Female veiled at bottom of cage. Too early to lay eggs

[laubbie]

My female veiled, Kip is a little over a year old now. She has laid 2 unfertilized clutches both with 50-60 eggs. Her last one was about 67 days ago so I feel it is too early for her to be ready to lay again. However, she has been dwelling at the bottom of her cage the last 4 days. She perks up when there are crickets in there and she'll eat them and wax & meal worms when offered. She just won't move much. She seems alert but doesn't seem at ease. Since her last clutch, she doesn't let me get close to her, but today she let me handle her. Right now she is in the dirt of the egg laying bin which is a 10 in planter with a hope leaf plant in it. She has a screened cage and gets misted every 3 hours. She also has a Biobubble drinking fountain but she hasn't been able to access that since she's on the ground. Does it sound like she is sick or just ready to lay again? I've been out of town the past week and my roommate has been taking care of her so I wanted to get some advice before trying to take her to the vet as I'm sure it will be expensive. I dust her crickets with calcium powder weekly and sometimes she'll eat crickets in the wild when I take her outside. She stays in her enclosure when outside but she did eat a rather large katydid the other week. I'm hoping that has nothing to do with it, but just wanted to mention it. Thanks everyone who read this, I'm worried about her :/

 

[Brodybreaux25]

Respectfully, why is there something planted in her lay bin? They’d not what it’s for. Was it in there the last two times she laid?

I believe she could easily have another clutch to lay already, hard to tell without pics.

And if she isn’t ready to lay again, she is probably sick from drinking out of that fountain. Fountains in vivs are biological time bombs and should be removed immediately.

 

[laubbie]

Thank you for the reply. Yes, it was in there the last times. I read that made the chameleon feel more comfortable with the bin. There's more dirt/vermiculite than plant if that makes sense. Also, I clean the fountain and replace the carbon filters so I hope that's not the reason.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

Thank you for the reply. Yes, it was in there the last times. I read that made the chameleon feel more comfortable with the bin. There's more dirt/vermiculite than plant if that makes sense. Also, I clean the fountain and replace the carbon filters so I hope that's not the reason.

I’d remove the plant from the bin, but that’s me. And the carbon filter has zero effect on the bacteria in the water, which is the main concern with them. The dangers of these fountains was discussed in depth earlier today, still is as a matter of fact. I highly suggest you read through it, it can only benefit you. Just search for DIY Fountain.

 

[laubbie]

This was my first time to post so I didn't get the memo about all the details to include - sorry about that. Let me add some details:

Chameleon Info:

• Your Chameleon - female veiled, 1 year & 2 months old. I purchased her in Aug 2017
• Handling - I do not handle her often, only when necessary, perhaps 4x/month.
• Feeding - In the mornings, she eats 4-6 crickets or 1 large dubia roach. I will feed her a couple of waxworms or mealworms at night. The crickets and roaches gut load with various foods such as apples, papaya, alfalfa, romaine lettuce, dandelion greens, and carrots.
• Supplements - I dust the crickets weekly with Rep-Cal Calcium (w Vit D) weekly. The pet store will dust them too sometimes as a courtesy.
• Watering - What kind of watering technique do you use? How often and how long to you mist? Do you see your chameleon drinking? I mist her and her cage 3-5x/day manually with an Exo Terra mister. It has a pump so the misting session can last up to 10 seconds or longer. I also have a biobubble fountain that circulates water (so that it is moving) and has a carbon filtering pad. I clean it on a weekly basis.
• Fecal Description - Dark brown, moist - not dry, not watery. Urate is white. She typically defecates once a week. There have been two instances in the past, one when I had been out of town where the urate had orange in it. Kip has never been tested for parasites.
• History - She is due to lay a 3rd clutch of unfertilized eggs soon. She last laid eggs 72 days ago. Her second lay was about 90 days from her first.

Cage Info:

• Cage Type - Reptibreeze screen cage. Size medium: 16 x 16 x 30in, I clean it weekly.
• Lighting - Zoo Med Powersun UV bulb 100w (provides UVB, UVA & heat). It is screwed into a Fluker's mini sun dome lamp. Light is on 12 hrs/day.
• Temperature - It is more or less 80 degrees F during the day and about 70-75 degrees at night. I use the room thermometer to gauge temp.
• Humidity - I don't have a humidity meter but I keep a humidifier on for a long time during the day. I have live plants too in the cage and throughout the room.
• Plants - I have had a variety in the past - hibiscus, bromeliad, hobbit plant succulent, however those didn't do well in non direct sunlight. So now I have a pothos and split leaf plant in there.
• Placement - The cage is nestled in the corner in a carpeted room. Ceiling is low and there is a ceiling fan in the middle of the room, but not close to any vents. We don't have air conditioning. There is 1 south facing window about 8 ft from her cage. The top of her cage is a little over 6 ft off the ground.
• Location - Denver, Colorado. I was in Birmingham, AL with her previously for 4 months when I first got her. It's definitely more arid here than there.

Update since last post: Kip is still on the ground. Her colors look like she is about to lay - bright green with vibrant yellows and blues. I can feel the eggs too when I touch her sides. However I am concerned that she has been hanging on the ground for 9 days now. She is getting closer to when she would lay but she hasn't tried to dig at all. I don't usually handle her but since she has not been climbing, I have been handling her to let her bask outside in natural sunlight and put her in a plant in the bathroom to give her steam shower. I haven't seen her drink when I mist her so have been doing the steam showers this week. I also took out the fountain even though it's too high for her to access right now anyway. She hasn't eaten since yesterday which I know is a sign of getting closer to laying eggs but all things considered, I am worried it means she is sick. Her eyes are not sunken, she looks alert and hydrated with vibrant colors. After a steam shower, she slept upside down in a hanging plant the other night and fell while she was sleeping which makes me worried that she has MBD or a parasite I heard it when it happened so was able to get her situated in a better sleeping spot. It wasn't a far fall and was a soft landing but it still was sad. She has only fallen once that I know of. I have given her liquid calcium and a water/pedialyte bath a couple of times this week too. Every time she has laid eggs so far, I have gotten worried that she was sick; however, this time feels different because of the fall and the amount of time she has been on the ground. Any other thoughts before I take her to the vet? I am sorry for the novel, I am just worried about her.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

The reason she hasn’t laid in the past 9 days is probably because you keep inturupting her. You are supposed to have as little contact with her as you can when she is ready to lay.

Have you covered her enclosure?

Never give a chameleon a “bath.”

 

[laubbie]

The reason she hasn’t laid in the past 9 days is probably because you keep inturupting her. You are supposed to have as little contact with her as you can when she is ready to lay.

Have you covered her enclosure?

Never give a chameleon a “bath.”

Are you implying that I should ignore the fact that her legs do not seem to be functioning properly and that she is not able to climb or hang? I was not in town 6 of the days she has been on the ground so the only interruption then was being fed once a day and being misted several times a day by my roommate. If her legs aren't functioning properly then she wouldn't be able to dig, Brody. She fell while she was sleeping and doesn't seem able to support herself on her legs. That is what I am so concerned about. This isn't the first time she has laid eggs and I keep a notebook on her general behavior so this is different than the other times. I appreciate your input, and I know tone is hard to read on an internet forum from someone you don't know, but it feels that in every response, you are criticizing everything but not addressing the main concern.

Also, I did not put her in a bath where she was left to swim freely. She was in my hand the whole time with her bottom half submerged in water. I added some unflavored pedialyte because I read that was a good way to let them get electrolytes and nutrients if they weren't eating/drinking which she isn't. But if you feel that the limbs issue is not a concern, and that she is merely ready to lay eggs, then I will take that into advisement.

 

[Brodybreaux25]

I do have a very straight to the point style and I apologize if I was being rude. Improperly functioning legs, like lack of grip, is a symptom of being egg bound. Being egg bound is a result of no privacy/interruptions to the laying process.

You are the one that said that you have been moving her from cage to plant to inside and out , giving her steam showers and baths. To me that sounds like a lot of inturuptions. Regaurdless of what I think if her legs aren’t working and she needs to lay no one one the internet can help her, only the vet. I’m going to leave you alone now, I hope it works out.