Refrigerate mealworms and waxworms?
- Thread starter BayChams
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wodesorel
Established Member
I know it's a big no on the waxworms. Cooler temps keep them from growing too fast, but too cold and they end up dying. I have the extras around 60 degrees to slow their growth which is what I've seen recommended and the ones I've been feeding off are in my 80 degree critter room and doing great. The ones I've seen for sale refrigerated are always dead.
I've always kept my mealworms in my critter room as a colony, but they do pupate fast if you're buying adults from the pet store. I don't know if they can be refrigerated or not.
I've always kept my mealworms in my critter room as a colony, but they do pupate fast if you're buying adults from the pet store. I don't know if they can be refrigerated or not.
MissLissa
Avid Member
You can refrigerate mealworms, but they will not be gutloaded as they will not eat once refrigerated. Keep them either in the door or in the crisper area, as these tend to be slightly warmer than the other areas of your fridge. If you do refrigerate them, you should pull out what you need for the next day, let them slowly come to room temperature, and feed them a healthy wet and dry gutload for 24 hours before offering them as a feeder to your herps. Feeding cold food is a no-no for reptiles. Mealworms should not be fed to chams as more than an occasional treat, anyways.
Waxworms should never be kept in a fridge; it is too cold in there and they will likely die. If you keep your waxworms warm enough they may pupate, and many chams actually prefer the fluttery waxworm moths to the waxworms in any case!
Waxworms should never be kept in a fridge; it is too cold in there and they will likely die. If you keep your waxworms warm enough they may pupate, and many chams actually prefer the fluttery waxworm moths to the waxworms in any case!
ChameLIonLover
Member
I used to keep my mealworms in the fridge... I'd advise against it though. Sure, they don't stay alive as long, but why does that matter if you breed your own mealworms and sustain the cycle? Do it... it's really easy. You have maybe 100 mealworms you start off with ... allow them to pupate and later become a beetle. Keep the worms themselves and beetles in different containers. Eventually the beetles will breed and you'll have super tiny mealworms!
Most cham owners only use mealworms as a snack anyways, so if you only have one or two chams, it really should not be difficult at all to sustain the population. I merely keep two containers, one with worms, and one with beetles (and some pupa about to evolve into beetles), and throw some greens and fruit in every 2 or even 3 days.
Most cham owners only use mealworms as a snack anyways, so if you only have one or two chams, it really should not be difficult at all to sustain the population. I merely keep two containers, one with worms, and one with beetles (and some pupa about to evolve into beetles), and throw some greens and fruit in every 2 or even 3 days.
Breeding waxworm is very easy too, but I'd have to agree that the moths are a better feeding option for them, but the cool thing is you can diapause them (keep worms 10 hrs light, 14 hrs dark, ar cooler temps) and refridgerate the pupae them and take them out to eclose and feed as needed.
trickedoutbiker
Avid Member
so I've got a question to add to this thread: I went out and got me some wax worms for my 6 month old baby panther cham. got them from a store and checked them all... lots of times u will find deads ones - these were a perfect batch. not a single dead one. anyways: i dont feed the wax worms to him that often as they are high in fat. but im trying to get some of the wax worms to turn into moths. i put about 6 in a mason jar with a screen lid. and put a bit of the wooden bedding stuff in the mason jar that comes with them in the plastic tubs from the store. i also put a few drops of water in the mason jar for moisture, then dropped in the 6 wax worms. they been in the jar almost two weeks now and I've not seen any of them start to pupate to turn into a moth. am i doing something wrong? am i supposed to be feeding them, or is there something I'm missing? i had one of them die and turn dark blackish and mushy. took it out, but the other five are doing fine. still moving. what's the best way to make them turn into a moth? I've never done it before, and those are healthier for a cham... so i wanna do that with most of them. i thought you just leave them in a jar at room temp and they are supposed to do their thing? please reply here or PM me someone please.
wodesorel
Established Member
The can die easily with moisture in the container. I'm actually having a ton pupate just by leaving them in the bedding and keeping them warm - around 80-85 degrees. If they're full sized they'll go on their own. If they're still tiny you'll probably have to feed them honey to fatten them up first. I found I have less deaths if I put them in a container with a wider bottom as well - when they were packed in the cup the ones at the bottom always seemed to die.
MissLissa
Avid Member
I breed waxworms 
You have to check with your local agricultural pest department to see if it's legal: waxworms are terrible beehive pests, and there may be regulations on breeding them depending in your area. Waxworms may not pupate if they are kept at too cool a temperature, or if they are not sufficiently grown to the stage where they are able to pupate. Both of these need warm temperatures and proper nutrition to be successful. Here is what I do:
Things I use:
Wheat germ, Oat bran, Bee Pollen, Bees Wax, Liquid Honey (organic), 1 gallon mason jars and lids, cheese cloth, wax paper, patience!
Substrate Food:
I use about one cup of each germ and bran, and about three tablespoons of bee pollen. Then I carefully melt a few big chunks (maybe 3 tablespoons) of beeswax in a double boiler- careful, if the heat is too high it can set on fire! Then start mixing in the honey and bees wax alternately to the dry ingredients until it makes a thick dough. It should be hard enough to knead; you don't want it too sticky, but it should hold together or else it is too dry. Line a pan with wax paper (wax side up) and pour the mixture on to it, patting it down to about a 1" layer. Let it cool and harden for an hour or so.
Setting up the Environment:
Waxmoths like it warm; it's quite cozy in beehives after all. 80°-90°F is ideal. You can do it with lower temperatures, but they will take much longer to pupate and eclose (hatch from their pupae), and it likely will not be worth the time if you don't supplement their heat.
I line the bottom and sides of the jar with wax paper to make cleaning easier later.
Break your dried substrate layer (it will still be a bit sticky) unto several pieces and put it into jar, so that the bottom is full to about 1" deep. You may have some left over; you can freeze this!
Place a few pieces of loosely crumpled wax paper balls into the jar to give the moths somewhere to lay their eggs.
I cut a double layer of cheese cloth large enough to cover the top of the mason jar- enough so that there is about 2" extra all around the lip. Then the outside ring of the mason jar lid gets screwed on. This makes a tight seal that the tiny waxworm babies can't escape- waxworm babies can climb glass- but with plenty of ventilation. Alternately, fine aluminum window screen and a sturdy rubber band works too. Put 20-25 waxworms into the jar, and close the jar. Done!
Maintenance:
I just remove dead worms as I see them, as possible. Once the moths and eclosed (hatched form pupae) and laid their eggs, I prepare a new jar and very carefully transfer the wax paper balls with eggs to the new jar. The old jar has everything else tossed out. The jar is cleaned and sanitized, ready for it's next residents. CAREFUL: these colonies STINK when you switch them over. Gross.
Feeding:
Ideally, do not feed off any of the first generation waxmoths! You need these for breeding. Once they have laid their eggs they will die. Those eggs are your next generation of breeders, and all the waxworm/moth feeders you'll ever want! Once those eggs hatch in their new jar, I wait until they are large enough to start feeding off. I carefully remove 25-30 large worms and place them in a new jar: these are my next breeders and are not fed off. Anything else remaining in the original jar is ready to be food for the herps! You can let them continue their life cycle to moth-form, or you can take them out of their food base and keep them in plain bran or wheat germ: they won't really eat it, but it will prevent them from pupating so quickly. Dropping their temperature to room temp or somewhat less will also slowly down their maturation process and let them "keep" longer, but I would not let them go less than 10F.
Anyways, this is just what I do, and it works a charm I have about 50 jars of waxworms on rotation now.
You have to check with your local agricultural pest department to see if it's legal: waxworms are terrible beehive pests, and there may be regulations on breeding them depending in your area. Waxworms may not pupate if they are kept at too cool a temperature, or if they are not sufficiently grown to the stage where they are able to pupate. Both of these need warm temperatures and proper nutrition to be successful. Here is what I do:Things I use:
Wheat germ, Oat bran, Bee Pollen, Bees Wax, Liquid Honey (organic), 1 gallon mason jars and lids, cheese cloth, wax paper, patience!
Substrate Food:
I use about one cup of each germ and bran, and about three tablespoons of bee pollen. Then I carefully melt a few big chunks (maybe 3 tablespoons) of beeswax in a double boiler- careful, if the heat is too high it can set on fire! Then start mixing in the honey and bees wax alternately to the dry ingredients until it makes a thick dough. It should be hard enough to knead; you don't want it too sticky, but it should hold together or else it is too dry. Line a pan with wax paper (wax side up) and pour the mixture on to it, patting it down to about a 1" layer. Let it cool and harden for an hour or so.
Setting up the Environment:
Waxmoths like it warm; it's quite cozy in beehives after all. 80°-90°F is ideal. You can do it with lower temperatures, but they will take much longer to pupate and eclose (hatch from their pupae), and it likely will not be worth the time if you don't supplement their heat.
I line the bottom and sides of the jar with wax paper to make cleaning easier later.
Break your dried substrate layer (it will still be a bit sticky) unto several pieces and put it into jar, so that the bottom is full to about 1" deep. You may have some left over; you can freeze this!
Place a few pieces of loosely crumpled wax paper balls into the jar to give the moths somewhere to lay their eggs.
I cut a double layer of cheese cloth large enough to cover the top of the mason jar- enough so that there is about 2" extra all around the lip. Then the outside ring of the mason jar lid gets screwed on. This makes a tight seal that the tiny waxworm babies can't escape- waxworm babies can climb glass- but with plenty of ventilation. Alternately, fine aluminum window screen and a sturdy rubber band works too. Put 20-25 waxworms into the jar, and close the jar. Done!
Maintenance:
I just remove dead worms as I see them, as possible. Once the moths and eclosed (hatched form pupae) and laid their eggs, I prepare a new jar and very carefully transfer the wax paper balls with eggs to the new jar. The old jar has everything else tossed out. The jar is cleaned and sanitized, ready for it's next residents. CAREFUL: these colonies STINK when you switch them over. Gross.
Feeding:
Ideally, do not feed off any of the first generation waxmoths! You need these for breeding. Once they have laid their eggs they will die. Those eggs are your next generation of breeders, and all the waxworm/moth feeders you'll ever want! Once those eggs hatch in their new jar, I wait until they are large enough to start feeding off. I carefully remove 25-30 large worms and place them in a new jar: these are my next breeders and are not fed off. Anything else remaining in the original jar is ready to be food for the herps! You can let them continue their life cycle to moth-form, or you can take them out of their food base and keep them in plain bran or wheat germ: they won't really eat it, but it will prevent them from pupating so quickly. Dropping their temperature to room temp or somewhat less will also slowly down their maturation process and let them "keep" longer, but I would not let them go less than 10F.
Anyways, this is just what I do, and it works a charm
I have about 50 jars of waxworms on rotation now.
wodesorel
Established Member
Do you think the wax is necessary? I had found a guide online with instructions saying wheat bran, honey and glycerin, so that's what my first 4 jars are filled with. I'm hoping it works.
Also, do you ever find yourself with escapees? A friend of mine tried it not expecting to get anything, and the worms chewed through the cheesecloth and ended up everywhere. And by everywhere I mean on the ceiling, in the toilet - even in the neighbors apartment to where they called the landlord to complain. I'm a little afraid now. I think my husband would draw the line at that.
Also, do you ever find yourself with escapees? A friend of mine tried it not expecting to get anything, and the worms chewed through the cheesecloth and ended up everywhere. And by everywhere I mean on the ceiling, in the toilet - even in the neighbors apartment to where they called the landlord to complain. I'm a little afraid now. I think my husband would draw the line at that.
MissLissa
Avid Member
Glycerin replaces the wax: I use beeswax because my family has beehives! I've heard glycerin works just fine.
I haven't had them chew through the cheesecoth faster than I can replace it, but I suspect they could if they wanted to. If you're worried, you could use the aluminum window screening: I've used that and it works fine. The cheese cloth I replace as necessary, as it's cheap and cleaning window screen is a pain. My bugs are kept in a special "bug room" with an antechamber, so it's really unlikely they would escape anywhere but another bug container. It's not really something I have to worry about at the moment... those are really good points though!
I haven't had them chew through the cheesecoth faster than I can replace it, but I suspect they could if they wanted to. If you're worried, you could use the aluminum window screening: I've used that and it works fine. The cheese cloth I replace as necessary, as it's cheap and cleaning window screen is a pain. My bugs are kept in a special "bug room" with an antechamber, so it's really unlikely they would escape anywhere but another bug container. It's not really something I have to worry about at the moment... those are really good points though!
trickedoutbiker
Avid Member
thanks. maybe that's why one died. so never add any drops of water; check. I have them at room temperature right now which is about 70-75 degrees. maybe I will stick a small light on em for a good part of the day to keep them warmer so they will hopefully go faster. I got em from a store and they look pretty big and fatty so I wouldn't think I need to add any honey. they look pretty healthy and are very active when warm.
cross your fingers for me!
The Learned Lizard
New Member
You can refrigerate them but we dont see the point. You cant gut load them and the cold they get the slower their metabolism will be.
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