Water Feature; Safe or Not?

Hello all... I am (obviously) new to the forum. This will be my second round of Chameleon parenting. I previously had a pair of Jackson's but have been out of the "parenting" mode for 15+ years now. Looking to get back into owning one (I know, it starts with just one).

I'm in the stages of designing/building a large cage to house my future cham. One thing I was thinking about was adding a 'water feature' to a bottom corner of the cage; something maybe large enough for a couple small fish (like a swamp). May even add a small waterfall effect into the "swamp". Is this safe for the chameleon? I hear of waterborne disease so the idea of the chameleon possibly drinking from it raises a "should I do this" flag in my mind. Do I need to worry about it falling in/drowning?

Another worry I have is stress to the Panther possibly caused by a bird being housed in the same room; maybe! I might keep the cage in my office BUT if I do place it in the bedroom, my Macaw lives in there too. The Macaw wouldn't come in contact with the Panther cage BUT it would be in view of it.

Any thoughts into these types of situations are much appreciated from those who have FAR greater experience than myself.

Welcome to the forum!

The water feature will become a source of contamination from the poop of the chameleon, all around, a risky feature to have. You want to be able to clean the floor quickly, and not build an environment that bacteria can grow.

The large bird will create stress for your chameleon.

Keep reading, use the Search feature and you will have hours of pictures and tutorials on chameleon enclosures.

CHEERS!

Nick

Nick,

Thanks for the input. I've been doing as much reading as I can fit in around work ... or vice-versa

I had some suspicions about using a combo pond & chameleon cage. Could have ... would have ... looked cool.

Last time I used a store bought cage that was about 2x2x4 & worked. This time, I want to build a custom cage as noted. I have an alternative location in the house (different room) than the bird. I suspected that the Panther might be a little scared looking at the Macaw all day from across the room.

As I look thru the hundreds of various cage pictures on here, I see that most are all screen or wire. Is there an objection to having one or two wall(s) of it Plexi (such as the front/back)? I would assume, the more ventilation, the better hence the screen.

Thanks again!

Bill

Bill,
Chameleons are being raised successfully in completely enclosed vivariums, particularly in Europe, US keepers favor screen. That being said, one to 2 sides being solid would still give adequate air flow.

Check out Dragon Strand under sponsors in the top right corner, Bill offers any combination of sides you want.

CHEERS!

Nick

Mr Gizmo said:

Nick,

Thanks for the input. I've been doing as much reading as I can fit in around work ... or vice-versa

I had some suspicions about using a combo pond & chameleon cage. Could have ... would have ... looked cool.

Last time I used a store bought cage that was about 2x2x4 & worked. This time, I want to build a custom cage as noted. I have an alternative location in the house (different room) than the bird. I suspected that the Panther might be a little scared looking at the Macaw all day from across the room.

As I look thru the hundreds of various cage pictures on here, I see that most are all screen or wire. Is there an objection to having one or two wall(s) of it Plexi (such as the front/back)? I would assume, the more ventilation, the better hence the screen.

Thanks again!

Bill

Click to expand...

Plexi panels can help keep humidity levels higher when the house climate is dryer (during winter heating or summer AC use). They can hold in a little more heat if the room is cooler. One thing to watch is whether your cham starts displaying to his reflection in the glass. Not all chams do it, but if the light angle is just right it can happen. It can create a constant stressor. Also, some chams paw at the glass trying to get past it out into the room. Again, not all chams do this. I really like screen cages, but I also make removable plexi panels that I can attach over the screen sides when necessary and remove them when its not.

I really want to do some sort of fish pond or swamp like setting at the bottom of my enclosure, my chameleon rarely goes down there so I wouldn't assume its bad for him, but if he did he could be exposed to bacteria and such that would be harmful to him. I have also seen people who run ecosystem setups successfully, my mother for one even. Just it's a definite risk you take doing so.

All great information! I like the concept of screen with interchangeability to plexi panels for different seasons or possible stress levels to the cham. I think I'll design in that direction.

Looking forward to locking in my design concepts so I can get into the woodshop to start cutting ... hopefully this weekend

bakednowningz said:

I really want to do some sort of fish pond or swamp like setting at the bottom of my enclosure, my chameleon rarely goes down there so I wouldn't assume its bad for him, but if he did he could be exposed to bacteria and such that would be harmful to him. I have also seen people who run ecosystem setups successfully, my mother for one even. Just it's a definite risk you take doing so.

Click to expand...

I think a setup with a water feature might work if its a very large area (like a free range greenhouse or a room) with a lot of separation between the cham's living space and the water area. The water area would have to be filtered very very well, and have log or branch structures so a cham could rescue itself if it did fall in. All the issues with cross contamination, molds, bacteria, dead and dying loose feeders could be dealt with, but not very easily in the typical cham cage setup.

Mr Gizmo said:

All great information! I like the concept of screen with interchangeability to plexi panels for different seasons or possible stress levels to the cham. I think I'll design in that direction.

Click to expand...

Yes, it works really well. I've used that particular cage for all sorts of other species too over the years. The plexi panels are attached to the frame of the cage with simple storm window toggles screwed into the frame. You could go even more low-tech by making simple wood toggles.

Carlton said:

I think a setup with a water feature might work if its a very large area (like a free range greenhouse or a room) with a lot of separation between the cham's living space and the water area. The water area would have to be filtered very very well, and have log or branch structures so a cham could rescue itself if it did fall in. All the issues with cross contamination, molds, bacteria, dead and dying loose feeders could be dealt with, but not very easily in the typical cham cage setup.

Click to expand...

You always have the best input Carlton <3

bakednowningz said:

You always have the best input Carlton <3

Click to expand...

Well, thanks! Its the result of long sometimes bizarre or bad trial and error!

This is my chameleon vivarium it's mesh as they need it for the ventilation. Is this the right height, I think I need a bigger on as he is quite big now!

It 1 m height ways

However, I am also thinking of adding a medium sized waterfall in back right of the cage not sure

Leon the chameleon said:

However, I am also thinking of adding a medium sized waterfall in back right of the cage not sure

Click to expand...

1 meter tall is pretty minimal. I would provide at least 4 vertical feet. The waterfall would be a headache to keep clean, especially if its placed in the back of the cage where its hard to reach. I would not do this unless you don't mind rearranging your cage every day just to clean out the waterfall. If its not easy to do you won't clean it that often, and that may end up causing health problems for your cham. Not worth the risk!

I've got an 8' x 4' enclosure that sits on top of a 70 gallon freshwater aquarium. The upper portion houses 20 green anoles, the aquarium houses African butterfly fish that eat any crickets/feeders that fall in, and plenty of Amano shrimp. There are dozens of sticks and vines hanging in the water for the anoles to climb out if they happen to go for a swim. Of any enclosure I've ever had, this one is the easiest to maintain. It is very well filtered however and has all the proper bacteria and organisms that breakdown waste and keep the water clean. This is really the only way to have a water feature in my opinion. It's so large that it CAN'T get dirty. Pic below

oneillchameleons said:

I've got an 8' x 4' enclosure that sits on top of a 70 gallon freshwater aquarium. The upper portion houses 20 green anoles, the aquarium houses African butterfly fish that eat any crickets/feeders that fall in, and plenty of Amano shrimp. There are dozens of sticks and vines hanging in the water for the anoles to climb out if they happen to go for a swim. Of any enclosure I've ever had, this one is the easiest to maintain. It is very well filtered however and has all the proper bacteria and organisms that breakdown waste and keep the water clean. This is really the only way to have a water feature in my opinion. It's so large that it CAN'T get dirty. Pic below

Click to expand...

Anoles are another type of lizard, right? I still think this would be risky for a chameleon from what I've read, I think they are more sensitive and get sick easier but I'm no expert

HerbertHancock said:

Anoles are another type of lizard, right? I still think this would be risky for a chameleon from what I've read, I think they are more sensitive and get sick easier but I'm no expert

Click to expand...

They are not necessarily more sensitive or more likely to get sick than other lizards, they just need to be kept in the proper conditions. Force any animal too far out of what they are adapted to handle and they'll be sensitive.

I wouldn't trust a chameleon in this setup, no. They may do fine but I wouldn't want to risk it as they aren't really adept at swimming. Anoles however have no trouble in water and in the wild they'll readily use water as an escape route from predators. The main reason that anoles are considered more sensitive is that the vast majority of them are wild caught, transported in terrible condition, and full of parasites. I special ordered mine to avoid the chain stores/middle men, and gave ALL of them parasite medication when they arrived. I do the same with any imported fish I get as well. Just wanted to stress the fact that water features are a pain unless they are well filtered and large enough to avoid contamination.