Raising young veiled chameleon question??

[rachelk]

I will be getting my young veiled chameleon some time next week and I am worried about how easily stressed young chameleons get. Is it really that hard to keep young chameleons alive? I hear different things from different people about most of the time young chameleons die. Is this true? Also, is an ambient temperature of 85 to 90 to high for a young chameleon? I feel like it is... I've read books and talked to different people about this and everyone says something different, so any suggestions would be very helpful! I don't want him to die!

Thank you!!

 

[alhickabee]

Welcome to the forums! You'll find this place to be a wealth of knowledge. Yes 85-90*F ambient temp is too high for a young cham. A basking temp in the mid 80s and an ambient temp in the high 70s is ideal for a juvenile cham.

Here's a link to the bible for veileds written by Brad on the board:
http://raisingkittytheveiledchameleon.blogspot.com/
It will answer most of your questions and where it falls short the experienced keepers here can pick up.

FYI Julirs still has a few females and maybe a male left from her last clutch of veileds. At 5 months they are extremely hardy and beautiful. I got mine from her about a month ago. Where do plan on getting yours?

 

[rachelk]

I'm getting mine from a pet store, they have one there now at their store that seems to be doing good, I would order one from a good breeder but worried about him being shipped too far. How much do you think a 5 month veiled should cost?

 

[toddmkeller]

Shipping is not an Issue. Where are you located? To be honest, pet stores are not the place to get chameleons. For a first time chameleon keeper a baby (under 3 months) is just not a good idea. Check out this link https://www.chameleonforums.com/5-month-old-female-18370/ I highly recommend that you buy from a reputable breeder and not a pet store...

hope this helps

Todd

I'm getting mine from a pet store, they have one there now at their store that seems to be doing good, I would order one from a good breeder but worried about him being shipped too far. How much do you think a 5 month veiled should cost?

 

[rachelk]

Thank you for your help! I really appreciate it!

 

[BocaJan]

Where are you located? We can make recommendations based on where you live or who we know has veileds. I know Juliars has some really nice 4-5 month old ones. If you search find her name under members you can check out her recent postings and see what she has. Others also have them. Perhaps they can PM you with their stock.

Oops, here is the thread. https://www.chameleonforums.com/5-month-old-female-18370/

 

[lilblacky]

yea i bought a 3 week old vieled as a first cham... bad idea =( poor lil guy died in 3 days, he wouldnt eat or drink at all... But i just bought a 5month old cham from Julir and he is doing GREAT! So comming from a first time cham owner I would say get an older one... it'll be a waaaaaaaay better experience.

 

[MutantHybrid]

I did get my Veiled Chameleon at a pet store and now have decided that I might have saved the little one. When I go to the pet store and tell the personnel that I need more goodies for my chameleon because she is growing so fast they look at me kind of surprised as if she should be dead by now. I got her past a minor respiratory infection (caused from being in a glass enclosure in the store) and now she is doing well so far after 5 weeks away from the store. She was only about 4-5 inches long when I got her, so I am not sure exactly how old she was at that time. I would guess about one to two months old.

I have not seen any signs of stress. She is a bit shy and does not like being handled, but almost never shows stress coloration nor gapes at me. The key would be to get the little guy used to you feeding and watering it and move slowly when near the cage. My method is to place a couple mealworms in a feeding dish and hold the dish in my hand near her. She knows my hand is holding the dish, but the lure of food is so great that her uncertainty eventually gives way to hunger and she learns not to fear me. Each chameleon will be different in temperament just like a human infant. If yours likes being held, great, if not, don't hold it unless you have to.

I would agree with the advice about finding a reputable breeder for healthy, well cared for chameleons. The pet store bought ones might be raised in glass terrariums with wood chip substrate. Both potential health concerns.

I keep my chameleon in a room that resembles a tropical setting in temperature and humidity. My room is about 75-82 degrees (night/day) and remains at about 50% humidity all the time. I have a heat lamp and several florescent UV based lights from 2.0 to 5.0 over her cage about 6 inches from her highest perch. She has window light streaming in from south facing windows as well so she can decide where to go for light and heat at will. Ambient temperature should be 75-85 degrees and basking temperatures under a heat lamp should be up to about 95 degrees with the lamp 6 or more inches from a main perch.

Just check the supplier out first and make sure the chameleon is healthy. Stress should not be a factor so long as the little lizard feels safe in a good stable environment. Too much stress from noise and movement on a continuous basis and inadequate care either before or after being brought into a home would likely be the main factors in infant chameleon death.

 

[bg77]

I had my first veiled cham at 2 to 2 1/2 months old. It was a very stressfull time. But the little guy did great. I did alot of research before hand. I also got him from a online breeder.

 

[Julirs]

MutantHybrid-your temps are way too high for a little one. Ambient of low 70's and a basking spot of 80 is good for a 2 month old. In fact I do not keep my adult males over 90-92.
Mealworms are not a good feeder-Superworms are a good feeder, as well as Silkworms. Sounds like you did rescue your little one-Petstores are notorious for selling sick chams-they are out to make a $!

 

[BocaJan]

MutantHybrid - I agree with Julie, your temps are way too high. There should be a drop in temp at night of about 10 deg from daytime ambient temps if at all possible. You should have a thermometer and hydrometer if you don't have one get one so you can monitor the temps. I have one on the basking spot of my baby. If it gets higher than about 82 I turn off the basking light. I have it sitting up off the top of the cage about 6 inches but my cages are all in front of a sliding glass door and sometimes during the day the basking lights just aren't needed for any of my chams. If I don't notice the thermometer temps I can tell because they have their mouths open. When that happens I always give them a good misting to help cool them down a bit and they usually drink like a sailor! LOL

rachelk - If you do get the cham from the pet store (I recommend Julirs juveniles) please don't take their advice about building up an enclosure. They will insist they know what to do and sell you expensive things you don't need. Read the Kitty link before you purchase anything. Good luck with your new endeavor. I know you will instantly fall in love with your new cham. They are addicting.

 

[MutantHybrid]

Julirs,

So far as temperatures, I am only providing what the chameleon seems to want. She has shaded areas to go to and moves up into the heat when she wants, which is most of the day. From what I have noticed, she is more active and alert when provided temperatures over 85 degrees in the basking point. My night time temperatures could be lower. That is something I need to work on. My region is notoriously warm even in winter.

This appears to be another area of inconsistency between breeders/keepers. One person keeps their chameleon at higher temperatures than another, one book says one thing while another book says something entirely different. I am only going with the middle ground, or average, between the higher basking point mentioned by several sources and the lower basking temperatures mentioned by others.

Ferguson, Kalisch, and McKeown (2007) indicated that ambient temperatures should be between 75-90 degrees with a basking lamp included over the cage and that Veiled Chameleons will bask in hotter temperatures even when ambient temperatures are relatively warm in the 80s.

A-1 Reptiles (2007) states to keep Veiled Chameleons at 74-78 degrees with basking temperatures up to 90.

Spiess (1997) states that Veiled Chameleons should be given basking points up to 105 degrees and that without appropriately high basking temperatures the chameleon could suffer respiratory infections. (This excerpt was actually taken from another source related to Feguson, Kalisch, and McKeown (2007)).

JE Chameleons (2008) indicates that ambient temperatures should be 75-80 degrees with basking temperatures at 95 degrees.

I just figured I would provide as varied a temperature scheme as possible so that a basking point would provide temperatures over 90 degrees with typical room temperatures between 77-82 and shaded spots in the cage. The chameleon will go where the temperature is best for her. So far as I know, young chameleons live in the same environment as the adults. Why would they need lower temperatures if their natural environment is the same as the adults? I know they have smaller body mass than adults, but they can thermoregulate just like adults.

Thanks for your input everyone. I am still trying to figure out the best overall environment for my chameleon. Difficult to do when everyone says something different.

Superworms are too large for her at this stage.

References​

A-1 Reptiles. (2007) Veiled Chameleon Care. www.a1reptiles.net.

Ferguson, G., Kalisch, K., & McKeown, S. (2007) Chameleons: Care and Breeding of Jackson's, Panther, Veiled, and Parson's (Newly Updated). Advanced Vivarium Systems, Irvine, CA.

JE Chameleons. (2008) Veiled Chameleon Caresheet (Chamaeleo calyptratus). http://www.reptileuv.com/reptile-caresheets/veiled-chameleon.php.

Spiess, P. (1997) The Veiled Chameleon (Chamaeleo calyptratus) Purchase and Captive Care (This article also found in July 1997 issue of Reptiles Magazine). http://www.kingsnake.com/rockymountain/RMHPages/RMHveiled.htm.

 

[Julirs]

Your chameleon is a baby. Babies are notoriously stupid about cookiing themselves. They love the heat and will sit there in a concentrated spot until their skin melts. There is no comparison to the real sun and a lightbulb.

 

[MutantHybrid]

Thanks Julirs,

Yes, bulbs often do emit more heat at short range than natural light would. Immature critters of all kinds ar notorious for doing things they shouldn't due to inexperience. I did set up a temperature and humidity guage directly under the heat lamp and it never reads over 95 at a point slightly higher (1inch) than the basking perch. The pothos does not suffer damage to its leaves unless it grows up right against the screening nearest the heat lamp. I will readjust the heat lamp and note any differences in her behavior. She has been set up with the heat lamp at that temperature for a month now and has not exhibited signs of burning or overheating, but safety first. If she will do well at a slightly lower temperature, all the better.

 

[OntarioLizardman]

question: what level of uvb is good for juveniles? 2.0 or 5.0 reptisun? i know 5.0 is recommended, but even for juveniles? thanks

 

[MutantHybrid]

I would think you could use a 5.0 and keep it farther away from the uppermost perch. Young chameleons have thinner skin, so absorb more UVB. I have two 2.0 and one 5.0 about 12-15 inches from all the main perches (yes they are compacts with aluminium reflectors, but I have double mesh between them and the perches and have them directly above the habitat. I intend to switch them out for a linear model soon. I have not noticed any eye conditions nor burning with my juvenile Veiled. The heat lamp I use is one of those Exo terra dual lamps that have a seperate, adjustable heat lamp in the center and a circular florescent tube in a ceramic fixture.