think that feeding off wild insects would be that big of a factor. Just be sure they aren't exposed to pesticides.

 

[JaxKiwiTiger]

For Kiwi's sake (as well as my 2 other xanth's) I hope you're right! In my mind, everything you're saying makes a lot of sense. That being said, lowering stress is my biggest goal for her as to ensure that her immune system does not become compromised.
Not sure how realistic it would be for me to hope she just grows out of her cage stress. I hand mist as well as hand feed her every day and she has got to recognize me by now and realize how well she has it made