Chameleon passed away; looking for answers

[Several Zombies]

Hello,

I'm sad to say that I've joined the forum because my chameleon of about a year and a half has died. I'm just looking for some answers as to what might have caused his demise, and to see if any of you have perhaps experienced similar illnesses with your chams.

The chameleon in question was a piebald male Veiled. After getting him from the local pet shop, I took him to the vet to make sure he was healthy and free of worms. Once he had a clean bill of health, I took him home and went about setting up his enclosure. It was a tall, mesh enclosure with a large, fake hibiscus tree in the center, with many vines tied around the branches and trunk to give him something to climb on. There was no substrate, just a plastic tray to catch any droppings. The light was a Exo-terra MVB, 125W if I recall correctly -- temperatures were about 80-85 up near the lamp. Basically, his enclosure was safe and functional. In terms of feeders, he ate mostly gutloaded crickets dusted with calcium in addition to a few butterworms here and there as a treat.

For the first little while he seemed fine, but a few months down the road he started having issues with his eyes, constantly keeping his left eye closed. Immediately, I suspected the MVB and replaced it. Still, I took him to the vet and she said she didn't know what was causing him to close his eye, as it didn't appear to be any kind of ailment related to improper UVB. After flushing it with saline, he seemed to improve only to get even worse about a month later. A large, boil-like growth appeared on his head above his left eye, as well as a significant patch of swelling on the eyelid itself. Al the pressure seemed to be pushing his actual eyeball downward, to the point where he couldn't see out of it at all. Despite many expensive trips to the vet, she had no idea what was causing the growth. She was reluctant to perform a biopsy in case the eye itself was the bump, and had been displaced. After a few weeks like this, his right, healthy eye began failing too. Both eyes at this point were producing a clear discharge, leading me (and my vet) to believe it may be some sort of infection. A month or so on antibiotics with no improvement discounted that theory. By this point, I was reasonably sure he'd lost all sight in his left eye due to the sheer amount of time it had been closed, but his right could still be saved. After doing some research, my vet suggested that it could be a vitamin A deficiency, as the calcium/vitamin supplements available for most reptiles are actually ineffective for Veiled Chameleons (they cant absorb it the same way). A few doses of vitamin A later and he seemed to be improving, though we were careful to monitor him as the doses can be tough on their system. Both his eyes were now open and appeared to be functioning, though he still couldn't see well enough to hunt. Eventually, due to his inability to actually catch prey, I had to start feeding him a liquid diet (carnivore care). Despite this, he didn't seem to be gaining any weight and appeared constantly dehydrated despite the copious amount of fluids he was getting. Still, he seemed on the track to recovery, until this morning. When I went in to check on him, he seemed very weak and was a pale yellow-green color. Throughout the morning he fell from his vines twice. I took him out of his cage and gave him his food and water, as well as a steam which seemed to help him. About an hour later when I looked in on him again, he was slumped over on his side, mostly black in color, and not breathing. He had died.

Right now I'm just looking for some answers as to what might have done him in. My vet seems largely clueless and I haven't been able to find any information on chams with similar problems. Hopefully the community can come to my aid.

 

[Carlton]

It was a tall, mesh enclosure with a large, fake hibiscus tree in the center, with many vines tied around the branches and trunk to give him something to climb on.Basically, his enclosure was safe and functional. In terms of feeders, he ate mostly gutloaded crickets dusted with calcium in addition to a few butterworms here and there as a treat.

For the first little while he seemed fine, but a few months down the road he started having issues with his eyes, constantly keeping his left eye closed. After flushing it with saline, he seemed to improve only to get even worse about a month later. A large, boil-like growth appeared on his head above his left eye, as well as a significant patch of swelling on the eyelid itself. Al the pressure seemed to be pushing his actual eyeball downward, to the point where he couldn't see out of it at all. Despite many expensive trips to the vet, she had no idea what was causing the growth. She was reluctant to perform a biopsy in case the eye itself was the bump, and had been displaced. After a few weeks like this, his right, healthy eye began failing too. Both eyes at this point were producing a clear discharge, leading me (and my vet) to believe it may be some sort of infection. A month or so on antibiotics with no improvement discounted that theory. By this point, I was reasonably sure he'd lost all sight in his left eye due to the sheer amount of time it had been closed, but his right could still be saved. After doing some research, my vet suggested that it could be a vitamin A deficiency, as the calcium/vitamin supplements available for most reptiles are actually ineffective for Veiled Chameleons (they cant absorb it the same way). A few doses of vitamin A later and he seemed to be improving, though we were careful to monitor him as the doses can be tough on their system. Both his eyes were now open and appeared to be functioning, though he still couldn't see well enough to hunt. Eventually, due to his inability to actually catch prey, I had to start feeding him a liquid diet (carnivore care). Despite this, he didn't seem to be gaining any weight and appeared constantly dehydrated despite the copious amount of fluids he was getting. Still, he seemed on the track to recovery, until this morning. When I went in to check on him, he seemed very weak and was a pale yellow-green color. Throughout the morning he fell from his vines twice. I took him out of his cage and gave him his food and water, as well as a steam which seemed to help him. About an hour later when I looked in on him again, he was slumped over on his side, mostly black in color, and not breathing. He had died.

Right now I'm just looking for some answers as to what might have done him in. My vet seems largely clueless and I haven't been able to find any information on chams with similar problems. Hopefully the community can come to my aid.

Sorry you lost him! That being said, I can give a couple of theories about what happened, but we'll never know for certain without a necropsy.

First, what was the cage humidity level from dry to wet? Without live foliage it is difficult to maintain higher levels of relative humidity and you don't give any info about how you measured it. It is one of the major reasons chams start closing an eye for longer periods...irritation. Even if he's drinking a lot, dry air will irritate his eyes, and chams can get dehydrated between misting cycles if your house and local climate is dry. A chronically irritated eye will be more vulnerable to infection. Possibly he injured his eye. You mentioned that he improved a little when you rinsed his eyes with saline. Just a theory remember.

The swellings etc. do sound like a long standing infection, but there is an aspect of herp infections that may not have been dealt with. Systemic antibiotics don't always have an effect on abscesses in herps used on their own, as the abscess itself sort of isolates the infectious material and it does not break down like the liquid types found in mammals. Abscesses need to be opened and cleared out in addition to treatment with a systemic med. Often abscesses get their start in a cham's mouth or nasal passages where it could have been missed initially. It could also be that the specific bacteria causing the infection was not sensitive to the med being used. Or, because it was never cleared completely it became resistant...and kept spreading. There are some infections in chams that don't seem to respond to available meds too.

I've never heard that veileds metabolize vit A differently than other chams. It is a tricky vit to manage and best done through careful gutloading and a very occasional added dose through dusting. He could have had a low grade deficiency for a long time. What did you feed your feeders and what was your dusting schedule and products?

 

[Several Zombies]

Dusting was done every other feeding. As for the comment about metabolization of vitamin A, my local vet said she had read a study about chameleons being unable to absorb beta carotene (the "vitamin A" portion of most commercial supplements.)

Whether or not this is the case, I can't really say. After having subcutaneous injections of vitamin A he did seem to improve.

As for the humidity, it was fairly low. Being a screen mesh cage it didn't retain moisture too well, although the documentation I had read lead me to believe Veiled chameleons would do better in a less-moist environment and actually recommended the open-air enclosure. Nonetheless, I still took humidity readings (the thermometer I had was also equipped with a hydrometer), though they were consistently low. He did receive regular misting as well as plenty of water via a drip system, and later a syringe.

As for the bump being an abscess, I suppose it's entirely possible. I'll never know without a necropsy and I'm not sure it's worth paying for at this point. The notion that the bulge might be a tumour was also brought up by my vet, and seems just as likely considering his rapid deterioration.

I'm pretty torn over the whole ordeal. This is my second cham that I've lost. The first female became eggbound and couldn't be saved even with surgical intervention. This MALE cham, I hoped, would be devoid of any such health issues. It seems I was wrong.

I think I'm pretty much done with chameleons. It seems like no matter how much effort I put into proper husbandry, I always end up with the sick ones