HELP?? Veiled Cham Sleeping During Daytime

Cailynlee123

New Member
Chameleon:
7 month male veiled/yemen named Mr. Pickles. I have had him for 5 months.
Handling:
No more than once a week, unless I am cleaning his cage.
Feeding:
1/2 inch crickets, about 7 every morning, every other day I feed him 3 silk worms. I dust the crickets every feeding with Repti Calcium without D3 & I dust 2-3 times a month with Reptivite with D3. I combine 1:1 ratio Repti calcium w/o d3 and Rep-Cal Herpitive Multivitamin twice a month. (Just started the Multivitamin this month.) I gut load the crickets with zoomed natural cricket care and bug quencher. Nightly I separate about 7 crickets into a smaller container with mustard greens, an orange slice, and sliced carrots. (About 2 months ago he would eat more crickets, more than 10 a day. I have slimmed it down to 7 because recently I have noticed almost all the feeders left in the cage. He has only been eating about 2-3 crickets a day even though I offer more.)
Watering:
I mist his cage before I put in his food, then another 2 times throughout the day with warm water. I also have a closed container with water with a small hole on top the enclosure that drips periodically through the day onto leaves. I do see him drink, when he is thirsty he will go to the spot under the dripper and I will squeeze the container so a good stream of water comes out, and he will put his mouth on the leaf where the water is dripping & will drink for about 10 seconds.
Fecal Description:
He goes every morning about an hour after he starts walking around. Urates are usually white, sometimes they have a hint of yellow. His fecal is brown and usually about a little more than a half inch long & I don't see any cricket parts leftover in them. It looks like he digests his food well. He has not been tested for parasites while in my possession, I bought him from Petco & the woman told me that he was tested there.

Cage Info
Cage type: 3 ft tall by 1 1/2 foot wide screen enclosure, set on top of a dresser & is about 4 feet off the ground. I purchased his cage in a kit from Petco & it is called Zoo Med Reptibreeze Cham Kit.
Lighting: One basking light (Daylight Blue Heat Lamp) & uvb light, (Reptisun 5.0 uvb lamp.) I change the lights every 6 months. I just put in a new one yesterday. the lights come on at 9 am & go off around 7. If I see him sleeping I will turn them off then.(sometimes when I do this after I turn off the lights I see his eyes open! So it's not like he is really sleeping, just sitting there with his eyes closed.) I do not use any lights at night.
Temp:
90-85 at basking spot, 80-75 in the middle, & 70 at the very bottom. My house doesn't go under 70 degrees during the day, I live in the hot south of the U.S. At night the temps are around 65. I measure this with two digital thermometers, one at the top near the basking spot and one closer to the ground of the enclosure.
Humidity:
it ranges from 45-60%, I mist his cage 2-3 times a day with warm water. I have a humidity detector that tells me the humidity.
Plants:
I am using all fake plants as of right now.
Placement:
The cage is in my bedroom, on top of a dresser. It is about 4 feet off the ground. I do have a fan in my room but it is not pointed towards the cage.
Location: Southern U.S.A, Louisiana

Problem:
I have noticed recently that he has been falling asleep numerous times during the day. He gets more than 10 hours of sleep at night with no interruptions. (I do sleep with a tv on, but it is positioned to where no light hits his cage.) He seems healthy, he is almost always a bright shade of green & he drinks well. Lately I have noticed he has not been eating as much as he used to. A cricket will be crawling right in front of him and he will just stare at it. He also hasn't shed in over 2 months. The only conclusion I can come to is that possibly he is getting tired of crickets. I started him on silkworms a week ago and he stares at them for a few minutes then eats them. He climbs around his cage & he is active for the most part of the day.. He will crawl to a spot, chill there then close his eyes for a little while like he is sleeping. Then he will move to another spot and do the same thing! His eyes are not sunken in & he seems to be in good health.. I have read that falling asleep during the day is a sign of health problems & I am concerned for his well being. I know that I am supplementing correctly, the only problem I can think of is maybe the lights are too bright for him? Thank you, any information helps.
Please help me save my Mr. Pickles before it's too late.
I will post more pics of the enclosure but I can't figure out how to add more than one image. If someone could help me with that I can post more pics.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    74.7 KB · Views: 694
His tail looks thin and it looks like he may have MBD. Can you post a couple more recent photos of him so I can see his arms better please.
 
That picture was taken about two hours ago.. I do have a pic of him with the flash on and you can see him better. It was also taken the same time as the one I posted. I figured out how to attach the pic. Here it is
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    62 KB · Views: 487
Here is his enclosure, also-- idk if you can see it well, but if you look at my Cham you can see he is hanging his legs off the branch. He has been doing that for a few months too. He hasn't been grabbing at his arms/legs, just hanging them off.
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    109.7 KB · Views: 511
It looks like he could use more plants near the top of the cage so he can hide and feel secure. His posture could mean he's feeling exposed. Maybe a few more horizontal branches near the top as well. I have a 12-14 month old male veiled and he likes to explore A LOT. I have a fake tree near his 2'x4' enclosure so he can come out and explore even more sometimes then he goes back inside when he wants to bask, eat, or drink.
 
Sorry...can't see the photos as clearly as I would like...my playbook won't let me enlarge them enough.

If he's been hanging his legs for a long time, he's been sick for a long time. I would take it to a vet ASAP.
 
I don't know about MBD but he does look really dehydrated might give him a shower to see if he will drink. He does look real thin too I agree you should take him to see a qualified vet.
 
Thank you all for your input. Unfortantely I can't take him to the vet right now, and there isn't one near me that will specialize in chams.. He hasn't been outside, do you think if I was to move his cage outside during the day for a few hours and let him bask in real sunlight will help him? And to mist him periodically when he is outside? I don't have a plant that is big enough to put in the shower for him, is there one I can buy from home depot or some place similar? If so what is the name of it?? Do you think he would need liquid calcium? Or something like Repti-Aid? Thanks
 
If your feeding schedule above is accurate, and you are witnessing him eat, then there is something seriously wrong with the way he is digesting his food. That many insects should be more than enough for him, but he is very thin and looks as though he hasn't eaten in weeks. His bones are very straight so he doesn't have MBD in my opinion. Keep feeding a variety of well gutloaded insects and slightly increase the amount until you see him start putting weight back on. It's not as important to restrict males from over feeding as it is for females.
 
I don't understand your dusting schedule. So you are dusting with Reptivite with D3 and Herptivite?
 
About 2 months ago he would eat as many as I would give him. He has just started only eating maybe 3 crickets a day. I still continue to put 7 in there just incase he will eat them but usually I have to take about 4-5 out every night.. Maybe it's a hunger strike? I just started feeding him silkies and he seems a little more interested in those, but that still doesn't explain why he hasn't shed in a while either. My dusting schedule is Repti Calcium without D3 at every feeding, Zoo med's Reptivite with D3 twice a month, and I do a ratio of 1:1 Rep-Cal Herptivite Multivitamin w/o vitamin A with Repti Calcium without D3 twice a month also. His arms and legs don't look bowed to me, yes he does look a little on the skinny side. His eyes have been normal until about 2 weeks ago when I noticed they were slightly sunken in. I would love to give him showers but I don't have a plant that is big enough to put in the shower that isn't fake. What also concerns me is that his casque is still small.. I'm willing to do practically anything to get his health back up.
 
Well first off you are doing waaaay too much vitamins. I would just stick to either the herptivite without the calcium twice a month or the Reptivite twice a month. However if you only give herptivite you would have to start giving a calcium with D3 added to it. A vitamin imbalance could cause some of these issues. I am not sure which ones, but the yellow in his urate would be a sign of a vitamin imbalance most likely. I would start adding more feeder types, such as hornworms, maybe flies, some roaches. There are more types but that's at least a start.

There is nothing wrong with using fake plants in the showers, unless you don't think it'll stand up to it?
 
Okay. I just started the multivitamin because I was told that this problem was caused by not giving a multivitamin. So continue to use without d3 every feeding & do with d3 twice a month right? And do you think it would be beneficial to his health if I put his cage outside like 4 days out of the week for a few hours? I'll put him in the shower today with a smaller fake plant I have, I'm pretty sure it will be sturdy enough. I'll stay by him the whole time. Should I do the multivitamin like once every 2 or 3 months just so he can have the multivitamin in his system? I currently have some silkies that I'm going to let cocoon and turn into moths so he will be having those in about a month. I will get some hornworms also. Thank you so much for your help
 
Well Reptivite is actually a multivitamin if it actually is reptivite. So just continue doing it twice a month and the calcium without D3 every other feeding. The extra time in the sunshine will help a lot most likely, I would definitely do if you could.
 
I see on the Reptivite bottle that it says reptile vitamins. So there's no need for the multivitamin bc it's basically the same thing right? And yes he will start going outside. If he is outside at least 3 days of the week for about 4-5 hours at a time should I only dust his food with d3 once a month?
 
Yes Reptivite is a multivitamin. You should dust with it once every two weeks, and dust with calcium with D3 once every two weeks, and without D3 every other time. Make sure to stagger the calcium+D3, and the Reptivite don't give both to him at the same time assuming you have the Reptivite with D3.
 
Last edited:
The Reptivite multivitamin I have says it has D3 in it. So the same schedule you just told me, Brownie64, would still apply right? I think Pickles is going on a hunger strike against crickets because this morning I put some crickets in his cage and he didn't touch any when they were right in front of his face, but when I put a few silkies in he ate them right up. Would you suggest get some Dubia roaches and trying those? (I am deathly afraid of roaches, lol, but will try them for pickles.. Unless there is a good alternative other than crickets or roaches.) do you have any suggestions on why he hasn't shed in about 2 months either? Possibly because he hasn't been eating as much so he isn't growing? Thank you for your input and help!! I really appreciate it. Also- I have been wanting to get a plant that is tall enough so I can put it next to the cage and he can crawl out when he wants to and free roam. Would a fake plant be okay? Or do you suggest a real one? I know if I got a real one it would take at least a few months for it to be sturdy enough for him and for it to grow.
 
The Reptivite multivitamin I have says it has D3 in it. So the same schedule you just told me, Brownie64, would still apply right? I think Pickles is going on a hunger strike against crickets because this morning I put some crickets in his cage and he didn't touch any when they were right in front of his face, but when I put a few silkies in he ate them right up. Would you suggest get some Dubia roaches and trying those? (I am deathly afraid of roaches, lol, but will try them for pickles.. Unless there is a good alternative other than crickets or roaches.) do you have any suggestions on why he hasn't shed in about 2 months either? Possibly because he hasn't been eating as much so he isn't growing? Thank you for your input and help!! I really appreciate it. Also- I have been wanting to get a plant that is tall enough so I can put it next to the cage and he can crawl out when he wants to and free roam. Would a fake plant be okay? Or do you suggest a real one? I know if I got a real one it would take at least a few months for it to be sturdy enough for him and for it to grow.

Yes the schedule I gave you will work just fine. I would try Dubias, and what ever else he will eat you need to get him fattened up. You might give him some bee moths (that's what I call them) for just a while to help fatten him up. I think everyone else calls them wax worms. Not really good for a staple do to the fat but would work well to fatten him back up. If he is eating the silk worms give them to him it will help rehydrate him. Him not shedding could very well be to him not growing, The shower should help with the shedding as well. Yes I don't see why a fake Ficus or something like that wouldn't work for you much easer than trying to keep a live one alive " Suffice it to say I don't have a green thumb":)
 
Last edited:
Back
Top Bottom