Seeking more info about the animals I care for

[hinoco1225]

Hello all,

I work at a pet store, and I got the idea to post this thread from Hoj's current thread: https://www.chameleonforums.com/new-job-pet-store-68359/. I am seeking whatever information I can find out about all the different animals I am responsible for. I have read care guides and Googled various things, but doing that is no substitute for talking to experienced owners of these animals.

Basically, I want to expand my expertise as much as possible. I know a good bit about reptiles and small furry critters, but I would still love to know more from people with experience. Birds and fish, on the other hand, are very elusive to me. I would really appreciate any info you may have about feeding, sexing, random important things to know, etc.

So here's a list of the types of animals my store carries:
-Reptiles: veiled chameleons (obviously I already know about them ), crested geckos, long-tailed lizards, Bahama anoles, pacman frogs, tree frogs, bearded dragons, leopard geckos, Chinese water dragons, kingsnakes (can't remember the subspecies), ball pythons, sand boas, rosy boas, red-eared sliders, Russian tortoises
-Birds (I'm not going to bother listing subspecies because we have so many): conures, parakeets, canaries, finches, doves, parrots
-Small furries: ferrets, chinchillas, rabbits, guinea pigs, hamsters, gerbils, rats, mice
-Fish: I know nothing about fish!! (That's not entirely true, but close.) I'm obviously not going to list all the types we have since that would take all day, but we only have freshwater fish (although quite honestly, I would love to learn about saltwater tanks too). Any info you have about fish would be greatly appreciated, no matter how general or specific.

Thanks!

 

[Psi]

It might be a lot easier to ask specific questions about what you think may be doing wrong with some of the animals in the store/etc.
This broad "tell me about everything" is just too big a topic to cover

 

[hinoco1225]

Hoj has gotten some really good info so far by asking basically the same question (like that aquatic turtles can only eat in water). I know what you mean, but I have way too many questions to list them more specifically, so I figured I just would post this and see what I get. That's the reason I listed all the animals we have - to prompt responses from people who know a lot about any of the specific animals.

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

I can answer turtle questions if you can narrow it down a little...

 

[okiroo]

long tailed grass liazzards can be housed together. never touch their taisl becuz they could fall off. i've seen them hand buy them so i guess they use them like chams. start with a 20gal and add 5gals per grass liazzard you put in. they like to run around ALOT. they need all the correct lighting. anoles are smilier in that they need all the lighting ect and a ok sized cage. would house those together tho because they can get mean. esp boys. they will fight. all little fuzzys= needs to have a safe item to chew on. a large enough cage and a dripper drinker for water. clean them alot to they dont get stink and sex correctly or you'll have alot. be careful beacuse they get get RI's easy + lose fur due to ringworm ect.

 

[ChameleonRave]

I can answer turtle questions if you can narrow it down a little...

Ditto. :3 I know quite a bit also.

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

Ditto. :3 I know quite a bit also.

I should have said land turtles and tortoises really...I'd defer to you for water turtles.

 

[ChameleonRave]

I should have said land turtles and tortoises really...I'd defer to you for water turtles.

Good thing we both are here! I'm better with semi-aquatic turtles, and tortoises. :3 TEAMWORK. xD

 

[hinoco1225]

I should have said land turtles and tortoises really...I'd defer to you for water turtles.

Good thing we both are here! I'm better with semi-aquatic turtles, and tortoises. :3 TEAMWORK. xD

Lol thanks guys. Here are the specific questions I can think of about turtles and tortoises:
-What are the proper basking and water temps for aquatic turtles?
-Proper temps for Russian tortoises?
-Are there any specific fruits/veggies/other foods that should be avoided?
-What are the effects of UVB deficiency and how soon will they start showing? (Although the herp keeper in me is appalled that I am even asking that question, the reason I ask is because I have had multiple customers tell me that turtles don't need it and they have had turtles for years without any lights and they are "fine".)

 

[hinoco1225]

I thought of more questions about aquatic turtles. What do you recommend for their diet breakdown? I know they eat turtle food, fish, fruits, veggies, some worms, etc. I just don't know how much and how frequently all of that should be offered. Is the pellet turtle food a good staple diet? Are there any brands that have plenty of calcium already, or do they need some sort of additional calcium supplementation? If so, how do you supplement an aquatic turtle when they eat in water? How often should fish/fruits/veggies be fed?

 

[hinoco1225]

long tailed grass liazzards can be housed together. never touch their taisl becuz they could fall off. i've seen them hand buy them so i guess they use them like chams. start with a 20gal and add 5gals per grass liazzard you put in. they like to run around ALOT. they need all the correct lighting. anoles are smilier in that they need all the lighting ect and a ok sized cage. would house those together tho because they can get mean. esp boys. they will fight. all little fuzzys= needs to have a safe item to chew on. a large enough cage and a dripper drinker for water. clean them alot to they dont get stink and sex correctly or you'll have alot. be careful beacuse they get get RI's easy + lose fur due to ringworm ect.

Thanks!

Do the long-taileds do better in groups, or does that matter? Is there a way to sex them easily? Are they very likely to breed if a male and female are housed together? (I am anticipating questions I'll be asked when I tell customers they can keep multiple long-tailed lizards together.)

One more question: We currently have our long-tailed lizards and anoles housed together. Is that ok? It's not really my decision, but I could certainly say something if that's not a good idea. We get them in very young so the anoles are not territorial yet (or I haven't seen any signs of it yet if they are).

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

I have had multiple customers tell me that turtles don't need UVB and they have had turtles for years without any lights and they are "fine".

Absolutely false. They may appear "fine" but they are suffering from deficiency nonetheless and it will catch up to them. Turtles and tortoises don't present with MBD the same as lizards do. They don't get bent or broken bones and it takes longer to affect them. My theory is that they need SO much calcium to build a shell that they are way more efficient at utilizing and storing it. And as herbivores their food is naturally better than an insectivore since people can't mess up food preparation as much.

What you'll see in water turtles with MBD is failure to grow. Friend's brother had an 8 year old red ear slider that was no bigger than the size of your hand (they should be the size of a dinner plate at that age) because of poor husbandry. When my friend got the turtle and put a UVB light on her she erupted into growth so fast my friend thought something was wrong with her shell - she was growing so fast that she was shedding her entire shell weekly. Then they get sick and probably die.

What you see in box turtles is a really domed or completely misshapen shell and failure to grow. Bubba Box Turtle. This happens fast in these guys and is not fixable.

Tortoises get terrible pyramiding and shell deformities and failure to grow: Toby Sulcata
I have seen many sulcatas at 10 years old that are the size of a dinner plate. My 10 year sulcata is over 80 pounds and over 3 feet across. And a sulcata presented recently was so misshapen that it's shell caved in at the back and was causing spinal compression and paralysis. Sometimes there's no room for their lungs.

You cannot fix shell abnormalities. They will be like that forever, and if they are still growing there may not be room for them in their own shell. You can't fix that.

Adults are more resistant to MBD but they still suffer from it. Their shell is already formed so they don't get shell abnormalities, but they do still suffer the effects. Saw an xray of a russion tortoise that someone had for 10 years without UVB and the xray looked like just an empty shell sitting there. No bones were visible.

Unfortunately in chelonians the effects of MBD are usually systemic illness. They stop eating, stop drinking, feel like crap and that may be the only signs in adults that people see. And even more unfortunate is that they are much harder to treat. I've seen many tortoises die from MBD. They don't bounce back like lizards do.

Other than snakes and nocturnal geckos, ALL reptiles NEED UVB. It's only a matter of time before those customers have it catch up to them.

 

[ChameleonRave]

Lol thanks guys. Here are the specific questions I can think of about turtles and tortoises:
-What are the proper basking and water temps for aquatic turtles?
-Proper temps for Russian tortoises?
-Are there any specific fruits/veggies/other foods that should be avoided?
-What are the effects of UVB deficiency and how soon will they start You will find pyramiding with the shells, also you can get shell deformitiesshowing? (Although the herp keeper in me is appalled that I am even asking that question, the reason I ask is because I have had multiple customers tell me that turtles don't need it and they have had turtles for years without any lights and they are "fine".)

Basking temps should be about 85 degrees what temps shouldn't drop below 76 degrees

For turtles or tortoises? Turtles can have Romaine Lettuce, melon (seedless), kale..

You will find pyramiding with the shells, also you can get shell deformities

 

[hinoco1225]

Absolutely false. They may appear "fine" but they are suffering from deficiency nonetheless and it will catch up to them. Turtles and tortoises don't present with MBD the same as lizards do. They don't get bent or broken bones and it takes longer to affect them. My theory is that they need SO much calcium to build a shell that they are way more efficient at utilizing and storing it. And as herbivores their food is naturally better than an insectivore since people can't mess up food preparation as much.

What you'll see in water turtles with MBD is failure to grow. Friend's brother had an 8 year old red ear slider that was no bigger than the size of your hand (they should be the size of a dinner plate at that age) because of poor husbandry. When my friend got the turtle and put a UVB light on her she erupted into growth so fast my friend thought something was wrong with her shell - she was growing so fast that she was shedding her entire shell weekly. Then they get sick and probably die.

What you see in box turtles is a really domed or completely misshapen shell and failure to grow. Bubba Box Turtle. This happens fast in these guys and is not fixable.

Tortoises get terrible pyramiding and shell deformities and failure to grow: Toby Sulcata
I have seen many sulcatas at 10 years old that are the size of a dinner plate. My 10 year sulcata is over 80 pounds and over 3 feet across. And a sulcata presented recently was so misshapen that it's shell caved in at the back and was causing spinal compression and paralysis. Sometimes there's no room for their lungs.

You cannot fix shell abnormalities. They will be like that forever, and if they are still growing there may not be room for them in their own shell. You can't fix that.

Adults are more resistant to MBD but they still suffer from it. Their shell is already formed so they don't get shell abnormalities, but they do still suffer the effects. Saw an xray of a russion tortoise that someone had for 10 years without UVB and the xray looked like just an empty shell sitting there. No bones were visible.

Unfortunately in chelonians the effects of MBD are usually systemic illness. They stop eating, stop drinking, feel like crap and that may be the only signs in adults that people see. And even more unfortunate is that they are much harder to treat. I've seen many tortoises die from MBD. They don't bounce back like lizards do.

Other than snakes and nocturnal geckos, ALL reptiles NEED UVB. It's only a matter of time before those customers have it catch up to them.

Thank you - that is exactly what I needed to know. The way I responded to those particular customers was by saying that in some retiles it takes longer to affect them, but it will. That was all I said because I didn't know anything more specific to tell them. But now I do, and I will be armed with knowledge next time somebody tries to tell me their turtle/tortoise is fine without it.

On a somewhat related note, it makes me so angry that they sell those tiny aquatic turtles at beach shops in Florida and make it out like you can just stick them in a 10 gallon with some water and they're good. I have so many customers coming in asking me about food for them, and look at me like I have two heads when I start asking about their tank size, UVB lighting, basking temperatures, etc.

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

-Proper temps for Russian tortoises?
-Are there any specific fruits/veggies/other foods that should be avoided?
-What are the effects of UVB deficiency and how soon will they start showing?

1. cool end with the temps in the low 70's and a basking spot at 90-95°F. Not desert tortoises so need at least 50% humidity.
2. Their diet veggies are the same as gutloading guidelines. So lots of dark leafy greens, grasses, minimize the fruit and avoid broccoli, spinach, ANY dog/cat food (as herbivores they will get kidney problems), etc. Russiontortoise.org is actually a good resource.
3. I think we covered that one And now you have great stories and pictures to help you make your point.
4. Don't even get me started on the water turtle tiny aquarium situation...it's infuriating that people could be so careless and inform people with blatantly wrong information just to make a quick sale. Had someone brag that their last red ear slider made it to the ripe old age of 12 and I nearly punched them in the face. Of course they had their next victim already lined up in the tiny little aquarium prison. They should make it to 50 easily...and it's pretty hard to calmly educate someone so ignorant.

 

[ChameleonRave]

1. cool end with the temps in the low 70's and a basking spot at 90-95°F. Not desert tortoises so need at least 50% humidity.
2. Their diet veggies are the same as gutloading guidelines. So lots of dark leafy greens, grasses, minimize the fruit and avoid broccoli, spinach, ANY dog/cat food (as herbivores they will get kidney problems), etc. Russiontortoise.org is actually a good resource.
3. I think we covered that one And now you have great stories and pictures to help you make your point.
4. Don't even get me started on the water turtle tiny aquarium situation...it's infuriating that people could be so careless and inform people with blatantly wrong information just to make a quick sale. Had someone brag that their last red ear slider made it to the ripe old age of 12 and I nearly punched them in the face. Of course they had their next victim already lined up in the tiny little aquarium prison. They should make it to 50 easily...and it's pretty hard to calmly educate someone so ignorant.

Like when people say "the turtle will grow to the size of the enclosure.. total bs.

 

[hinoco1225]

Like when people say "the turtle will grow to the size of the enclosure.. total bs.

Yes, I HATE that. Customers tell me that about all kind of things. I've heard that about turtles, goldfish, and even chameleons so far! It's so infuriating.

 

[ferretinmyshoes]

It's not that they grow to the size, it's that the too small size stunts their growth in an unhealthy way! Like How potbelly big breeders will actually tell people if you don't feed it very much it will stay smaller. It's called malnutrition you morons!!

 

[hinoco1225]

It's not that they grow to the size, it's that the too small size stunts their growth in an unhealthy way! Like How potbelly big breeders will actually tell people if you don't feed it very much it will stay smaller. It's called malnutrition you morons!!

Yes, exactly. It's ridiculous.

 

[lindseymeder16]

I can help you with crested geckos and leopard geckos.

Crested Gecko Care (How I take care of mine and i sent this to a friend so thats why theres info about my gecks on it)

Cresties are considered a beginner gecko. They do tolerate handleing but not all of them enjoy it.
They are nocturnal. But will sometimes come out during the day.
They need to be house in atleast a 18x18x18 (minimum) terrarium. It needs to be tall. Cresteds are aboreal. You can also house them in a tub. but it needs to be set up so it's vertical instead of horizontal. No lights are requiered. No heating pad is requiered. Both of my geckos are house in their own 18x18x24 cage and are doing amazing. Of course, the bigger the cage the better. Just not overly big. (The 18x18x24 is ideal). You can house females together but there is a chance that they won't get along. DO NOT house males together or males and females unless you want babies. They like plants and climbing decor. Humidity needs to be around 90% at night and 45-50% during the day. You need to mist the cages because cresties rarely drink out of a water bowl. They usually lick water up from leaves. Also, paper towels are recomended for substrate but if you want a more naturalistic look then you can use Peat moss or Eco earth. Generally you need 50% of the cage to be climbing stuff and hides and the other 50% open space.
Females do lay infertile clutches so males are recomended for beginners.
They need to be fed Crested Gecko Diet at all times. Once every other week you can feed them gutloaded crickets dusted with calcium. DO NOT FEED THEM BABY FOOD!!! Baby food is dangerous for them. But the Crested Gecko Diet needs to be their maine source of food. It supplys all their nutritional needs. They do need a water bowl in their cage just to be safe. Also you can pair adult cresties up in trios, like 1.2. (1 male adult and 2 female adults.) A trio would live comfortably in a 18x18x24 cage.

Leopard Gecko Care

They need at least a 20 gallon tank. Use paper towels or stone/tile as a substrate. Water bowl and food bowl. They need a heating pad, one side of the cage has to be about 95 degrees and the other side has to be 75 degrees. You need a minimum of 3 hides. One of those has to be a moist hide. and they eat bugs. That's pretty much all for them. They're extremely easy to care for. Also they dont mind handeling.