Supplemental Lighting question

[GreenFlinger]

Could I use a bulb like this one....http://www.wormsway.com/detail.aspx?sku=VCFB120 for growing the live vegitation in a Cham cage, and also get the needed UVB? I have never used a Reptisun 5.0 for growing plants and not sure if it will do the job. It would be great If I could keep it at 2 fixtures (basking and a UVB source).

I found Brad's care sheet very useful and I am still reading through it. I keep hearing about going bare bottom, and not to use soil, but if I use a live plant in the enclosure, should I cover the potting soil in the pot up?

Thanks in advance!

 

[ChameleonsInMyHouse]

Could I use a bulb like this one....http://www.wormsway.com/detail.aspx?sku=VCFB120 for growing the live vegitation in a Cham cage, and also get the needed UVB? I have never used a Reptisun 5.0 for growing plants and not sure if it will do the job. It would be great If I could keep it at 2 fixtures (basking and a UVB source).

I found Brad's care sheet very useful and I am still reading through it. I keep hearing about going bare bottom, and not to use soil, but if I use a live plant in the enclosure, should I cover the potting soil in the pot up?

Thanks in advance!

have never heard of that light, but what a lot of us use for better plant growth are 6500K bulbs, i'm sure grow lights work too, but an unessecary addition to extra heat makes me nervous.

you absolutely need a 5.0 UVB for your chameleon though, however, a 6500K light (equivalent to natural daylight) is up to you, but will deffinately aid to your plants growing and lasting longer.

yes, you should be covering your top soil with riverbed rocks. riverbed rocks are the way to go to assure your cham cant get to it. some species such as panthers and highly in veileds, will eat dirt at times. too much will cause impactions and fatality, and since top soil is alot thicker than a coco-husk substrate, risk is higher.

 

[GreenFlinger]

Thanks for the reply! How can I find out if certain grow lights have any UVB value? Im great at growing plants indoor and out, but until I started researching Chams I never really looked for UVB

 

[ChameleonsInMyHouse]

UVB isn't what causes plant growth. Plants need UVA (daylight) to grow, and the colour temperature (kalvin) is what you go by to determine which bulb is for what. as stated before, 6500k (kalvin) is equivalent to full daylight. not only will this aid the best and the safest way for chameleon, it is also an added bonus to regulate the chameleons awake and sleep cycles.

 

[Chris Jury]

Thanks for the reply! How can I find out if certain grow lights have any UVB value? Im great at growing plants indoor and out, but until I started researching Chams I never really looked for UVB

Only bulbs specifically designed to produce significant amounts of UVB do so and are clearly labelled as such. The bulb above looks like a great source of (relatively) full spectrum light and will help keep plants happy (and probably have some psychological benefit for the chameleon as well), but it and all other plant bulbs or other fluorescents (i.e., anything that is not clearly labelled as a bulb that produces UVB) produces essentially no UVB whatsoever. It takes specialized phosphors that are not used in normal bulbs to produce UVB, hence any bulb that is not specifically manufactured for the purpose produces totally negligible UVB.

If it were me, I'd use full-spectrum fluorescents such as this bulb to help keep the plants happy and the cage well lit in addition to the required UVB and basking bulbs. Each has a largely or totally non-overlapping purpose.

cj

p.s. As for plant growth, they absorb light for photosynthesis (via chlorophyll a and b and accessory pigments) primarily in the violet, blue (~400-500 nm) and red (~680-700 nm) regions of the visible spectrum. Chl a absorbs a bit in the UVA range (320-400 nm), and probably can put some of the near UVA energy into photosynthesis, but UVA and especially UVB also lead to photobleaching of chlorophyll and other pigments, which has a cost to the plants. Plants enact various physiological responses to deal with UV, of course, otherwise they'd be in trouble in the real world. Nonetheless, UV, especially shorter wavelength UVA and UVB don't directly benefit plants in any way, as far as I'm aware. Instead, UV induces well-known costs to plants, though these costs are pretty low at the relatively low intensity UV we typically provide in captivity.

 

[GreenFlinger]

Thank you Chris...Thats exactly what I need to know!

 

[GreenFlinger]

I just read something saying that UVB strip lights are the only UVB light source you should use, as the UVB compact bulbs are no good. Is this true? What makes the strips better than the bulbs? Light dispersal?

Also if I added an extra reptisun 5.0 bulb to my fixture (for added plant growth) would this harm the cham? I have heard its not good, but just wondering why.

 

[Chris Jury]

I just read something saying that UVB strip lights are the only UVB light source you should use, as the UVB compact bulbs are no good. Is this true? What makes the strips better than the bulbs? Light dispersal?

Also if I added an extra reptisun 5.0 bulb to my fixture (for added plant growth) would this harm the cham? I have heard its not good, but just wondering why.

There was a problem a few years ago with the formulation of the phosphors in some of the CFL bulbs that were available at the time. The wavelength range that comprises UVB is 280-315 nm and peak synthesis of vit D3 occurs upon exposure to a wavelength of 295-297 nm. All UVB has the potential to cause damage to DNA, proteins, etc., but the shorter the wavelength the more damaging the radiation tends to be.

The problem with the old bulbs is that they produced too much short wavelength UVB, in the 280-295 nm range. As a result, they caused severe eye and skin damage to many animals, and not a few deaths. This problem had nothing whatosever to do with the fact that the bulbs were CFLs, and everything to do with the particular formulation of the phosphors used to make them.

The problem has since been corrected and all recently manufactured CFL bulbs (to the best of my knowledge) should be just as safe as linear fluorescent bulbs.

Having said this, either linear or compact fluorescents can be more advantageous depending on the particular situation. Because a compact bulb is coiled, it produces a steeper gradient than a linear bulb over modest differences. As a result, it's easier to direct the UV and easier to produce higher UV intensity, which might be useful if one is trying to hit a particular spot. Alternatively, it can be useful to have a more even UV field over a larger area, granting that the peak intensity is inherently lower because the UV is more spred out (over similar distance from the bulb, of course). Both can work, if one considers the different properties of the light field each bulb creates. A linear bulb creates a more even field of modest intensity UV whereas a compact is more like a spot bulb that creates a higher peak intensity and sharper gradient.

Regardless of the bulb used, I'd ensure that the animals can bask in the UV light and their basking bulb at the same time, and that they can completely retreat away from the UV light when they want to.

As for an extra adding an extra Reptisun 5.0 bulb, again, it depends on the context. Having two bulbs instead of one will nearly double the UV intensity you get, as well as widen the light field. If the animal can easily get away from bulbs and get shelter from the UV light, I wouldn't expect a problem. If the animal cannot get adequte shelter, it may get too much UV exposure. However, this is possible regardless of how many bulbs you use.

Most of the bulbs we use, including the Reptisun 5.0, produce pretty meager UV intensity relative to what the animals get from full sun in nature, and the intensity even in the shade rivals what our bulbs produce. Passing the light through screen, which is the norm since we usually put the lights on top of the cage over screen, can further reduce the UV intensity by easily 50%. In that case, the UV intensity can often be so low it would be a good idea to use two bulbs in many situations.

The key is choices. The animal has to be able to bask in the light (an basking area that is hot+UV and one that is cool+UV is a good idea IMHO) as much as it wants, and also completely retreat from the UV and get shelter. If it can do those things, most bulbs and situations will likely work well. If it can't do those things, problems are possible regardless of which bulb or number of bulbs are used. Your setup sounds fine to me, as long as the animal has choices.

cj

 

[bigben2057]

its kelvin (K)

 

[Damus]

There was a problem a few years ago with the formulation of the phosphors in some of the CFL bulbs that were available at the time. The wavelength range that comprises UVB is 280-315 nm and peak synthesis of vit D3 occurs upon exposure to a wavelength of 295-297 nm. All UVB has the potential to cause damage to DNA, proteins, etc., but the shorter the wavelength the more damaging the radiation tends to be.

The problem with the old bulbs is that they produced too much short wavelength UVB, in the 280-295 nm range. As a result, they caused severe eye and skin damage to many animals, and not a few deaths. This problem had nothing whatosever to do with the fact that the bulbs were CFLs, and everything to do with the particular formulation of the phosphors used to make them.

The problem has since been corrected and all recently manufactured CFL bulbs (to the best of my knowledge) should be just as safe as linear fluorescent bulbs.

Having said this, either linear or compact fluorescents can be more advantageous depending on the particular situation. Because a compact bulb is coiled, it produces a steeper gradient than a linear bulb over modest differences. As a result, it's easier to direct the UV and easier to produce higher UV intensity, which might be useful if one is trying to hit a particular spot. Alternatively, it can be useful to have a more even UV field over a larger area, granting that the peak intensity is inherently lower because the UV is more spred out (over similar distance from the bulb, of course). Both can work, if one considers the different properties of the light field each bulb creates. A linear bulb creates a more even field of modest intensity UV whereas a compact is more like a spot bulb that creates a higher peak intensity and sharper gradient.

Regardless of the bulb used, I'd ensure that the animals can bask in the UV light and their basking bulb at the same time, and that they can completely retreat away from the UV light when they want to.

As for an extra adding an extra Reptisun 5.0 bulb, again, it depends on the context. Having two bulbs instead of one will nearly double the UV intensity you get, as well as widen the light field. If the animal can easily get away from bulbs and get shelter from the UV light, I wouldn't expect a problem. If the animal cannot get adequte shelter, it may get too much UV exposure. However, this is possible regardless of how many bulbs you use.

Most of the bulbs we use, including the Reptisun 5.0, produce pretty meager UV intensity relative to what the animals get from full sun in nature, and the intensity even in the shade rivals what our bulbs produce. Passing the light through screen, which is the norm since we usually put the lights on top of the cage over screen, can further reduce the UV intensity by easily 50%. In that case, the UV intensity can often be so low it would be a good idea to use two bulbs in many situations.

The key is choices. The animal has to be able to bask in the light (an basking area that is hot+UV and one that is cool+UV is a good idea IMHO) as much as it wants, and also completely retreat from the UV and get shelter. If it can do those things, most bulbs and situations will likely work well. If it can't do those things, problems are possible regardless of which bulb or number of bulbs are used. Your setup sounds fine to me, as long as the animal has choices.

cj

Great post, last paragraph is key imo. Thats pretty much what i was aiming for with the cages i recently put together for out chameleons.

 

[GreenFlinger]

Once again Chris, Thank you! If there was a way I could give rep on this forum I would def give it to you. This thread alone has helped me a great deal.