New Flapneck

[lisa h]

So today I ended up getting the Flapneck cham from the petstore. My husband decided he wanted to save her, so I picked her up today while he was at work. That poor thing is such a mess! S/he has some sort of yellow sores around her mouth. I thought it might be a dermal gland infection because when I saw her last week at the store it was just in one corner of her mouth. Now it's spread all the way around, so I don't know. She is very dehydrated and quite thin. When I got home I sprayed her for about 20 minutes. I used 1.5 litres of water! She drank and drank. After that I fed her some crickets, and she ate at least two. The feeders they were giving her were way too big, contrary to the instructions in their reptile room. I have a vet appt for Sunday afternoon, which is the soonest I can get for a Chameleon experienced vet. I've asked for at least a C&S and a fecal. I hope I get something good to clear up her mouth. It would be nice if the vet could sex her too, but she may be too young. She's settled in nicely, and her colours have calmed down.

I told the "reptile" person at the petstore that the only reason I was taking her was because she's dying. Not that she cared, but whatever. There's a 30 day health guarantee, and I hope she lives at least that long, and years more! I don't know how some people can sleep at night.

BTW, my husband named her Leonard, and that name will stick whether she's male or female

 

[jannb]

Congrads and my best wishs for a fast recovery.

 

[Carlton]

That poor thing is such a mess! S/he has some sort of yellow sores around her mouth. I thought it might be a dermal gland infection because when I saw her last week at the store it was just in one corner of her mouth. Now it's spread all the way around, so I don't know.

I told the "reptile" person at the petstore that the only reason I was taking her was because she's dying. Not that she cared, but whatever.

I hope you have documentation of the health guarrantee. Keep it, a copy of a good cham caresheet, and make sure the shop gets a copy of the vet report. I don't expect them to reimburse you for the vet care, but they should realize what you spent. In a sad way I hope she doesn't make it to 30 days...giving the shop a loss/refund might make them think twice about mistreating a cham again. If they fight about the refund tell them you will report them to your local BBB and animal control for improper care and neglect.

Mouth rot (stomatitis) can be a result of a direct injury or a symptom of systemic problems. It can start as a temporal gland infection and spread along the gum and jaw. The yellow is pus (often described as caseous material because it is cheese like, not liquid. Reptiles don't develop the liquid matter like mammals). If it has spread to the jawbone that is very hard to treat. It can be very painful so the cham won't want to eat or drink. A couple of things you can do until Sunday...swab her gums with diluted Betadine scrub with a Q tip. Give any feeders lots of citrus to raise their vit. C content and to acidify them slightly. Most likely the vet will need to give you a systemic antibiotic, open up and clear out any abscesses manually.

 

[lisa h]

I hope you have documentation of the health guarrantee. Keep it, a copy of a good cham caresheet, and make sure the shop gets a copy of the vet report. I don't expect them to reimburse you for the vet care, but they should realize what you spent. In a sad way I hope she doesn't make it to 30 days...giving the shop a loss/refund might make them think twice about mistreating a cham again. If they fight about the refund tell them you will report them to your local BBB and animal control for improper care and neglect.

Mouth rot (stomatitis) can be a result of a direct injury or a symptom of systemic problems. It can start as a temporal gland infection and spread along the gum and jaw. The yellow is pus (often described as caseous material because it is cheese like, not liquid. Reptiles don't develop the liquid matter like mammals). If it has spread to the jawbone that is very hard to treat. It can be very painful so the cham won't want to eat or drink. A couple of things you can do until Sunday...swab her gums with diluted Betadine scrub with a Q tip. Give any feeders lots of citrus to raise their vit. C content and to acidify them slightly. Most likely the vet will need to give you a systemic antibiotic, open up and clear out any abscesses manually.

As far as vet care, the pet store will see everything I spend. The manager will also be made aware of what's going on, and how their poor care contributed to the animal's health problems. I also talked to an employee there a couple of times and told her how they should be keeping her (I posted about that a few weeks ago), but they obviously didn't follow anything I said. For a while it looked like there was an improvement, but I guess they couldn't be bothered.

It was hard to see her dying like that, and although I was tempted to take her right from the beginning, I was trying to wait it out until she died there. My husband couldn't take it anymore, and wanted her out of there. That I can understand.

Thanks for the info re the mouth rot. I made the staff aware of the condition when I was filling out the paperwork (such that it was). I'm guessing I can get betadine scrub from a drugstore? If not I'll go to my regular vet and he'll set me up. She is eating and drinking, so hopefully the condition isn't gone too far and she can overcome this.

Thanks for your help! If I hadn't found this forum I don't think I would have attempted to help this poor creature. At least I can try.

 

[Lizardlover]

As far as vet care, the pet store will see everything I spend. The manager will also be made aware of what's going on, and how their poor care contributed to the animal's health problems. I also talked to an employee there a couple of times and told her how they should be keeping her (I posted about that a few weeks ago), but they obviously didn't follow anything I said. For a while it looked like there was an improvement, but I guess they couldn't be bothered.

It was hard to see her dying like that, and although I was tempted to take her right from the beginning, I was trying to wait it out until she died there. My husband couldn't take it anymore, and wanted her out of there. That I can understand.

Thanks for the info re the mouth rot. I made the staff aware of the condition when I was filling out the paperwork (such that it was). I'm guessing I can get betadine scrub from a drugstore? If not I'll go to my regular vet and he'll set me up. She is eating and drinking, so hopefully the condition isn't gone too far and she can overcome this.

Thanks for your help! If I hadn't found this forum I don't think I would have attempted to help this poor creature. At least I can try.

yes, you can get betadine from the drugstore, I used to mix in some honey with the betadine, ( it think 1:1) to make it a sticky paste that applied better, the honey also helps make the anitbacterial stronger.

 

[FFSTRescue]

Hi Lisa, I'm bumping this thread just to get some more info on Flapnecks. How did she end up doing? Do you still have her? If not, how long did she survive? I had one juvenile WC Flapneck that died from a respiratory infection and the second one (I have now) is being treated for URI. I think their care sheets and husbandry requirements need to be re-evaluated.
I'm curious to hear how this ended or if it hasn't...

 

[lisa h]

Sadly it ended 28 days after it started. She looked healthy enough when we first saw her in the pet store, but every week (we went to "visit" her every Friday) she looked worse and worse. I talked to the staff about things they should change, and there was even a caresheet in the back with my recommendations. The problem was that they weren't being followed. When I finally bought her I told them I was doing so only because she was dying. The store also has a 30 day guarantee, so I thought if I could pull her through the 30 days we'd be ok. She had really bad mouth rot, and we have the worst "exotic" vets here. I got really attached to that little gal (or guy), but it didn't work out. Hopefully the higher ups will see that they made no money on her, and not get any more. So far so good on that. I really enjoyed her, and if I can find a cb Flapneck I may get another in the future.

 

[FFSTRescue]

So sad . I really love that species, they have very dynamic personalities, I really enjoy them. I would love to see more WC imports last longer in captivity and become successfully acclimated, and also I would love to see CH specimen. The article on chameleonnews.com is great, I would just love to see more personal stories. Did yours ever develop what appeared to be a respiratory infection?

 

[lisa h]

Nope, no URI at all. It was all about the mouth rot. Who knows, though, if she would have lived longer. All I've seen are wc ones. Are they not lasting long enough for people to breed them, or is it because they're so cheap or not in demand that people don't bother? I wonder.

 

[FFSTRescue]

Nope, no URI at all. It was all about the mouth rot. Who knows, though, if she would have lived longer. All I've seen are wc ones. Are they not lasting long enough for people to breed them, or is it because they're so cheap or not in demand that people don't bother? I wonder.

From the ChameleonNews.com article, it sounds like a little of both...

 

[lisa h]

I can never find anything there
Which issue is it in?

 

[Chase]

I can never find anything there
Which issue is it in?

http://www.chameleonnews.com/06SepDeckers.html

Mike at FLChams had a bunch of clutches in 08 or 09, and I haven't heard anything about those that he hatched. They would be awesome to have in captivity, just getting some to hatch is the hard part.

 

[lisa h]

hmmm Interesting. I wonder, then, if the problem is the large number of subspecies, and differences in their care. Difficult to breed and cheap to get wc. I really don't want to do wc anymore. Chams are only a hobby for me, and any breedings here have been because the females were pregnant when I got them (plus pygmies). I think it's a waste of a life for me to get a wc and keep it in a cage until it dies. I'm not contributing anything positive by doing that. That's just me though. I've been feeling a lot of guilt about it lately.

 

[FFSTRescue]

I think it's a waste of a life for me to get a wc and keep it in a cage until it dies. I'm not contributing anything positive by doing that.

That's exactly how I feel, which is why I only get WC for breeding. I totally know what you mean.

 

[lisa h]

That's exactly how I feel, which is why I only get WC for breeding. I totally know what you mean.

Yes, I believe we tried to have this conversation on another thread, but were rudely interrupted LOL I hear ya. If I was breeding, it would be a different story, but I'm getting an animal that was plucked off a leaf, shipped thousands of miles, sold and resold, shipped again and again, so it can live in an enclousure in my house in Winnipeg. I personally don't feel good about it. So it goes for fish, birds, etc.

 

[FFSTRescue]

Yes, I believe we tried to have this conversation on another thread, but were rudely interrupted LOL I hear ya. If I was breeding, it would be a different story, but I'm getting an animal that was plucked off a leaf, shipped thousands of miles, sold and resold, shipped again and again, so it can live in an enclousure in my house in Winnipeg. I personally don't feel good about it. So it goes for fish, birds, etc.

Oh yes, I remember that conversation, lol

 

[lisa h]

... and I haven't heard from him since. Amen. LOL